Four Teachers On AI Fears & Opportunities

Hello there.

Welcome to our friends listening.

My name is Lou.

Some of you obviously are familiar with me and I'm now sharing the room with some of my dear friends,

Darius,

Charles and Saqib,

Whom I'm sure many listening and watching are familiar with.

And I'm also hoping for some people listening and watching that you get to meet them and get to experience their wisdom.

End.

Yeah,

So this has been,

We've all been doing this.

We get together for weekly mastermind meetings.

We've been doing this for two and a half,

Maybe three years.

I kind of forget at this point.

And we wanted to do a series where each of us now with video being a part of our work,

Wanting to do a series where we get to host one of the conversations that we would normally host on a weekly basis.

However,

We would bring it into each of our audiences.

So in the past month,

Charles has uploaded one of our conversations.

Darius has uploaded one of our conversations.

Saqib has uploaded one of our conversations.

And so if you like this and you're like,

Well,

I want to hear more of these conversations,

There's three,

Four of them now in the ethersphere.

So go ahead,

Make sure you're checking out Charles,

Saqib and Darius too.

We're going to begin our conversation with a just slowing down together.

Go ahead and.

.

.

We slow down into our bodies and you're welcome to do this in your own space if you're watching this And if you'd like,

You can close your eyes or gaze in one point.

And taking a full Conscious breath in through your nose.

Filling up your belly.

Your ribs,

Your chest.

Holding the breath at the top.

Taking an extra sip of air.

And slow sigh out.

And maybe one more on your own time.

Full in.

Slow out.

And Giving yourself permission here to.

.

.

Not have anything to manage.

Or figure out or achieve.

And seeing if you can open to.

.

.

Receive whatever wisdom Never inspiration.

Wants to come through And feeling into your intention for our conversation,

How you would like to show up.

Or how you are showing up.

And then I offer the mutual intention that whatever.

.

.

Share it here.

That may it find the people that need to hear it,

May it be.

Of service and support.

Their lives.

Our lives and may it ripple beyond what we can see.

And then.

.

.

I'll offer this question or this exploration that I thought we'd begin with while we're still in.

Slow down space just to feel.

What comes up around this topic for you.

Something that we've talked about before but i feel like things are changing so much that i'd be curious to Just explore.

How you're all feeling.

And how you're using or experiencing.

AI.

So just tuning into what comes up.

When I bring that in,

What's that like for you right now?

And then when you're ready Starting to come back.

So it's funny I had.

.

.

Like three things.

Thought we could explore.

And one of them,

Neither of them were AI.

But just before this call,

I was feeling into.

Just my own experience around whenever I read all these things that you could be doing.

I know personally I have.

.

.

Some angst and this fear that I'm missing out or this fear that I'm going to be falling behind and I can't and as someone who's pretty technically adept and able to learn things if i'm feeling this i'm imagining that there are a lot more people feeling things to an nth degree and so i would love to explore with you all whether any of those feelings are present,

What's present for you,

How you are using it,

How you're talking about it with people.

Just because I don't,

Especially even on Inside Timer,

I don't see a lot of AI fear meditation.

I was thinking about creating one because I'm like,

I haven't seen someone do a meditation on this topic.

And I think it's in the consciousness.

Really strong and it's only getting stronger so yeah feel free to take this in any direction but i'd love to hear yes where you're at with it I can jump in.

Uh.

I talk about this a lot with my students.

And there's sometimes some deep.

Resistance to it.

And so I've had some really wonderful conversations.

From people who really embrace it and people who.

.

.

Like they can't stand it.

Um,

And it's allowed me to formulate my own perspective on it.

And my own perspective is.

It's akin to the internet.

You know,

Like circa 1996,

97,

98.

You can remember back then it was like people were,

What is this thing?

We're not sure about this thing.

Will this thing last?

Some people jumped in and,

You know.

Utilized it for terrible things.

You know,

The worst in humanity.

And some people jumped in and.

.

.

Used it for like cheating.

I'm just going to copy-paste this essay or whatever it was.

And some people slowly figured out like,

Oh,

This is an opportunity to connect with more people.

In a deeper,

More meaningful way.

And so that like AI,

What do they call it?

AI slop.

You know,

Like it's so easy to write anything or do anything now.

AI will write you like a gigantic essay and people can tell.

And so for me,

It's like.

The internet has been pivotal,

And I believe AI will be pivotal too,

But the people that do it the sloppy way.

.

.

It's not going to,

You know,

Maybe that's where you need to start.

Perhaps that's where I started initially.

And quickly was like,

This is terrible.

And then the people who can start to see that it has infinite possibility because each one of us will utilize it differently.

And use it as a tool.

To do more of the work that is in their zone of genius.

And to sort of democratize.

And level out the playing field.

Like people have been.

Having junior assistants and junior writers and junior researchers for years.

And now all of us have the ability to have like a staff.

Of $5,

000 to $10,

000 a month of payroll to work on some junior level stuff that allows us to do the deeper,

More meaningful,

More customizable work that we can do.

And so I have been leaning in.

I've been allowing myself to make mistakes.

I've been allowing myself to explore.

I've been allowing myself to course correct as I get new information and realize when I'm like,

What was that?

That was not me at all.

And come back and come back and come back to a place where it feels like I'm doing work that is much more me than it's ever been before.

And it has the assistance of AI within it.

But never to do the work,

Never to do the writing,

Never to do the actual creating,

But rather to assist,

To support,

To coach.

To give perspective,

To review and synthesize large pools of data to help me.

Be the best artist,

Best creator.

Best I can be.

And that is a constant,

Ongoing maintenance.

What's the most.

.

.

Tangible,

Biggest thing that you're consistently using it for,

Where you're like,

Wow,

I would be paying this much money to an assistant,

Or this is helping me go 5x.

Is there something specific that's a consistent thing?

Because I've used it to take.

.

.

My you know read my book and here's all my blog posts and help me like think of where am i taking my next book sort of thing like it's kind of it could take all this a lot of information that's like a fun use that's been it's been helping me explore but that's like a one-off i don't know if you have like something that's consistent that you're using it for that's like wow this is really changing things The truth is I use it like 10 times a day for things,

Everything.

Anything that's like,

You know,

Like we had a family member go through a very serious medical situation.

And to be able to be like,

Read these 10 medical documents.

And synthesize you know like that is the ability for it to synthesize large pools of information and to communicate it in an actionable manner that gives you next steps.

Specific to creativity.

I love when someone has,

You know,

A part of the work I do is I'm like a creativity and consistency and confidence coach and lots of the people that work with me want to write.

And so when someone has enough writing,

Say like 10 to 20 sub stack posts.

You put that into a Google Doc.

I love to write incredibly robust prompts.

These are prompts that I have worked on for maybe like.

.

.

30 40 50 hours and they're very very very long and they essentially make the thing into a coach,

Like become a writing coach and help.

Me and this client identify opportunities,

Gaps,

Creative risks.

So it's able to synthesize and look at a large pool of writing and come back and give them things to do to make their writing more than to be able to see trends.

Like one of the most powerful things I've seen in AI is.

It feels like sometimes you're looking at a mirror.

And the mirror is broken.

And you're trying to find yourself.

You're like,

Who am I?

I can see in that little sliver.

Oh,

That's who I am.

I'm that person.

And with the right,

Sophisticated,

Robust prompting,

AI,

For a moment,

Magically makes that mirror whole and reflects back to you who it believes you are based off of what you've given it and the parameters of the coaching you're looking to get.

And when I've done this with people,

They're like their minds are blown to be able to have something reflect back in a way that's like,

I've always tried to figure this out.

I didn't have the words to describe the work I do.

Oh,

My gosh,

That's what I do.

And so it's able to reflect back and remind them of who they are.

And that is a transformative experience that was not available before.

It's a brilliant prompt.

I'm going to actually writing down to use that because I have it.

Pulled of all my blog posts and I think that's a really Yeah that's really cool.

So it sounds like just overall,

Though,

Darius,

Not that you have a.

.

.

There's not the angst there,

Or maybe that's something that you've.

.

.

Kind of not it's there all the time and i shut i shut it down the internet that's the best way to sell stuff right the intern is constantly telling me you're gonna be out of a job of this and you're gonna this and you're gonna i'm like Get out of here.

That's not going to help me create.

I'm going to spend.

But but there is a truth to that.

Like if you're just using it in the most basic fashion,

There's a lot of really interesting stuff.

And if you're like,

I need to catch up and I need to do what everyone else is doing,

It's going to deplete your energy.

That's ultimately not productive.

It's the internet.

It's here for a while.

Going to be here forever and so it's like find your own version of how it can support you to do the best work you can do in the time you have available that's my personal philosophy Yeah,

I can also jump in to your question about the fear of missing out,

Lou.

I did feel that like fear of missing out.

But then as Darius said also that.

We don't have to do everything.

And I think AI will have a very unique relationship to each one of us.

I think it's important,

Like in my understanding,

It's important to not get overwhelmed by what others are doing and see like how.

It can benefit me in my journey.

So the second question that you asked Darius about,

You know,

Also about like how he uses,

Like I will also share like how I use.

AI and how it has benefited me is that accessing information has become super easy.

I think earlier.

.

.

If I have to have information and read about a certain topic from different viewpoints,

I will have to,

Let's say,

Read five books,

Five different books on that.

But now what I can do is to have an understanding.

For example,

Let's say if I'm taking the topic of active imagination by Carl Jung.

So instead of reading five books by five different Jungian analysts,

That will take a lot of time.

I asked Chad GPD to summarize the five books and give me the analysis,

Kind of give me the viewpoint of different authors on that.

And that kind of makes the work really easy.

It helps me to have access to a broader information in much less time for the workshops,

For programs,

For courses that I'm doing.

So that has been the,

You know,

One of the most beneficial things,

But also having access to like,

You know,

Each wisdom that is our teachings that it's not easy to find on a Google search.

Like if I'm doing Google search and you know how we used to do,

We would do a Google search and like.

10 links will show up on the first page,

Then,

You know,

10 on the other.

And like,

So we have to scroll through all so much of data.

Whereas now I can ask ChatGPT that,

Like,

Tell me the which is,

You know,

Give me the most authentic source of this wisdom and give me the most authentic wisdom on this topic of active imagination.

And also tell me what is the source of this.

And so that has made like easy accessing information and,

You know,

Reflecting on information quite easy.

And on top of that,

You know,

Just as a part of your first question also,

You know,

What I feel is that.

Um,

We can have like a,

It's like,

You know,

Darius said that the time of the internet and it's like a technology,

It's like a tool that we can use to,

You know,

Do good or use to,

We can use that to also drown us into this so much of noise that is out there.

And I feel that if we don't get drowned by that noise and if we don't make AI use us instead of reusing AI,

I think it can be really beneficial because it will take away all those tasks that we.

.

.

That we don't want to do and i'm not talking about maybe today but i think that uh evolution is happening in ai now and you know now you can create ai agents who can do all the work for you who can go on the internet you know book things for you uh make you know like create a shopping cart for you and do this and do that Um,

And I feel that When AI comes in the form of an AJI,

Even a physical robot,

That will also be helpful.

So that will take away all those things that I don't feel like doing,

The chores that I don't feel like doing,

So that I can focus on what I really want to do,

So that I can focus on creativity,

So that I can focus on spirituality.

And in that way,

I feel that it can be really powerful and it will free up a lot of space and time.

Yeah,

I think that's the most valuable thing.

Time is the most valuable thing for me.

And if it can free up time for me,

I think.

That way it is really really beneficial.

Have you seen it?

And I know I want to hear from Charles too,

But like anyone,

Have you seen it?

If you had an experience where you gave your intuition to it because it was easier and you accepted the answer that it gave and then realized like that wasn't my truth,

Nor was that the most helpful.

Like if I didn't use it,

I actually would have been better off.

Example.

I've been doing these weekly sessions and it was someone And we're all biased by this,

What I'm about to say,

But it was someone who's wanting to be on Insight Timer.

They're not on Insight Timer yet.

And they asked AI if it was helpful or they think that they would find their people if they were becoming a teacher on Insight Timer.

And AI's response was Insight Timer is oversaturated and you shouldn't put time to an Insight Timer.

Now,

Again,

We're biased on that metric,

But I think we also would agree.

My question to her was like,

Is it a place that you like to spend time on?

That gives you energy.

You know,

There's different metrics than just taking what you just took AI's answer and said,

This was,

I did this.

And after our call,

She was like,

No,

I actually really want to be on Insight Timer.

So I'm just noticing,

I noticed that in myself where I,

It's easy to ask the question and feel like that's the answer rather than sitting with my own feelings around something.

And I know this is nuanced.

I know I'm coming at it like a,

Yeah,

I think this is why I wanted to explore it with you.

This edge or this moral superiority sometimes that around it of like it's taking something away and yeah it's just interesting You're right.

The mistake we can make is without even consulting our own intuition,

If we just ask the question and follow what AI is doing,

I think that's the mistake.

But what I usually do is I first,

If I have a doubt about something or if I have a question,

I first sit with my own intuition.

I would meditate on it.

I would reflect.

But there are certain things that are still not clear and maybe just a kind of a conversation with AI can be helpful in getting to that answer within myself.

And so,

Like,

For example,

I would say that I am unable to decide whether I want to go to this location or not or travel to this location or not.

Can you help me find that answer within myself?

So what it does is it gives me a set of reflective questions that can bring me to the answer.

So in this case,

AI is not giving me the answer,

But it is helping me to get to the answer within myself.

So I feel in that way it is quite helpful.

That's a good problem.

Could that still be?

I'm noticing I use it all the time.

But I guess my like.

My.

.

.

Immediate response to lose question is more on like it's not necessarily a fear side but it's the Reservation.

Side,

And it is in the space of It can be so easy to.

.

.

I feel like it reduces friction really well and like reduces activation energy to get into like tasks and all these things.

But I can notice how it could easily be a slippery slope into me not thinking for myself and just using that automatically.

Like maybe it's on my mind because I don't know if we're going to do this in the session or not,

Lou,

But you said bring an object like here.

And I noticed not that it would be wrong to do this,

To consider it's like you know just go to chat gpt what do you think would be good ideas for the the object that i bring which could be great and it could be you know helpful to get me to like like what sakub's saying it could be a helpful thing to get me to reflect on it but then i like i also didn't like that um like that I felt like that was the immediate urge as opposed to like something about having less of a tolerance.

For uncertainty and just like internally sitting.

With space and wondering like i've just noticed there's some It's been rewiring my brain a little bit.

To go to it so immediately and again not that that's wrong i was just thinking of like i'm sure people have talked about it like this like maps like maps on your phone it's I don't learn how to drive anywhere anymore,

And I don't need to,

You know,

Unless I was in a space where I didn't.

Have access to internet or something,

But I have access to internet everywhere.

So it doesn't make sense necessarily for me to take up space in my mind to go places.

Because I can easily do that.

But maybe like that could extend.

It could reach its tentacles pretty far in all directions where it's like increasingly dependent upon.

The reduction of any sort of like friction that I feel.

In my mind.

And it might be like an exaggeration,

But.

That's one thing.

So I'll just share the other thing before I forget it is like.

I'm noticing a bit of an addiction to productivity.

That it allows for?

Almost in a way that is like where I could go to social media.

It's like,

That feels obviously bad for me.

And I still do it sometimes,

But it feels obviously like unhealthy to fill the empty space with.

Let me scroll for a little bit,

But I could fill the space with.

What's the question about my finances?

What's the question about my next project?

What's the question about my home or something like these are all helpful.

But I find like I'm wanting to fill.

Empty space more and more frequently with what's some problem that I can like figure out or work on or solve.

And again,

It's not necessarily bad,

But I'm just noticing.

It's like encroaching on my mind,

Maybe a little bit more.

Then I would like it to recently.

Do you guys ever calibrate your AI?

What do you mean?

So it's like.

So when I hear your question,

Lou,

Around like.

Trusting ai's intuition over yours I think this is a big piece that people are missing.

They see AI as these super computers in the,

These like,

You know,

From Hollywood movies and AI is the future and it is,

And they are super computers.

And they make so many mistakes.

But for some reason,

If our AI makes a mistake,

We're like garbage out.

And so whenever I'm getting people started on AI training,

I always start with like,

Imagine you had a rich uncle and your rich uncle left you.

A lot of money.

And the stipulation was that you have to use this money to work on whatever your creative project is.

And so you go and hire a creative agency.

Or a creative coach.

And so the first step is not them giving you information.

The first like two,

Three hours is you giving them information,

Telling them about yourself.

Right.

If you go to a world class creative agency,

They're not going to be like,

Here's some creative pitches for you.

They're going to spend three weeks on discovery.

Right.

They're going to start calibrating by giving you ideas and saying,

Would you like this?

No.

OK,

Good.

Oh,

You like this.

Why do you like this?

Right.

And they set the expectation that we're going to present you 10 ideas.

If two of them have interest to you,

That's a success.

Right.

Because then we're going to understand what those two are telling you or activating within you.

And then we also want to know what are your two that you like the least.

And there's a calibration process.

And there's a way you can empower your,

Again,

Through those like robust prompts to calibrate.

And so instead of people being like,

Give me 10 ideas.

I like so many of these ideas suck.

I find AI thrives off something going wrong and you telling it very directly.

I did not like this because of this,

This and that.

You know,

And so like the I'm not expecting it to be my intuition.

I'm trying to create a relationship like I create with a human and my expectation,

Like imagine I came and said,

You guys,

You better never be wrong.

If you ever give me an idea in our mastermind that's wrong,

Like,

Oh,

Forget it.

How can I ever trust you again?

It's like,

No,

There's three of you.

If one of you gives me one idea that's half decent,

I'm winning.

But we approach AI very,

Very differently.

And so I think the first few weeks should just be you calibrating.

Just be you calibrating.

Any tips on that,

Darius,

How to calibrate?

I'm a student now,

So I want to learn.

I'll send you my prompt and you can take it for a spin because it literally becomes a coach for you.

It'll be like one question at a time.

Here's the principles.

Here's the values.

Don't do this.

Try this experiment with that.

Never talk like this.

Never do these things.

Sorry,

Guys,

That should be off.

Yeah,

I'll send it over.

Try it out.

And one more thing real quick,

Charles.

When you were saying.

.

.

Uh,

Like the map.

Example.

It made me think of if any of us point to someone that we think is successful at the highest level.

There's a good chance they have a team of assistants underneath them.

So they're not even in charge of their schedules.

Forget they're like driving and maps and stuff.

Right.

So like for years,

Successful humans have been doing this.

They're like,

I when I play at my highest zone of genius and joy.

I can do some incredible things,

But then I need someone managing my schedule,

My logistics,

My partnerships,

My this,

My that,

You know?

And so it's like,

That's kind of what we're talking about.

If someone like,

You know,

Even what Sokip was talking about,

If you can clean our homes and dishes,

Then we can spend more time doing the actual creativity.

That we love and are here to do.

I also can relate to your fear,

Charles,

What you said about the AI consuming,

Like,

Because I think it eventually becomes like a habit.

And once it becomes a habit line,

Then it becomes quite difficult.

I have a question for you,

If you don't mind engaging that.

When you do this,

You said you use AI a lot.

And when you are reflecting,

Do you.

.

.

Do you have a method for that in which you make sure that,

Okay,

It's not that AI is giving me answer,

But AI is just being helpful to find me an answer.

And generally I feel that way.

Like I find it very helpful and useful for me.

It's just like.

I'm noticing it.

There's an addictive quality to it.

It's just like,

It's just pulling me in,

I think more than I would like.

And even if it could like take away the friction of all those various things,

I don't know.

So,

Yes,

Like what I will do is the way it's most helpful for me is I'll just go on a.

I like to voice talk to it for like five minutes,

You know,

Just or until it almost expires.

And I've just like it's allowed me.

I consider it kind of like an interactive journal sort of thing is like how it feels for me.

And then I get to a certain point.

I'm like,

Reflect back what you've heard.

Let me know what questions you have and this sort of thing.

So it's really I mainly use it as just like.

Thinking partner.

Kind of thing,

So it can synthesize a bunch of different ideas and thoughts into something.

Simple.

But yeah,

I guess it's the addictive kind of quality or feeling that I have where I'm pulled to it more and more.

And I guess something I'm noticing.

.

.

You can see if this makes sense like if it feels like it might power up for me some notion of like trying to pursue something or get something that I don't already have like it's like a really powerful kind of forward moving energy.

I feel like just doing those various tasks,

Doing the laundry or the dishes.

I might.

Miss something that is always available and always here um i don't have quite articulating it right it's like it's it's it's pulling me into a pursuit of something out there like power i keep going um kind of energy and i realize that I think even,

You know,

What I do in terms of the courses that I create or this,

You know,

Like the book that with the will to do nothing is like.

It's pulling me into something like this.

And I realize.

I think mainly what I'm kind of after is.

.

.

Just here,

Like where I am all the time.

And it's just leaving a little bit less space,

I think.

For me to to feel that so i just like And again,

I use it all the time and it's like incredibly useful.

Valuable but i'm noticing a bit more i'm on sort of the resistance like side just as we're talking about it right now.

I'd be so curious to see if you told AI that it does that and be like.

.

.

What do you think?

How could you help with this?

I'm having a problem with this.

If it would do something about that.

I wonder I'm sure it would.

Charles,

Has it impacted,

And I know you have a full set of clients,

I think,

So maybe no,

But have you noticed it impacting people seeking you out for therapy?

Because they're like,

Well,

I'm using AI more as a therapist,

Which is happening,

Right?

And I see that for sure coaching too.

We're all using it in some ways as coaches,

Right?

To help us be better writers.

And Darius is using it in his coaching,

Of course.

But yeah,

I'm just wondering from you,

Who's seeing more clients and not,

Like,

Do you notice anything as far as impact?

I don't think so.

I don't think so,

So far.

It might be unique.

For my style and approach,

Which is so.

.

.

Like non goal oriented.

And so just processy,

You know,

Like I think mainly what people are.

Getting or looking for a meeting with me is just the experience of being with a human and like the like we don't really know where we're going necessarily or why we're talking,

But it just kind of feels good and right.

I'll often find myself recommending.

Why don't you use AI for that question?

It's like,

You know.

It's so useful for.

.

.

Like life task problem things,

Which tends to not be.

The kind of thing that I do when I'm meeting with clients.

So I don't know.

I don't think it has,

But maybe it might be unique per.

The type of work that I do,

Which is just like.

Processy,

Trying to be as present as possible,

Exploring.

With someone.

From this conversation,

Just to.

.

.

Name.

You know name what's coming through with Darius like Darius is being.

.

.

Darius and that he's for,

You know,

I see you as an eternal optimist and I think I'm a pretty optimistic guy,

But I also know I have a lot of my stuff that comes up and just noticing that my own resistance towards AI being one of them.

And so just appreciating Darius,

Your optimism and positivity because it's always,

You know,

Just something that I value having in my life.

And just to name,

Because we spend a lot of time for people that are listening.

Like we spend a lot of time with each other and just,

Just to love on you all.

Cause like the thing,

The gifts that I see in each of you.

Charles,

One of the biggest ones for you is.

.

.

Is I don't never met someone who is so nonjudgmental,

Like so genuinely,

Like the feeling I get with you is I could tell you anything.

And like,

There's a sense that you're going to be just curious about it.

Like there's like a genuine,

Like you don't have like a,

Yeah,

Like just nonjudgmental supportive.

It's just an interesting feeling that more than anyone in my life,

Like you,

You admit.

And then Sakib,

Something I love about you is just your spontaneity to be like,

I'm going on this adventure.

I'm going on this journey or I'm leaving here or I'm coming back.

And just like the willingness to be in flow and listening and taking those like big leaps.

So just wanting to,

Yeah,

Just wanting to love on you all because some of you might not know Charles,

Darius and Sakib.

Yeah.

And what's cool about being on video,

Something I heard in the AI world is.

.

.

Which is interesting,

Video now,

Which is like a plug for doing more video content,

Is for now,

It might change,

But for now,

It's one of the clearest mediums where people don't have to have that mindset around,

Is this real or not?

Like,

Is this writing,

Rewriting is the most blatant.

Now it's taken the biggest hit with like,

Is this real sort of question?

I think.

.

.

Audio,

It could be there for sure.

YouTube audio,

When I think of like listening to audio online,

For sure,

You can tell is like,

Is this just like an AI music sort of thing?

Like,

Is it real?

But right now,

Video is one of those things where it's like,

Oh,

This is definitely this person right now.

Now that obviously can change.

But since we have video,

Part of me wanting to ask you all to bring something meaningful is to show it and to use video in that way.

So Charles,

Since you named it,

What did ChatGPT tell you to bring?

I didn't ask.

I noticed the urge,

I was like no,

No,

Don't do that.

Um,

I should share?

You want me to share?

So it was even just an interesting process.

Like I didn't want to contrive it too much and I didn't want to do what might feel performative.

In some way,

Uh,

Or like,

This is a good one because it has the certain meaning or something like that.

Look at how cool of a medit,

Deep of a meditator I am.

Like I'm so,

Yeah,

Yeah.

So I just,

I gave myself like a couple different options.

Um,

And maybe like the one that is feeling.

Least contrived is this one.

That's my book.

And.

.

.

You want me to say something about it or like,

This is just the one.

I mean,

If you wrote a book,

I can,

I can assume what's meaningful to you about it.

And you've,

You've talked about the meaning behind it before,

But yeah,

I guess to anyone who's.

Just hearing you for the first time to share what's meaningful about this book.

And it might change too.

Like maybe it's something new is meaningful about it right now.

Yeah,

I think that maybe the reason it's a meaningful object to me,

Just like per your question,

I don't need to share about what it's about.

It's just like.

This was a real.

.

.

Turning point or like kind of watershed moment for me creatively to take.

To take on the challenge.

To bring a really big thing for me anyways,

Like into.

Tangible reality.

And I just remember It was like a.

.

.

Probably all told like a four or five year process to.

To write and complete this.

And I just remember like throughout the writing process,

Every once in a while,

Having a vision of like,

Wow,

Someday this is going to like,

I'll have it in my hands.

And just that feeling like a really cool thing that at some time,

Like there will be a day when it's actually a book,

But it felt,

I remember it feeling so far away.

Like I can't imagine how that's actually,

I'm actually going to get there,

But I know that I will.

And I don't know when that will be,

But I just remember like looking and being like,

That would be so cool.

And I haven't held it and looked at it and felt it.

In a while.

So it's just kind of nice to remember that.

And then like,

I have this thing and I know that it is real and like,

And I felt and feel good about it.

Even now,

This was in 2022 that I wrote this and I can go back and I still feel good about it.

Like it's,

It feels like I captured.

The thing as best as I could.

That I wanted to and like have it as a tangible thing that I can have for the rest of my life.

So yeah,

That was the one that stood out.

I also just,

Yeah,

I like just like feeling it.

It has like the matte.

Finish on it.

It's just something so nice to hold it tangibly.

Yeah,

That's the one that I picked.

Beautiful.

You want us to keep going?

Can I just see the book?

I've never seen the book.

Oh sure.

I've heard about this book.

I want to see the book.

Wow,

Your baby's beautiful.

And I did some of the drawings and my mom did some of the drawings.

Your mom did the drawings.

So that's kind of special.

Yeah.

Are you the sweetest man in the world right now?

Yeah.

That's adorable.

Yeah,

It was cool to have different visions and here's kind of a fun.

.

.

I don't know if you can see it or not.

It's like a theater stage.

There's this this guy kind of like in a meditative posture and he's looking.

There's a glass of water on the stage and there are these trains emerging out of the glass of water.

Um,

It's got some real God note vibes.

Yeah.

Very cool.

Darius,

Do you want to go?

Sure.

I got a little.

.

.

Surprised.

When I wanted to,

I was like,

Oh yeah,

Because it normally sits right here on my desk.

But we were in the middle of a move and I literally packed the thing I wanted to show.

On Saturday or Sunday,

Yesterday.

The good news is.

.

.

It's a coin.

It's a very special coin to me.

The good news is I have a smaller version of that coin that I wear around my neck all the time.

So I was like,

All right,

I got backups.

Have I ever showed you guys this?

I don't think you can see it on the screen Uh,

It's a pendant.

It's a coin.

It's got a skull in it.

It's got a very famous stoic saying on it.

Momentum more.

Yes,

Yes.

We've never talked about that.

On one side it says,

I know the saying,

But I never heard you.

I didn't know you had a stoic pendant.

No.

Yeah.

On the other side,

It says you could leave life right now,

Which is a loose translation of what momento more means.

Uh.

.

.

And it has tremendous meaning for me.

I wear it around my neck 24-7.

It's like the one thing I almost never take off unless I'm on Lou's Insight Timer podcast here.

I'm not going to try to put it on while on video.

Did you say you could live life right now?

You could live life right now.

You could leave life right now.

It's also translated to you must remember,

You must die.

Okay.

Remember you must die.

Which I like that translation a bit more.

And for some people,

It's like,

Whoa,

That's morbid.

Why are you talking about death?

And for some people,

I found it's like a 50-50 split.

Talking about death is such a driving,

Activating,

Awakening.

Exercise.

I am obviously a part of the latter.

I had a bigger coin of it that I used to keep in my pocket,

But then I kind of just put it on my desk and I stare at the skull and my meditations and I stare at the skull.

On my sessions,

And it's just.

.

.

Of remembering that literally at any moment.

You could die.

You could die.

You don't know when last breath will find you,

Whether it's like 50 years from now or 50 minutes from now.

And there's something,

It's like literally one of the things I stare at.

Right before I go into a meditation,

I found I've got a I got a piece of paper that says,

Remember,

You must die.

And on the other side,

On another piece of paper here,

It says,

Remember that you are alive.

And so those are two like fun,

Like remember that today you are alive.

I find the pair work really well to activate me and let things that don't matter fall off and come back to.

.

.

You know,

Like,

What am I going to do with today?

What am I going to do with this fresh canvas?

And that's a deeply meaningful concept and object for me.

Was there a time that came into your life that was significant or has it just always been part of your philosophy?

No,

It came into my life when my aunt got cancer.

And I sort of became obsessed with this concept of like last breath.

For some reason it like personified.

And it wasn't a scary Grim Reaper character.

It was this really handsome dude,

Actually.

That would just knock on your door and be like,

Hey,

What's happening?

And he's so friendly and warm.

It almost felt like an angel.

And he was just like,

It's time to go.

And I was like,

That's wild.

Like last breath can find me at any time and take my camera and take my computer and take.

All the tools I have in which to create and be like,

That's it.

You don't get no more photos.

You don't get no more words.

You don't get no more.

Interactions and i just found that incredibly enlivening Because it was like,

I don't know when he's going to catch me.

Last breath is going to show up and you literally get one breath and then that's it.

And so until that day,

I'm going to create.

As much as I can and put as many photos and conversations and experiences and meditations and words out into the world as I can.

Powerful.

It just reminds me of what you We were talking about meditation.

Last time,

And you were talking about,

Like.

.

.

The gauge of a meditation.

Bringing the listener and maybe yourself to down toward the heart,

You know,

Versus as opposed to in the head.

I feel like with something like that.

Yeah,

The key is like to feel it.

Uh,

Cause you people know that and you can say it and you're like,

Yeah,

I know.

But like,

I suppose that's what that practice is or having the reminders of it,

Like to actually feel the reality of that is so different.

Did I ever tell you about the practice I had,

The last breath practice?

In your retirement?

So before I knew what breathwork was,

When my aunt got sick,

When I got obsessed with last breath,

After my meditation,

I would just lay on the mat.

And I would practice last breath.

I don't know where I got this in my head,

But I would take three deep breaths.

And on the third breath,

Like really,

Really,

Really,

Really deep breaths,

Big exhales.

And on the third breath,

I would exhale.

And hold for as long as possible,

Like way past comfort zone.

And I would imagine I was.

.

.

Embodying the moment my human got his last breath And I would hold and hold and hold and hold and hold and hold and hold.

And I did it for probably like 100 days straight.

And in the like almost psychedelic experience,

I would try to in my last moment,

I would I felt like I would teleport from here to last breath.

And every time it was a little different place,

It was like different dimensions.

And in that last moment,

As I take my last breath,

I would scan to see.

If someone was holding my hand.

Like,

Am I leaving this plane by myself or am I surrounded by someone that loves me?

And I would try to see and capture as much as I can about that moment to bring it back to this moment.

And then you'd imagine just me lying down.

Holy cow.

Holy cow.

I'm here.

I'm still here.

I'm still here.

I'm still here.

Get my camera,

Get my stuff.

Let's go take some photos.

It was like fully embodied.

Yeah,

It was wild.

I could go.

Yeah,

Thank you for sharing that,

Darius Charles.

I think death,

Like really,

For me,

Death became like a very important topic as I started exploring the Tibetan book of the death.

And as you said,

Like,

It's quite empowering,

Actually,

And like empowering in a very strong way in the sense that you actually start like valuing life so much more when you meditate on death.

Yeah,

That's a really powerful effect of that.

So,

Well,

I'll share my object.

And first of all,

Yeah,

Thank you,

Lou,

For those kind words.

And,

You know,

They touched my heart.

So thank you for sharing how you feel about us,

All of us.

So my object is this.

It's a coaster.

With the wolf and I got it from Whistler in Canada.

So.

.

.

The story behind this is that I had a.

.

.

Last year I went to Turkey and I had a series of dreams in which I was a wolf and then I was being attacked a wolf and I was attacking a wolf.

So these series of dreams I had.

And uh then after my turkey trip i um you know i went to brissler and um I saw this coaster and it had this wolf.

You know this will work on it.

And immediately I was drawn to it because the wolf that I saw in my dream,

The eyes,

I don't know if you can see,

But the eyes are like greenish in this.

And uh.

.

.

The wolf that I saw in my dream had these greenish eyes.

And so it was kind of a synchronicity to see this wolf in that shop in Whistler.

Then I realized after doing some work and inner work,

I realized that this is what Carl Jung calls my shadow.

And it is,

I think,

My shadow in majorly two ways.

One is definitely that part of me that is aggressive.

And that part of me which can use anger,

Which can use aggression to maybe draw healthy boundaries or maybe to defend myself.

That actually has helped me in many like integrating that has helped me in many circumstances when I felt that,

You know,

That.

I need to protect my boundaries and I need to also defend myself.

So that was one.

The other one was I was reading this book by Herman Hesse.

I started reading,

You know,

I became very fascinated with this idea of the wolf and I started reading this book by Herman Hesse,

The Steppenwolf.

And although I haven't completed it yet,

This book is about the wolf of the steppies who basically goes on its own and lives a very isolated life and also a life which goes against the society.

So this steppenwolf actually goes against the pack of wolves and creates his own life in many ways.

So this is kind of a rebel archetype in which you create your own life follow just the norms of the society and so this was uh i could relate to it a lot and again like this is kind of like a very strong archetype that has been in my life of this steppenwolf and the rebel and because you know the things i've done in the past especially 10 years are more like rebellious in in that sense and so yeah this is a very strong you know,

Kind of archetype and shadow for me.

And that's why it is very close to me and it stays with me.

Just a question,

Is that something like.

.

.

As it relates to the shadow.

To overcome in some way or is it like to to embody like you are the wolf,

Like in some ways or at some times,

If that makes sense.

Yeah,

It's more towards onboarding.

Because I feel that this wolf showed up because it is not at all integrated.

When situations arise,

Let's say if there is a confrontation or a conflict,

I would find myself running away from that situation,

Avoiding that situation.

So embodying this wolf archetype has helped me to not have a fear of confrontation or not have a fear of conflict and allow myself to use some healthy aggression or healthy anger express what I need or express my needs.

That's awesome.

That's great soccer.

Yeah.

Thanks.

That's cool to learn that about you.

I guess I'll go.

And I have my book.

No,

I'm just kidding.

I wasn't going to use my book.

But I do know that feeling of the first time getting it.

I slept with my book the first night after getting my proof copy and just how much work that was.

And yeah,

Still my baby.

So I know that feeling and it is cool.

Yeah,

It is cool to look back now.

For me,

It's been 2017.

So almost.

Past nine years and to still look at it and be like,

Yo,

This is legit.

Like I'm,

I wouldn't write like,

You know,

I've grown a lot since that time,

But this is still really valuable.

So yeah,

Shout outs to people writing a book.

Luke,

Can I see your book too?

Yeah.

Oh snap.

Beautiful.

My mom did not make the designs.

And it's an audio book too,

Right?

Did Charles' mom make the designs?

Charles' mom did them.

Yes.

Okay.

Yeah,

I do have it on Audible,

Too.

It's an audiobook,

Which was its own separate process that I didn't release until like.

.

.

Seven years later.

Anyway,

So my actual object was actually a recent object,

But like a deeper meaning.

And I'll show two objects that represent it.

There's this sticker of a honeybee.

And.

.

.

So the honeybee has been really significant in my life at certain times where it's came up at my first spiritual experience of like this bee that was right by me when I made this decision to quit drinking.

And I had this big ecstatic opening.

And then a few days later,

Same thing.

The bee was just sitting on my left knee and just felt this disconnection with the bee.

And it's been just an interesting connection ever since that time.

It was a big part of my wedding.

Ceremony,

The experience with the bee,

And then just.

.

.

A month or two ago,

I'm on a session with a new client and there's just a lot of connection with this client.

Like it really feels like really good.

And there's a lot of synchronicity.

I don't want to go into her story and stuff like that.

But she talks about,

At the end of our session,

This connection to the honeybee and how deeply she has this connection.

And then while we're on the session,

I do,

Well,

You'll never believe this.

We've already been establishing this connection and some synchronicity.

And I go like this.

And I show her that the bee that I have.

Right behind me and she's like oh my gosh this is crazy and that night I go to my men's group in town and one of the men.

.

.

He had known that I was into the bee,

But like randomly,

This is just a super random.

This night,

He's like,

Hey,

Lou,

I have a gift for you.

And he gives me.

Two of these.

He gives me two of these stickers on the same day that that happened with this client.

And so I ended up sending her one as like a gift and like a connection for our,

You know,

For our coaching together,

Which was really,

Really,

Really sweet.

And yeah,

This bee is just for me.

Just a guide and.

.

.

Significant.

There's not a tangible,

This means this,

This,

This,

And this,

But it's been there at really,

Really huge transitional moments in my life.

Maybe I'm in that right now,

Too.

It's here at this stage,

Too.

Yeah,

Guys,

Thanks for.

.

.

Yeah,

Thanks for bringing something in.

Have you ever Googled like what is the spiritual significance of a honeybee?

I probably have.

Actually,

My friend's funny.

My friend has like the shamanic way of the bee.

It's like a book.

And so there's definitely deeper threads.

But I don't.

It's not front and center for the relationship of the bee to me.

I've kind of left it more just like this intuitive connection that I have with it rather than finding out,

Trying to figure it out from the outside,

If that makes sense.

But now I want to Google it and check it out.

But like so intuitively,

What does it mean for you?

Like,

Does it signify?

Anything or is it just like a nice feeling?

Mm-hmm.

It more feels like a guide than anything,

Like,

Again,

Rather than it's signifying something like it's been it's it's supporting me in some way.

And I mean,

I guess you could take the actual way that bees support the world for sure.

And there is this concept of of being in honey in like a spiritual way of this this sense of a spiritual experience that is very viscous and sweet.

And so I've.

Kind of explore that aspect of it,

But more so it's just been a meaningful connection showing up at very big times in my life.

Could you share?

I know I think we're probably close to the end of time.

Could you share how it was part of your wedding ceremony?

Yeah,

It was.

.

.

So my wife,

Kind of her main,

I guess,

Connection was like the Rose and working with the Rose.

And.

.

.

As part of.

Our actual ceremony,

Our ceremonial list,

Which is a whole.

.

.

Other story on its own.

But kind of one of the culminations of it was was we both drank.

From this cup which could have been something i brought but we both drank from this cup rose water and honey mixed together and like each like took a sip of it um and so something that we called in to our ceremony to to like be a part of and it's something just that our like our ceremonious was aware that we had connection to going up so it comes out of this um this kind of animistic worldview.

There's a organization called Animus Valley Institute by Bill Plotkin,

And his work has had an influence on both of our lives.

He runs vision quests and just a lot of spirituality through connecting with nature and initiation through being out in nature in different ways.

And,

You know,

I came to my own nature experiences on my own.

Continuing that relational aspect with the world has been really meaningful to both of our paths.

Alright,

So.

.

.

We are over an hour,

So I failed on can we keep it to an hour,

But just any.

.

.

Any last words for our time,

Friends?

Anything that you want to reflect on or needs to be said?

I would just like to thank you,

Lou,

For doing this practice.

I think it was quite unique and powerful bringing these objects,

Kind of totems,

To us.

And I feel like how the object This kind of makes me value a little bit of materialism here because I don't usually buy a lot of stuff.

But buying something like this meaningful has been helpful and also bringing it here in the session that how can,

You know,

And it is powerful that how can like just an object become like a great source of kind of a self-discovery,

Like a simple thing like,

You know,

Charles's book.

Is kind of so deeply connected to him.

And,

You know,

Each of our objects are so,

You know,

Deeply connected to us.

And,

You know,

Darius's coin and your bee and this wolf.

I think these objects can really bring something in and make us reflect on something deeper and bring something from inward.

And so I love this practice.

So just,

Yeah,

I want to thank you for that.

Thanks for that.

Yeah,

It's cool to also learn different things about each of you through that.

Yeah,

That was really cool.

That's kind of like a way to access.

The unconscious by having a task like that that we might not have otherwise.

Shared certain things or maybe wouldn't have known where it was going to go,

But to have something.

It's like an unlocking of.

.

.

Something that maybe you didn't know was there.

I thought it was a cool sort of projective.

It's almost like a projective test in a way.

It's not like a right answer or a right object,

But it's a way of accessing.

Something that you probably wouldn't have gotten to um if not for having a thing like that to start with so it's really cool You know what would be trippy?

If all of us asked.

AI,

What we should have brought,

And all four of us get what we actually brought as the answer.

That would be a mic drop for AI moment.

Yeah.

Unsubscribe.

Delete.

I'm out.

I'm glad I was thinking of a way to tie AI as a bow on this.

And Darius,

You beat me to it.

So that's perfect.

Perfect way to call back the master speaker and comedian.

Darius,

Thank you for that.

I got you.

All right,

Friends.

So if you're newer to Darius Charles and Saqib on Insight Timer,

Go check out their work.

Charles has three flagship courses that are monumental on Inside Timer that you have to check them out.

It's like watching Titanic.

You have to have seen that movie.

So go check his stuff out.

Darius is prolific.

He's been publishing every week for six years.

So he has a ton,

A ton of meditations and you hear this guy's voice.

You love meditating with him.

Saqib was the greatest of all time on the Insight Timer live events.

Charles is starting to step into that.

But Saqib's got a lot of fun,

Esoteric,

Mystical content and courses.

And so,

Yeah,

Go check out some of these guys and their GIFs.

And I look forward to chatting.

And again,

If you want to hear these conversations led by each one of them,

Go check out those on their profiles.

And we'll see you all again very soon.

Thanks,

Lou.