At The Helm: A Conversation About Codependency

Imagine this,

It's a Saturday morning,

You have company coming over and so there's work to be done around the house.

And when your partner wakes up,

The first thing they share with you is that they're just not in a great mood and your anxious parts start to try to take hold of the wheel.

Welcome to At The Helm with Jesse and Carolyn.

Let's talk about how we navigated this tricky situation.

So I am the partner in question.

I did wake up on that Saturday morning,

And for whatever reason,

I just wasn't feeling it.

I was grouchy,

I was grumpy,

I wanted to stay home and work on myself and do self-care things and figure out what was going on with me.

But I knew that we had plans,

That we had company.

And this had been on the calendar.

And I needed to find a way to take care of my parts that day.

So that we could have a good day with our friends.

And so I did the responsible thing.

And I immediately told my partner that I had woken up on the wrong side of the bed,

That I wasn't feeling like myself.

But I knew there were things to get done,

And I was going to get them done.

And when our guests arrived,

I would be myself.

I would be entertaining.

I would be gregarious.

I always rise to the occasion when we have people over to entertain.

And so unfortunately,

For me,

That is a big kind of trigger of internal anxiety.

And long story short,

We'll kind of skip to the end.

The thing that I realized towards kind of the end of our morning,

Was that really what was taking over was codependency.

So when Jesse shared that he kind of just wasn't feeling well,

Wasn't feeling up to it really wanted to do these things for himself.

Immediately I felt this like tightness,

You know,

And I wanted to control that for him.

I wanted to fix that,

Change that for him.

And so I offered up to him,

You know,

We can always cancel if you're just not feeling up to it today.

And to which he said,

No,

Like I said,

Like,

I'll get the things done.

I'll be my normal self by the time they get here.

I'm just wishing that I had space to do more of this kind of self care practice.

And again,

Like now looking back at it,

I recognize that that was really rubbing up against that codependent part of myself.

That really was just uncomfortable with the fact that he wasn't feeling perfect,

Wasn't perfectly willing to,

You know,

Kind of jump in the day and that there were other things that he wanted to get done.

And whenever that part shows up,

I tend to kind of regress into that kind of younger part of myself,

Like we talked about in that in our first episode.

And I tend to try to not want to deal with that part either,

Because I know that it's not logical.

I know that it's more kind of an emotional experience that I'm having,

And it's really not happening.

But I didn't recognize that immediately.

Usually it takes me a little bit of time to kind of notice that that's happening.

And so Jesse goes out to start working on the yard work.

Eventually,

I follow him out after I've cleaned the inside of the house.

I had a little bit of weeding to get done and I approached him and said,

You know,

Because I've just been sort of thinking about this in my mind,

Sort of circling around it,

And I just suggested,

Like,

Why don't we just cancel?

You're not in a good mood.

I could tell he just,

Like,

Wasn't feeling great.

And so I tried to have that conversation with him about that.

And what I really needed in that moment was for him to tell me,

Everything's going to be totally fine.

Look,

I'm in a great mood.

I'm really looking forward to this.

That would have really set that codependent part of myself at ease.

But I was not in a great mood,

And I am authentic,

And I was not in any mood to placate Carolyn's younger parts at that moment.

I was taking care of business and taking care of my parts.

And so I very firmly,

But gently and kindly,

Told her that everything was going to be okay and that I was working on my stuff and that she needed to go take care of herself.

And that the danger was that if she did not take care of her parts before our friend showed up.

That they were very likely to come out when our friends are here.

And alcohol is dissolving that wall that protects those parts and keeps them from coming out and interacting with other adults.

And I told her very clearly that if those parts come out while our friends are here and start poking at me and trying to get my parts to come out and play with them,

That we were going to have a bad time.

And that again,

So codependency was kind of already driving the bus.

And so when I hear from Jesse,

Anything that kind of implies that I'm not being perfect.

And again,

Not that he intended that.

And not that it makes sense that that's what's happening,

But that's what I hear.

It's like,

Well,

If you get your stuff together,

Then everything's gonna be okay.

And you know what,

If you don't get your stuff together,

Today's gonna devolve into a mess.

Immediately,

I mean,

I probably can't even count the number of parts that kind of get activated by that to sort of show up and try to protect codependency or try to kind of deal with that in the moment.

So Jesse says that to me and then goes to continue doing yard work I walk away and kind of huff and normally in the past.

I probably would have turned around and made another snide comment.

I would have made some sort of comment about like,

Well,

I guess we might as well just cancel then since I can't get myself together.

Because there is a very young part of me that's feeling like,

Well,

See,

You can't do anything right.

You're not perfect.

And so all of that was kind of coming up for me in the moment.

And the thing that I'm super proud of,

And this is something that I encourage my clients to do,

And I know it's going to sound so simple,

Is I just walked away.

You know,

There's been times in the past where I've literally kind of white knuckled it and just walked away,

The dogs for a walk or done something like that.

There's also been times where I've taken the dogs for a walk and the whole time I'm thinking of the thing I should say or want to say and I've turned back and said it.

And we've gotten into a gigantic fight.

So this is an opportunity to recognize what path are we going down here?

You know,

If that part of me that like huffed and wanted to be really defensive really took the wheel,

I could have turned around and gotten us into a huge fight.

But we've been through that enough times that I'm able to recognize that when it happens.

I know what I'm feeling inside and I start to begin to recognize the pattern of thought.

A lot of times for me,

That includes things like very exaggerated statements.

Well,

Jesse always or he never or I by always or never,

Those kinds of things.

So paying attention to how you're thinking,

What we call cognitive distortions or thinking traps in kind of the therapy world,

That black or white,

All or nothing thinking is very prevalent for me when I start getting into this place,

Personalizing,

Jumping to conclusions,

All of those kinds of things.

So beginning to recognize that pattern.

Anytime I'm folding laundry or doing dishes and I start telling myself,

Well,

Jessie never does the dishes,

Well,

That's not true,

Right?

Jesse does the dishes.

And like I always say,

I never deal in absolutes.

And so it's something really important to pay attention to,

Is how you're thinking,

How you're feeling,

And starting to get to know those patterns.

Like I said,

We have gotten into many,

Many fights,

You know,

With the same pattern happening,

The codependent part of me gets activated,

It tries to take care of Jesse tries to control the situation so that I no longer feel that discomfort.

And Jesse very directly says,

I can take care of myself,

I will be just fine.

But I'm not taking care of myself.

I'm not taking care of that codependent part of me that now feels uncomfortable.

I'm not feeling taking care of that anxious part of me.

The part that's kind of hyper vigilantly watching our relationship,

Watching his mood,

Paying attention to all of that,

Which is something that is really,

Really common with neurodivergence,

With codependency.

If you grew up in a household with any kind of like emotional ability,

Like emotions just either being,

You know,

Totally secret or just like,

You know,

Kind of exploding everywhere all the time,

We very often wind up really vigilant around other people's emotions.

Did anybody else notice Carolyn bringing up the word perfect several times?

For some reason there's a part of her that thinks that she needs to be perfect and flawless to be acceptable and loved.

And so the part of me that I am really proud of,

So I wasn't perfect,

I didn't handle that perfectly,

And I really could have totally derailed the day had I let that part start squawking right in that moment.

If I'd let that part talk,

I probably could have totally ruined the day.

However.

And I also would have been a part of that because myself,

My higher self,

Was out of patience,

Was dealing with my parts that were wanting attention,

And not feeling good at that time and that was all my capacity was to take care of my parts and not have a meltdown.

So I didn't have the capacity to take care of her or to be super patient and compassionate if she came after me looking to start something.

And again,

That's another part of me that,

You know,

That's another experience that I struggle with when Jesse does start to lose patience.

Again,

I get in that mindset of like,

See,

Like,

You're just not good enough,

You're not perfect,

All of those things start talking to me in those moments.

And so despite the fact that I recognize that that's incredibly healthy for my partner to say,

Hey,

Didn't wake up feeling great this morning,

I'm going to have to spend a lot of my energy taking care of my stuff and kind of getting myself back on track.

Almost immediately,

I'm asking him to take care of me.

And so that's,

That's another thing to pay attention to in our relationships,

Is that sometimes our partner is not in a place where they can take care of,

Reassure,

Do those things.

And we have to build that muscle within ourselves to be able to do that for ourselves.

I know logically,

That at the other end of this,

Our friends are going to show up,

Jesse is going to be kind of back in that sort of host,

You know,

Engaging mode,

And everything's going to be just fine.

Of me that knew that it was less than ideal for him.

And so I was,

Like I said,

Really trying to control that,

Wanted to take care of him,

Despite Jesse saying,

I've got it,

I'm taking care of myself.

So just beginning to really notice that about ourselves can be really important.

And we tend to look at the parts,

I refer to them as our children,

Like we each brought our own metaphorical children into the relationship,

The younger parts of us that have not resolved their issues,

That have not healed from whatever they went through to get them into those patterns and into those loops of negative behavior and negative thoughts and unhelpful thoughts.

And so I like to say that,

Ideally,

You have two well-adjusted,

Grounded parents in the room,

And they are taking care of their own children and their stepchildren that were brought into the relationship with their partner.

But at the very minimum,

You have to have at least one responsible,

Grounded adult in the room who's looking after all of the parts,

All of the children.

When we get in trouble is when our parts come out and I can't handle my parts and she can't handle her parts and then we don't have enough patience for each other's parts.

And then it becomes,

Well,

We have unruly teenagers in the house and they're ruining our lives.

And I'm sure many of you are familiar,

And we have also had experiences like that.

And so the moment that I really was super proud of myself,

And I hope that,

You know,

For any of you who are beginning to do this work and really notice these things,

That you really give yourself a pat on the back when you recognize,

What was the part that set the wheel?

I knew all morning.

I wasn't quite right.

Like I said,

You know,

I didn't lash out at Jesse and really try to provoke a fight,

But there was a lot,

A big part of me that wanted to.

And so eventually I realized who was driving,

You know,

The bus,

Who was at the helm,

And it was codependency.

And I went,

Oh,

Get it now.

Jesse woke up.

He's not feeling well.

I want to control that for him.

I want to take care of him so that I don't feel the discomfort that I'm asking him to do yard work,

You know,

Because despite the fact that we both own this house together,

We both care for this house together.

In my mind at that moment,

I said,

Well,

He just wanted to have a morning,

An easy morning to take care of himself.

And you're making him do these things.

You're making him,

You know,

Be ready for guests to come over.

And so codependency got really flared up.

I finally recognized that.

And Jesse was out in our living room and I he had just finished yard work.

And I came up to him and I said,

You know,

I'm sorry,

That was that was codependency.

I recognize that you just weren't feeling great this morning.

And codependency really took over because I felt guilty that you needed to do all these things,

Quote unquote,

For me.

And in that moment,

I saw Jesse's face just like totally change.

And he lightened up and was able to connect with me because I think he saw that who we refer to as Mrs.

Watkins,

Kind of the adult self version of me,

Finally was back at the helm.

So no longer was he dealing with one of those unruly teenagers.

And in that moment where I saw his face change,

And like I said,

I was really like kind of proud of myself for recognizing that.

All of a sudden,

Everything kind of shifted for us.

And we just were able to kind of go back into the mode of getting ready.

The house was clean and ready to go.

We just needed to kind of get ourselves ready to go.

And everything shifted from there.

And we actually had a really lovely time with our friends who came over and just really had a great day that we that we really needed together.

Yeah,

And I was also very proud of Carolyn in that moment.

I had to maintain my boundaries and my barrier.

I had my shield up intentionally.

I was not going to deal with the part of her that was struggling in that moment.

I didn't have the capacity.

I knew that it was her responsibility,

It was Mrs.

Wadkins' responsibility to take care of those parts and listen to them.

That was probably one of the most important things was to stop,

Slow down,

Listen to what is actually going on inside.

And hearing the story that is being written internally by those parts,

And it's interesting to note that those parts often distort reality.

Everybody's reality is different even though reality is reality.

It's our perspective.

In how we experience reality that makes it true for us.

We can have two different experiences with the same reality and both are true.

So Carolyn was writing a story.

There was a part of her that was writing a story.

That she had put these things on me and that it was her fault that she was making me do that.

But.

.

.

That wasn't actually true.

It was just part of my responsibility.

There was like a nugget of truth in there.

I did have responsibility.

She did schedule this with our friends technically,

So I guess you could say that she was responsible.

But in reality,

It was my responsibility.

We agreed on this together.

She didn't have to have that perspective.

And that's what was putting added pressure on her and making her feel worse about the situation.

So that might be kind of a great thing to keep in mind with your partner.

So like I said,

Cognitive distortions or thinking traps,

You know,

However you want to refer to it.

So what Jesse is talking about with that part of me just writing that story,

Cognitive distortions are protective.

The human brain would much rather that things be black or white.

It's much easier.

Trying to operate in this gray area is really difficult.

And we're seeing that in our country right now with politics.

It's really difficult to walk a pretty fine line in the gray area.

It's much easier for things to be right or wrong,

Black or white.

And so anytime you start noticing those cognitive distortions,

That's something to get familiar with in your own mind.

And something that I encourage my clients,

You know,

If you're talking with your partner,

Suddenly they're looking at you like they have no idea what's going on.

They don't know what's happening This doesn't feel like it lines up with where we're at right now That's a great indication that maybe you're telling yourself a story You might even be interacting with something that happened in the past like for me with like,

You know a former partner or something like that Something that Jesse just did might have triggered that and now I'm interacting with him as if he's not even my husband You know,

He's someone from the past maybe like a parent or maybe like a parent.

Absolutely So that's a great indicator for either,

You know,

Jesse or myself.

So if I start noticing that he is just like not acting like himself,

Not responding to me like he normally does,

Number one,

I've learned with him that tuning into like where's his patience level at is really important.

And number two,

Like I said,

It may just be that I need to slow down and kind of check in with how I'm thinking,

How I'm talking to myself.

And I guess for me,

You know,

That idea of slowing down,

I would much rather,

You know,

I'm going to get up,

I'm going to get all this stuff done,

And I'm going to ignore all of those parts that really want to talk to me about that.

So slowing down and paying attention to yourself and being able to check in with your partner.

If it seems like they are responding to you in a way that just doesn't line up with the situation,

You might want to ask them,

You know,

Who is at the helm right now?

What part of you is driving the bus?

And they may not be able to tell you that in the beginning.

It takes a lot of work.

It's taken us several years to really be able to kind of get better at this language together.

And from the other perspective,

My logic and ration meter is very apparent on my face,

And that's what I use to detect when these parts are coming out a lot.

Because my wife is a rational and logical and intelligent person,

And when she starts saying things that don't make rational sense,

All of a sudden,

I start getting this look on my face and start trying to puzzle out,

Where is this coming from?

Who's saying this?

How does this make any sense?

And it's taken me years,

But it's gotten a lot quicker as if I feel my face starting to do this.

I go,

Wait a minute,

Wait a minute.

I might not be talking to Mrs.

Watt because she doesn't say things like this.

It looks like her.

The words are coming out of her mouth.

But there is somebody else inside.

The Wizard of Oz is in there making this mouth say these things and hiding behind the curtain.

But I've gotten a lot better at peeking behind the curtain and going,

Ha ha,

I hear you.

I know when it's you talking because you don't sound like Mrs.

Wadkins.

You sound like a young girl who's maybe thinking very emotionally and not rationally.

And the difference between,

You know,

Logical and emotional thinking is,

Is so dramatic.

And usually,

If logic is really high,

Emotion probably isn't that present.

And if emotions really high,

We can also say the same,

You know,

That logic isn't really that present.

So if your partner ever starts giving you that phase,

Is something to check in with yourself about,

Like,

What is going on within me that is creating sort of this disconnect?

And not to ever dismiss the emotions.

We don't think emotions are bad or we don't think they should be a part of things.

But emotions should not be driving the ship.

They should not be making decisions.

They should be talking with logic and ration and all working together for the betterment of your human.

They're just giving us information.

Exactly.

All right,

So in the Navy.

We say,

Fair winds and following seas.

But that's the easiest time to captain your ship.

So no matter what the weather,

We hope that you're approaching life with curiosity,

Self-compassion,

And a steady hand at the helm.