Episode 150: I Was Telling Myself A Lie Feat. April Roga

Being a parent of a special needs child can feel lonely, especially when others are treating you and your child as an outsider. Some people don't understand that special needs doesn't mean dangerous. A child on the autism spectrum wants to feel loved and included as much as every other child you know. April Roga shares her journey of being a special needs mom to her elementary-aged son who is nonverbal and on the autism spectrum (ASD). She wants other parents to know they're not alone.

Transcript

Welcome to the Beautifully Changed Podcast. I'm Steph Pramas, Your host, And this is where we talk about the many faces of self-growth and tips you can start applying today. Self-growth is all about the cracks that change us. We can sit in our pain points or use them to know ourselves fully and become empowered by them. Life will have pain and it will have love and we can be filled with joy. What we focus on and what we decide to face and work through will determine how close we get to reaching our full potential in any role in our life. When we choose to not let our pain or obstacles block us from the life that is available for us, Beautiful things happen. This life is ours to have, To delight in. Rumi said, The crack is where the light enters you. I tend to think the crack is where your light is set free because it's in you the whole time. Well, Hey there friendly souls. I hope you are having a phenomenal December. Mine is going quite well. I've been doing breath work with Taylor Baringer. She's also on episode 140. And let me tell you, It is such a powerful experience. It's really intense because she takes you through this breathing exercise. And it has this music and you're doing it for this period of time and it really helps you release whatever your body is holding on to. And I have found it, I think I've done four sessions with her so far. And every session I can feel building on the last. And even though I have no idea completely what I'm releasing, I know that I'm releasing things because of the way my body is responding and how I feel afterward. Which I also think a lot about hypnosis, Right? You don't always know what you're releasing. You just know that your life is shifting. And you know it's like when you vacuum, Right? You don't go dig through the vacuum garbage when you throw it out, Right? You don't like sift through there and see like, Oh what am I throwing away today? No, You just trust that the vacuum picked up the garbage and now you're tossing it out. So that's what I'm trusting is happening with this breath work. Just like I do when I do self-hypnosis or any other mind shifting work like NLP or anything else. So it's pretty phenomenal. Oh, Before I move on. So Taylor does PAWS breath work. She's getting certified in that. And so that is the specific kind of breath work she does because I've been doing breathing exercises for years. But I've never had the experience that I have doing this PAWS breath work. It's pretty like it's intense but in a really good way. Okay, So also I'm a huge fan of the Kelly Clarkson show. I don't know if any of you guys have been watching it but it's really, I don't like watch it when it's on. I just watch like little clips on YouTube because I don't have cable. And I think on Hulu you have to pay another fee to be able to watch certain episodes of certain shows. So anyway, I just watch clips on YouTube and I'm totally obsessed with them because I think it's so great. Anyway, The episode I was watching yesterday or the clips was about this guy named Dan Price. Now way back in 2015 according to a YouTube video I was watching because I wanted to learn more about this guy. So it says in this one video I watched that on April 13th, 2015 Dan Price announced the new minimum wage at Gravity Payments and that would be $70, 000. And so on the Kelly Clarkson show he was on with a couple of his employees and they talked about all the benefits that happened from there. And how Dan took like a million dollar pay cut in order to be able to help ensure that the minimum wage at Gravity Payments would be $70, 000. And it was just really cool. I thought it was really inspiring to make sure that everyone who worked for his company that I believe is located in Seattle, That they're able to have a living wage and actually be able to have money to invest in themselves and the company has flourished and is doing this. And it's kind of funny because he did this in 2015 but we're just hearing about it. Well I am anyway, Just hearing about it now because he was on the Kelly Clarkson show in 2019. So it's really interesting because there's these really phenomenal people doing really just caring, Compassionate, Uplifting, Really positive, Truly making a difference things in the world and we don't always hear about them. So that's what I wanted to share it on here. So even if one person, One of you listeners are like, Oh my gosh I didn't know that. Everyone else is like, Well I already knew that stuff. Wow, Get with the program. Well for that one person who didn't know, Now they know about a phenomenal person doing phenomenal things and helping people enhance and elevate their lives. So I thought that was really exciting so I wanted to share that with you. If you have any other positive news that you think I may not be aware of which heck even if you think I have heard of it, Share it with me. Tag me on Instagram or share it with me on Instagram or Facebook or wherever you are. I think I'm on all the social media so tag me, Tag me, Tag me. Also before we jump into today's episode, I want to remind you and please ask, Well I guess please ask you to leave me a review for the podcast. It really does make a big difference so just go to Apple iTunes and leave a review giving me your thoughts and feedback. Again, Unless you're going to give me like a one star rating because that would just kind of hurt me on the rating. So just tell me what I need to improve and I will take your opinion into consideration. But I'm always looking for those five star reviews and I would love it if you have, You know if you think this is a five star podcast, Give me some love through a review. I want to know what you like about it, What your feedback is, What topics you want to hear about, Who you want as a guest on here, All that good jazz because really this podcast is for you. It's something I love providing. I get excited for the podcast. I get excited to connect with you this way. So please do that. Also, If you would like to join a community where you can feel really seen and supported and you can engage and you can ask questions and you can give tips and you can just like dive into a community of love and acceptance and supportiveness, Then please join my Facebook community, Which is on Facebook under beautifully changed and we would love to have you there. Yeah, Because we are all growing together baby. So go ahead and join my Facebook community because the more the merrier. And now let's talk a little bit about what today's episode is going to be about. So April, She is my guest today, April Roga, And she is going to share with you her experience of being a mom to a special needs child. So I'm at April through some Facebook groups, And we hit it off. I really enjoy having conversations with April. So April Roga, Who many people refer to her as April 2. 0 co-hosts the hashtag net friending TV 2. 0 talk show. She lives in Knoxville, Tennessee, And is a special needs mom to her elementary age son who is nonverbal and on the autism spectrum ASD. She is in transition from her current job of 25 years in corporate America and working towards becoming an entrepreneur. So she can leave her nine to five and invest more time at home with her son and husband. So she's often says, The says hashtag bring April home. April helps midlife entrepreneurial women to quickly recognize how they can know the right people to follow in their niche and how to quickly put themselves on the radar of their peers and influencers and get noticed. Though hashtag frienducation, Friends educating each other, April helps people to stop sleepwalking through their social media experience. Through role modeling, She shows people how to embrace and enjoy the process until they reach their desired destination. Those people will instantly recognize that they are sleepwalking and navigating their lives and their social media on autopilot. Her primary way to help other people is by live streaming so they can so they can break the isolation. So many parents are lonely for and isolated from deep meaningful friendships, Aka hashtag friend to Missy. Thank you, Shasta Nelson, And using only Google to get answers to their deepest issues of life questions. She wants to show them that the easiest way to get their questions answered is through conversations and additional perspectives with people who go beyond the pretentious social bonding that is so prevalent today. The culture environment of the net friending movement is free of toxic and mediocre people and is conducive to rapid personal and professional growth. April Roga and her husband, Roy Montero are dedicated to providing midlife entrepreneurial women and the people who cheer them on the greatest resource of all time, Each other via their prestigious net friending people search engine. April can quickly assess a person's belief based on how they behave and how they answer specific questions. The status quo never thinks to ask when she hosts her TV 2. 0 talk show she is always vulnerable and transparent, Which allows an environment for others to give themselves permission to show up that way to which in turn will lead to their own personal growth, Breakthrough and spiritual transformations. It's April's dream and vision to connect all of the right people with each other through her prestigious net friending people search engine and her 24-7, 365 live streaming channel. So if this resonates with you and you are ready to connect with other people just like you who are at their intersection of Live Streaming Avenue and Personal Growth Boulevard, Then send April a direct message at facebook. Com slash April Roga. You can also schedule a quick voice or video meet and greet with her and her husband by going to net friending dot com slash calendar. To view her previous and future TV 2. 0 talk shows visit FB dot com slash net friending. April is the epitome of the girl next door and therefore extremely approachable, Friendly, Warm and eager to meet you. So don't be shy and reach out to see what you have in common and how you can help each other on your collective journeys. April is very big on connecting people. She's connected me with a few people and she's always on the money. She connects with people that are actually people I want to be connected with and I'm always so happy that she was able to find a way to introduce us to each other. Okay, So now let's jump in and hear a bit of April story and process the struggle she's been through how she's moved through them and where she's at today. So April, Thank you so much for joining me today on the beautifully changed podcast. I'm looking forward to hearing your story your journey, And I know that it is going to connect with other people and some people are likely to resonate very deeply with your story. And I just appreciate you coming on here and being willing to be vulnerable and open and just sharing with us. So welcome to the podcast. Thank you for having me step. So April before we dive into your story. I'm wondering if we could start with something that you've learned recently that has inspired you. Does it have to be recently. Well, You can say recently loosely. So whatever that means for you. I I'm always connecting with people who inspire me. Gosh, You see like nothing's coming to mind because there's so much. Well, The first thing you got just pop something it doesn't have to be the most inspiring just something that you're like, Oh, That's good. I'm taking that put it in my back pocket. Ah, The worst time you do a thing is the worst time you do that thing. I keep that with me all the time because it helps me to know that it doesn't matter if you screw up if you mess up or as I say if you up screw, Because it's okay everybody has a first time that you know, Stuff to son. So who what has inspired you and I'm like, I got nothing. It's okay. April, It's okay to not have something just keep going. That's exactly right. And what you're saying is so true, Too, Because even just saying the first time you do something, You're not going to be that amazing at it. My husband, I always joke around that if we're not sucking at something, We're not trying new things. We're not trying to grow and stretch ourselves. So it's always important that we're finding something that we almost don't want to do because we're so bad at it, But we're doing it anyway. And then we're like, Oh, Look, After a little bit of time, We're not as bad as we started. So I like that I did. I did want to say though, It's not anything that somebody has said, Per se. But the reason that you and I connected was because of another person named Travis Chapel. And if it weren't for his inspiring group that we are in together, Then we wouldn't even be sitting here right now having this conversation. That's right. And he has a networking group. So if anyone's interested, His Facebook group is called shoot, What is the actual name, Do you have the name of his Facebook group off the top of your head? Build your network community. Yep, There we go. Build your network community. So if you're interested in networking as well, We'll do a little plug for him. So definitely check out Travis Chapel and build your network community. He also has a podcast, Which is really phenomenal. I found him through the bigger podcast, Our bigger pockets podcast, Which is all about real estate and stuff like that, Because my husband's obsessed with that podcast. And he thought, Hey, Networking, This would be good for me to learn. And here I am. And it's led me to some really cool people. And April is one of them. So it's been awesome. So April, Let's dive into your story a little bit. So you were sharing with me because we were talking about my podcast and that the type of people I look for are because people who've been through a challenge people have been through something and they know that that challenge is a piece of their life for them. And it's building and that they can get through any challenges that come to them. And even in that moment when the challenge feels too big for them, They're, They can make it, They can learn the skills, They can figure it out. And you shared that you have a son, Morgan, Who is autistic and nonverbal. And so I'm wondering if you could share your journey with us, Because we hear about the rise of autism all the time. And almost everybody that I know of know somebody in their life, Whether it's a friend or in their family that has a child or knows a child with the diagnosis or they're on the autism spectrum. So I'm wondering, Well, You can dive in wherever you want to start wherever you feel most comfortable and just share your story. And if I have a question, I'll interrupt you for a second to get clarification. Otherwise, Go ahead and begin where you feel comfortable. Oh, Well, He is nine. So believe it or not, My journey with Morgan and his issues of life started in infancy really, Because, So he is my first and only child. And I, Gosh, I was 37 when I had him. So I'm 46 now and so that was kind of late in life to be having a kid, Depending on who you ask. Yeah, That's right. But, Um, So I didn't, I'm not an only child myself so I didn't really have anything to draw from other than, You know what you hear your friends talk about what you should expect when you're first having a child and. So there were things, Red flags in infancy, Really as a newborn that I noticed that other people like my mom had pointed out to me like he should be doing this by this time and all these milestones that should be hit. According to the rest of the world. And, You know, When you're a new mom you're like getting feedback from a lot of people that sometimes you don't even really want it you're like yeah yeah yeah, But I couldn't really at some point in time when he was like after a year old when he wasn't rolling on his tummy and he wasn't holding a bottle on his own and he wasn't pulling up in the playpen there were certain things that you could only put off for so long before you really start questioning what's going on and is this normal. That makes sense so it probably just want to pause right there for a second. So one of the things that I'm guessing is one of your strengths that other people might see differently, Perhaps you could touch on that if you want to, But it sounds like you were really like okay I get it there's like a standard like this like worksheet this checklist that we have to take but also everybody's an individual, And I want to see like maybe he just developed his development like developing like differently on his own pace in these different areas, And then at a certain point you're like, Okay. Now I should probably get this checked out. Yeah, And the doctors will. They will let you not realize these things either because every time you go for a wellness visit there is an actual checklist and you, They tell you I'll just never forget, They, They have all these questions and it says that once you get to like three nos stop. And it was always the first three, No, No, No, Every time we'd go for a wellness visit. And it was just there was. Oh, I was like what inside something screaming like there's something wrong with my child but then as the mom. You don't want to face it you don't want to believe it you just keep sweeping it under the rug. But when your child is. Gosh, I want to say because I back then everything was in months. I don't even, I don't even remember anymore. I want to say he was like 22 months before he even like with standing up on his own. And other people's kids you know Facebook, You can't avoid seeing other people's kids when they want to share videos and pictures and you're seeing all these little tiny tiny little peanut things that are just running around at, You know, A year old and my kids like almost two and he's barely making it. So I had to, I had to ask. Well, First I had to change doctors because some of the doctors kept telling me, Oh, He's just a boy and boys are late bloomers. I'm sure you've heard that one before. I haven't. No. Well, I mean, I've heard my own son, But yeah, I've heard people say that or they'll just approach boys differently than girls with different things I think that they're looking at developmentally. But yeah, So the doctors were even saying that, Oh, Well, You know, He's not talking yet. He actually is. Dada, Dada, Dada, Dada, Dada, Dada, Dada. He was all about that. And then it went away in and most people who've heard about autism have heard that there are kids that have words early on and then they disappear. Correct. There's a whole nother debate about that that brews within various autism communities about whether or not vaccines are the cause of that. Yeah. For me, I want to say it might have played a role in it, But the signs with Morgan were all there in infancy. So I don't know if anybody will ever really know what role vaccines play in that, But I know that my son had a word and then it disappeared and never returned. But now he says mama and I'm happy about that. That's now the only word he says at nine years old, But it's usually when unfortunately when he's in a fight or flight type of situation, Like at the doctor and he's scared. It's like that one word that comes and flows through him is mama because I'm his safety net. Yeah, That's what I was just going to say. It must give him comfort when he needs it most. Yeah. So the doctor said he's just, You know, Eventually he'll probably talk or he'll probably walk, But it'll be later. And then I switched doctors because I wasn't getting answers and I wanted to know what I needed to do to help my son. So the doctor that we did find had said, Have you ever thought about autism? And just everything in me just drooped and fell. And I just, I thought, No, No, It's not autism. He wasn't really pushy about it. He just kind of threw it out there to plant the seed and he got me on and my husband at the time, Or on the path of getting our answers through the state. And every state, Which I didn't know until this doctor told me every state has an early intervention program and it's free. It's not based on your income, Which a lot of programs are. Every state has an early intervention program up to the age of three years old. Oh, Wow. It's a little on the sad side though, Because most parents don't realize their children are on the spectrum until they're in school and having issues. Yeah, That's exactly right. Oh my. Yeah. That's a really good point. So we got into that program right before he turned three. It was like a little, Just a little over age two and a half, I think. So we made it just in time. And so he, They sent somebody to the house who comes and evaluates your child, Watches how they interact in their home environment. They can ask you questions and then they get their people together and they decide whether or not your child is eligible for the program because they, They pay for occupational therapy, Speech therapy. And they send somebody, An early interventionist, Early interventionist to your home once a week to just work with them in the home environment. Can I ask a question, April, When you did this and because you were able to get in before Morgan turned three, Did it last, Like, Did it continue until like a certain age or was it like once he was three, They like cut off services? No, It was once he went into the school system, They cut off the services, But then he was able to get into the pre-K at the public school. So I think maybe it was a year that he had, He had a full year of occupational physical therapy, Speech, And then that in home. Okay. And it was, Everything was once a week, So it's an hour at a time, But I have to tell you the people that worked with him outside the home, He wanted to do more for them, The strangers, Than he wanted to do for mom and dad who he knew. There's something about that wanting to please somebody that you're not familiar with. And me, I was like, I wouldn't push him because I'm mama and I don't want to upset him and I don't want to see him cry. So it was better for him to be with strangers who are skilled in that area and are used to that. And they pushed him. Yeah. And did you see like a difference with his skills before and after he was giving that intervention? Oh, Huge. That timeframe was so critical to his development that I am so blessed that we got into that program when we did, Because if left for me to push him, That critical time in his life, I don't know that he would be as far along now as he is. Yeah. Can you share a little bit of the skills that you saw between before the intervention and after? Just walking. So kids like him, They have sensory issues. And that was one of the things that they thought he might have was just sensory processing disorder. So that kind of eased me into the autism diagnosis because they didn't say, Oh, We think your child is on the spectrum. They said, You know, It might be this lesser thing, This sensory processing disorder. And so they said you can have sensory processing disorder and not be autistic, But you can't have autism and not have some kind of sensory processing disorder. So they worked a lot on depth perception with him because he would, When we were out in a parking lot going into a restaurant in the mall, You know, Sometimes you have these crazy flooring designs in the mall where there's diamonds in the middle of the floor and different colors. He would step as if it was a different height that he had to adjust for. Or if there was a crack in the sidewalk, He would want to like step up as if he was stepping over it. And when they just pushed him through those different scenarios that he wasn't used to, It was all about pushing through your fear, Pushing outside of your comfort zone with him. And the more they just repeated these exercises with him, He would go through the same things. He would cry, He would scream, He would hyperventilate at times because he'd get himself that worked up. He'd have like blood vessels popped in his eyes and on his face. That's how intense it was for him. And just continuing that repetition, He's become pretty great at overcoming those things that he's not familiar with. Just after doing something a few times, He's like, I got this. I got this. Oh, Nice. Yeah. Except for the doctor. We still don't really take well to the doctor, But then again, Who does, Right? Yeah. Especially in those situations too. And I'm sure when he was younger, He, You know, Kids are really great at picking up on how the parents are feeling. And if there was frustration when you were first going to the doctor, You know, Not really getting answers and all of that stuff. It's like, It's kind of hard to like move through that later on because how do you know this doctor is going to be different and that, You know, It's going to be a feel good experience versus a frustration, A frustrating experience. Yeah. So when did the diagnosis go to autism and kind of what was your process through that? Well, Part of the early intervention program is that they also, I forget, I think he's like a behavioral therapist. We went there and it was a three session visit. So the first time was just kind of an intake situation. Give us, You know, The history. The second time was just the doctor evaluating him in that environment where the doctor is to just introduce toys to him, See how he plays with toys, Talk to him, See how he socializes with people. Just watch him in his natural habitat, Although it wasn't so natural, It was the doctor's office. As natural as it can be, Just kind of let him do his thing and there were some things, Like he doesn't talk. So that was a huge flag for the autism, The fact that at almost three he wasn't talking. And he also flaps. He flaps his arms and his hands and makes a lot of humming noises that can get pretty loud. And that's classic signs of autism. So I think for this doctor, It was probably a slam dunk no brainer autism diagnosis. And I had been preparing myself for that. I don't know if my husband at the time had been as prepared as I was. I think it's a little bit different for men with sons that they see, You know, Maybe later on in life, You see yourself doing certain things with your boy. And then knowing that your child's probably not going to grow up to do some of those things. There might be a little ego that comes into play there, Like, No, No, My son can't have autism. Yeah, I think it's a different, It's a loss in a way that, A loss of this idea of what life was supposed to be like and then even like what did I cause this, Did I do something to, You know, Is this my fault? Is what I've heard people say in the past is that, Did I do something wrong? You know, Did I prevent him from having the life that I envisioned for us to have because I did something? So I think you're right that it is visualizing, You know, What you thought your life was going to be like. And that's what part of the grief process is for some people is letting go of that idea you thought could happen and finding a way to live in and appreciate the reality that is in front of you. Because just because it's going to be different doesn't mean it's going to be bad. Right. Yeah, That's a huge message that I have for other parents who are just starting on their journey because you do, And especially when it's your first child, You envision all these things of what their childhood is going to look like and I don't think anybody is ever prepared that their child is not going to be typical and I say that in quotes. For us, We went to the, When we were there that day, The third visit was the diagnosis and when he said autism, You know, No matter how much I had even prepared myself to hear that because I think I was probably 99% sure that was coming. And I think my son's dad probably figured that was coming too, But no matter how much preparation, It's still hard to hear those words. And I even did, I wrote an article that they published on the mighty I don't know if you've ever heard of the mighty. I haven't. They're, They, They have like a dedicated section for autism now but they, They used to be all about like special needs and I think they've branched out but I wrote an article for them and it was, I think the title was something about how I grieved autism for my son's autism diagnosis for 24 hours, Because that's literally what it was. I came home, And I called a friend of mine that I had gone to high school with who does applied behavioral analysis therapy with kids with autism. And just talking to her for like an hour she said to me something that I will always carry on to other moms other parents out there. And that is that the label that was just given to your child the diagnosis does not change who your child is the child you have today with that diagnosis is the same child you had yesterday. And the only thing this label now does is allow your child to get much needed services in the future when they enter into the school system and beyond. Yes, I love that that is such a powerful mindset shift and I really appreciate you sharing that because I think what you said is just so good that I would love for you to say that again that it doesn't change who your child was yesterday, It just allows them to get services so that they can have a higher quality of life. That's it. It's like it's like a, It's a gateway to get services that are helpful for you guys. Yeah, That's not just with an autism label diagnosis it's with any, Any label or where people are struggling with mental health issues, You know, I think sometimes there's people out there who they, They own that label like they, They allow it to define them instead of being the person they were meant to be that label doesn't limit you. It just helps you to realize that this is my issue of life. And now that I know what that issue is, I can do something to, To grow and to be a better me tomorrow than I was today or yesterday. And with this label with my son. Yes, I mourned it for 24 hours, And I did, I did have that mindset shift. But still though, Going forward in the earlier years, Was not enough to help me overcome those hurdles that we're still going to be in the first few years thereafter like birthdays, Christmas, Halloween, All these holidays that little kids look forward to, And I'm sure you're treating and dressing up and getting gifts and ripping them apart. I have videos of me going come on Morgan just pull the paper, Come on, You can do it pull the paper. I didn't do it, I just in any of that and so I was just heartbroken. And I made it all about me. I'm. That's another big message I have for for people new to the journey is. Child who is on the spectrum or any child really in a way that you want them to behave simply because that's what you had growing up. Because you're now like you're pushing your child into being who you were. Just because you enjoyed opening gifts doesn't mean your child has to. And just because you looked forward to your birthday and knew that it was coming doesn't mean your child has to. And as soon as you detach from that, It just changes everything for you. I love that. That's such a solid point. And you know, Back when you're talking about the tools as well and like the label, It's literally just like it's a different set of tools that you use. And like how you said for anybody in any diagnosis, Whether it's a health diagnosis or a mental health or behavioral health or relationship issue, It's just a pathway to the set of tools that are going to help you build the strongest foundation. So I love that. And I also appreciate you being able to recognize like I was making this about me instead of being there for just like the moment with him. Like I was so excited about the present. I wanted him to be so excited. Like I couldn't wait to give it to him. You know, And I think every parent can relate to that no matter if the child's on the spectrum or not. Right. We get so excited. Like we get this thing and we're like, Oh my gosh, You're going to love this. And then they don't care at all about it. And we're like, What? So I love that reminder to not make it about us in those moments. Yeah. And it just that hearing you say that back to me just now, Like I start misting up because that those, Those first, Like when he was four and five, Those years when they, They typically start to have that awareness of the holidays and the gatherings and with him, He didn't want to be around people. It was like too many people. And he would be like, I want out of here because this is too overwhelming for me. And it was, It goes back to what you see for your child. When you find out even, Even before you find out that you're going to have a baby. I mean, Just being a, When we were little girls, You know, We played with our dolls and we thought about when we'd grow up and be a mom someday, What that would look like. So we, As, As women, As nurturers invest so many years throughout our life, Looking towards the future and what being a mom or a wife is going to be like. And when it that the reality doesn't match what we fantasized about, It's, We set ourselves up for disappointment, Whoever really wants to be disappointed. Right. So don't be. And I love, And I just want to highlight this for a second, Because I think it's a really solid point that, That I think is worth mentioning. Cause you said even thinking about that, Your eyes get a little misty. And I think that's really valid to share that you did spend those four hours or 24 hours of grieving, Right? However, Grief is one of those things that comes in waves and sometimes it hits you unexpectedly, Maybe through different life transitions. When something happens, It's just like a reminder. However, April, It sounds like you've really done the personal work where you don't stay there. You acknowledge it. You're like, Oh, This is one of those moments. This is a moment where my fantasy isn't coming to reality and I'm acknowledging it. And I'm feeling that moment of grief. And then I'm accepting and coming into the presence with love. And that's what I get from you. Yeah. Yeah. There's there's people who will wallow in it and unpack and live there. And I, I know that's not going to serve me well. And so I just will sometimes sit in quiet with my thoughts, With my tears and, And you have to feel it. You have to go through it. You can't just skip that stage. Right. Let's say that one more time. What did I say? It sounded good, Right? Yes. You said you have to feel it. You have to go through it. You cannot skip that stage. Yeah. Yeah. Looks, You're bringing out like all this amazingness in me that I didn't know I had. Ah, That's my goal, Girl. I'm supposed to make you shine. That's your superpower. Well, Thank you. And so you mentioned something earlier that I want to go back to. You said that that wasn't the only thing, But really that wasn't the only thing though that helped you get through like the hurdles and the holidays. So what other tools did you use that you found like, Oh, This actually really made a huge difference around the hurdles and the holidays. Well, I wouldn't set myself up for that disappointment. I would, I wouldn't take my son to a place that I knew he was going to be miserable and unhappy in just because I wanted to like force that I, Because I, Oh, It's the holidays. We have to go here. We have to go to this family member's house. Um, Or we have to have everybody over here. My holidays pretty much became really back then just me, My son and my then husband and um, Maybe a relative or two that we would visit, But it wasn't all the go out and buy a million gifts. And then I wanted to, To come up with a new way of doing holidays because I had to, And once you do, Cause I learned this from my son, Right? Once you push through the thing that doesn't make you happy, Um, Do it several times. It just, It'll become a habit and it's just your new norm. And so I would just for the holidays, We wouldn't do a big dinner. It would just be like any other day because to me it was like any other day. And then did that shift it for you? Were you able to find that you would welcome the holidays instead of the grief coming with it? Yeah. Cause I, Cause I made it more about my son. He became my focal point instead of me being my own focal points. And that's hard work girl. That's like real work. Right there. I don't know where that came from either. I just, I just love him that much. And I, I realized that my, What I saw is something that should be happy for him. Wasn't bringing him joy. So why am I going to keep doing that? No. Yeah. It almost sounds like, Have you heard of a conscious parenting? Yeah. So there's the book, The conscious parent out there. And it's, I mean, It's, It's a little bit like just really recognizing like, Like exactly what you're saying. If the kid doesn't want to go to the party, You don't force them to go to the party just because you want to go to the party and you want them to go to the party with you, You know? So it's a lot about that, Like just approaching them as an individual and being aware of what feels good and what doesn't feel good for them and honoring that. And it's like, You're just naturally doing that. So I think that's pretty phenomenal. Do you think that if you would have had your son earlier, Cause you mentioned early that you had your son at 37, Right? And people are like, Whoa, Okay. Grandma getting up there for having a kiddo, But you're like, I'm doing it anyway. Right. And so do you feel like you would have approached the situation differently had you been in your twenties? Yeah. That's a great question. I would not have been emotionally, Spiritually, Mentally prepared. Maybe physically I would have been a little better off, But in the other departments, I would say I would not have been prepared for, And I needed to go through other stuff in my life to, To be the mom to my son that I am today. So, Yes. And so I also want to kind of bring in a little bit of the other challenges that you were also going through during this time as well, Like readjusting to this new way of living and to letting go of the fantasy life that you had thought was going to happen because you've mentioned several times your ex-husband. So I'm guessing you got a divorce and then you had like family had health issues, Like all of that stuff. So I don't know what you want to all go into there, But I mean, Girl, Like challenges is not something that shied away from you. They were like, Oh, Let's see how much you can handle. Let me just pile this on and see if we can break you. And you were like, Not today, Not today, Not today. Now you share, Just share whatever you feel comfortable with. So how old was he? Six. He's nine now. So yeah, Around just before, Just before he turned six, My son, My former and I were having, I don't know where it came from. I think it's because some people will say, You know, With autism, Having a child with autism, Did that put a strain on your marriage? And I would say for me a little bit, I don't even know if I'd call it a strain. It just, It changes things because we didn't want to leave him with just anybody. He was, You know, He had allergy issues and spitting up issues that we couldn't get diagnosed right away. And there were just all these medical things and then his behaviors. I just didn't feel comfortable leaving him with just anybody. So I stopped going. My husband then was a musician, So he, He would go out and gig at night and on the weekends. And so I was home most of the time alone with my son. And anytime in the past, Before our son came along, I'd be like, Okay, I'm getting off of work. I'll go meet you somewhere. Or, You know, Weekends, I would go out most of the time and go support him. And, Or we'd be able to just go, Go to dinner or a movie or something. And now it was like we, We had invested no time together. It was just the day to day coming home from work, Doing the mom thing, And then he'd leave, Go to his gig. And then on the weekends we would maybe do lunch, Go food shopping. And then it was, He'd go to his gig and we were just drifting. And I think that he, The, The, In the intimacy department, That was gone completely. It was like, I was tired. When he would approach me, I'd be like, No, Go away. Gosh. Cause it became almost like fitting it in. You'd have to fit it into your schedule. And so he found solace, I guess, In another woman's whatever. And I found out about it and I filed for a divorce after, No, Before I confronted him about it. I didn't even tell him that I knew. I just went and filed for the divorce. And then when he came home, I came home from work and he went to kiss me and I said, Don't. And he was like, What? And I said, I know what's going on. And he still denied it. Still denied it. I think he would still deny it to this day. I don't know. That's just probably shame, But we still probably don't even know ultimately what led up to all of that happening. But I remember during that time when I knew we were drifting, But I kept thinking that if he is cheating on me, Cause I, I suspected, But I didn't know for sure. I didn't want to confront him about it because my fear was being a single mom to a child with special needs. And I thought, I can't do that. There's no way I could do this by myself. But then God showed me. He was like, Yes you can. Cause your husband is like gone every weekend with this other woman that I didn't even know existed yet. But he was gone every weekend that I was going food shopping by myself and I was doing all the mom things by myself. And I was like, Wait, I'm doing it. So the things that sometimes we tell ourselves that they're big fat, Bold lies. And I was telling myself a lie cause I totally could do it, But I was just clinging to, To the marriage because of fear that I couldn't do it. And I just, I just said, I've got this. And so I, We divorced, It was amicable. He even stayed here for several months after I filed so that he could help me with our son and we have co-parented amazingly well together and we're not best friends, But we're civil and we do what we need to do for our son. That's so important to be able to co-parent in a way that no matter if your child is autistic or not, Like it is divorce is hard. And when parents make it harder on the children by not getting along. Oh my gosh. So that's really like, I really respect that you guys are able to put your hurt and your differences aside to be there for Morgan. Now the former version of me before I started on this whole shift of mindset, I really, I wanted to blast him all over social media and shame him for like, Really you cheated on me and yeah, But I didn't cause that would not have served me well. So that was, That was kind of the start of my, My personal growth journey was going through that experience and then transitioning to like five months or so after that my mom got diagnosed with lung cancer and seven months after that my dad got diagnosed with colon cancer and they live in Vegas and I'm in Tennessee, Which is 2200 miles away and I'm an only child. So I couldn't even be there to help them physically. Oh, That would have been man that, That really is an obstacle and a challenge like emotionally, Mentally, Spiritually, Physically, Like, You know, That's a lot. That's a lot. Yeah. I I'm a very emotional person. I'm a very empathetic person. And so I really had to do some work with myself to not own what was going on with my parents. Like I have this desire to always want to fix things and I couldn't fix cancer. But so since I know I can't fix cancer, I wanted to like fix other things. I wanted to, I wanted to do something for them, But I there's, There was nothing I could do and I had to just be okay with that because I really would have wanted to just like take time off from work and I work in a corporate job and, And what I do is a key piece within the company that they couldn't have been without me for like, You know, Months. So, And then I have my son, I can't just pull him out of school and drive across the country. So I just had to be a person who could listen to my parents and offer feedback for them when they needed it and love them physically from a distance because there was nothing else I can do. That is such a good point. April is, Is really, Which I don't think is talked about enough is that finding the acceptance and what you're able to do in a challenge in a really challenging situation when you want to do more. And like, As you said, You couldn't cure cancer. You couldn't take the cancer away and you couldn't like take your son out of school and move cross country. Like all of these obstacles were in your way. And so there is this beauty and finding the acceptance of what you can offer instead of beating yourself up and living in the guilt of what you can't. And I think that is such a game changer and it's really hard to do. Like, I'm not saying this is easy to do. Like this is some of the hardest work you can possibly do in your life is find that forgiveness for yourself to not do the thing that you wish you could. Yeah. You just have to sit with it. Just, I always, You need somebody though to talk with who is willing to, To, To that you could bounce something off of them. Like my, My now husband, My, I have my then husband and my now husband. You have to have your, Your person who is supportive of you, Who can help you to see a different perspective. Because, You know, I hear people say that they just need time and space and I need to go like be off in a corner by myself. But what happens when you go into your space of crawling into a ball in a corner using the same brain that got you into whatever thought process you're in now that's toxic or negative. How are you going to undo that yourself? You need somebody who can give you a different perspective and, Oh gosh, I hope it's like a more positive one and not a negative one. Cause some people have some of those in their life too. That's very true. Very fair point. So, And that, And that Roy was that for you, You have somebody that came into your life and helped elevate you and your personal growth journey. Yes yes yes yes yes. I, I, I have transformed in my mindset, My thinking, My behavior so much from where I was just three and a half years ago that it's kind of like when a person loses weight and you, You see them every day and they're losing the weight, But you don't really notice. Yeah. When you haven't seen them for a while and then they come back, You're like, Oh my goodness. Well for me, It's like, I've been with myself every day. So I don't realize it until I have somebody I'm talking to and sharing my journey with. And I'm looking back at where I was then and where I'm at now. And that's why I call myself April 2. 0 because at some point I kept going, You know, The older version of me would have done this, But the new version of me thought this and did that instead. Isn't that such a cool point when you can look back and be like, Hot dang, I am being the person I want to be like, I am changing these things because we get told like you can't change or it's impossible to change or like maybe it's not even changing at all. Maybe it's releasing a habit and allowing a new one to come in instead. So I love the fact that you're able to recognize like, Oh wow, This is actually like, I can almost feel it. I can taste the change and I can feel it inside my body. The different energy that is producing. Yes, Yes, Yes, Yes. And so through this journey, Well, So at some point along the way I'm not even like finishing my story. So last year my mom ended up passing away the day before Mother's Day, May 12th, 2018. My dad, His cancer actually went away. They did two different methods. My mom went the chemo route. My dad went the oil, The CBD oil route. And my right at the same time that my mom was told that her cancer had spread to her brain. And even after that, She underwent more radiation. And then they said she had four more brain tumors. And right when she found out that hers got worse, My dad was told that his was gone. What are the odds? And what a mix of emotions. Yes. Right. Yeah. You want to be like relieved. And then I'm sure my dad had to be going through all kinds of guilt about that, Which is false guilt because he doesn't have control over that. But I wanted to help him through that. And he was just in such a space. He was himself was going through several surgeries at that time because he had to have his colon removed, Had a colostomy bag put on. And here's the kicker. When I chose to drive 2, 200 miles with my son and my cousin across country to Vegas to go to my mom's funeral, Because I don't fly because that's one fear I have not pushed through yet. I drove three days in the car. I did all the driving to get to my dad because he had surgery when my mom died. So she went into hospice and it was just supposed to be so that she would be there to be taken care of so he could have his surgery because she wanted him to have it. And she ended up dying the day that he was coming home. So he didn't get to see her. And we planned her funeral while he was in the hospital over the phone. So he himself was going through, I mean, He didn't even really recover from that surgery when we were sitting there for her funeral. And he just, When I went there to visit, He was in such an angry place and he was just every little thing I did or didn't do, He would snap at me. And I just, I gave him grace on that because I know you just went through hell. But we don't talk. We haven't talked in actually we're nearing a year now. And I don't know why it was just like, He just decided, I don't know if maybe he felt like he was being a burden on me or it's just like this. He just stopped calling and I stopped calling and neither of us have picked up a phone in a year. And I don't know. I just don't know what I don't know. So what prevents you from calling him? Nothing. My own brain. Maybe we'll have to do a followup podcast on what happens when you finally call your dad. Yeah. So if nothing's stopping you, I mean, Then when will you call him? I guess I'm waiting for him to call me because he was the one who stopped and I, I don't know where a stalemate, A checkmate. I don't know. So this is kind of where my, My family journey ended and here I am. Yeah. And it's so interesting too, How in your story you could hear the different ways that grief can take shape. And I think that's such a valid thing to think about is like the way your dad's handling his grief is such a different way than you were handling yours. And then, You know, And then it's just shaped your relationship in a way that you both probably aren't happy with. It wasn't the end goal. So that's very interesting. And I think that's, That's the thing about grief is we all handle it differently. And I appreciate how you said you, You know, Gave him grace in that moment because he was so angry. And of course, Why wouldn't he, How long were your parents married for? How old am I? I think 47 years. Dang. Could you even imagine? Oh my gosh. Yeah. Wow. That is quite the story, April. And I know that's not even the full story. And, But I think it's fair to say that, You know, Pain, You understand loss, You understand hope, You understand that things are happening for you because it sounds like you have a wonderful relationship with Roy. Yes. And you guys are partners in this life. You're approaching life completely different. It's no longer feeling like you're doing this alone. You're doing this with a partner and you have a team beside you. And that's got to feel so satisfying to know that you have a teammate versus doing this, You know, Alone with somebody that you're married to, But it's not necessarily a team. Right. I love how you tied. You just like, It's like a present with a bow on it. I was watching you tie it up. I love that. Well, I'm really curious if you could share for somebody who's listening right now, Who's going through their own obstacle, Their own pain, Their own loss, Their own challenges, What advice or actionable steps can they take to help them on their own journey of healing and personal growth? Something that they could actually, You know, Maybe put into action today if they were so willing. I think the primary thing is, And I shared this before, But I'll share it again, Is that you have to align yourself with the right people in your life to help you on your journey because nobody gets through anything alone. Nobody. And you can be in a solid marriage and still not have all that you need in that marriage to help you through what you're going through in that moment. So align yourself with people who are going to cheer you on, Not criticize and judge you, But who will hear you and who will give you positive feedback and not just give you advice. Because I think there's a difference between advice and feedback because oftentimes we get unsolicited advice. People just saying, You should do this and you should do that. And I think a lot of people get confused because they're hearing, They go to too many different people seeking advice. But if you have somebody that you can have an exchange with, A back and forth, Which is the feedback, Then I think you're going to be in a much healthier space to make better decisions in your life and always go with peace or no peace. And that's your gut, Your intuition, That which I believe God put in me to know whether I'm doing something, If I'm going down the right path or the wrong path. And yes, Sometimes we don't choose correctly, But that's okay. Cause we'll, We'll be course corrected one way or the other. Cause a lot of times people say, Oh my gut told me to do this, But I did that instead. Always go with your gut. That would be my advice too, Especially the parents of autistic children out there. If you have something going on and with your child at an early age or even a later age, And you're like, Oh, That's not normal behavior. That something seems off, Go with it and explore it and just, Just start, Don't stay still. And on that topic, I also love how you mentioned at the very beginning of our discussion is that you change doctors. So if you have a doctor that you feel like you're not connecting with that you're not resonating with that isn't coming to that, Isn't showing up the way that is working for you and your child, It is a million percent okay to change doctors and find one that you connect with and find one where your child feels safer and you feel safer and more comfortable. There's nothing wrong with that. Of course, They're going to be upset because you know, Every doctor is also a business. Nobody likes to lose clients because that's money flow, Right? But at the same time, Your comfort level is valid and it is okay to change doctors. Absolutely. And we didn't really get to talk a lot about this, But in the last few minutes, I want you to share a little bit about what you're currently working on now and where life has kind of taken you. So you've had a period of a lot of loss and that was like, You know, You hear Jim Rohn, He talks about the seasons of life. So you had like a deep winter, You had a winter that lasted way too long, Like a cold winter too, Right? Like negative 50, Where in like, I mean, It was a cold, Brutal winter, But now you're in the spring. And so can you share a little bit about what this spring is looking like for you? Well, Part of my journey as well was that at one point I was going to start a nonprofit locally in Knoxville to help other parents who are on similar journeys with special needs children. And for whatever reason that just didn't come to fruition. And that was the time when I met Roy, My husband, And we met via live streaming on a platform that's not even around anymore. It was literally around for like a year when I met him. And so it was just like we were meant to meet. And when I met him, He was wanting to do a TV 2. 0 talk show and was looking for TV 2. 0 talk show hosts. And that resonated with me because when I was in school, I was, I don't know what, I guess you could call it a DJ because it was an FM radio station and we did DJing and read the news from the Associated Press. And I always wanted to do journalism or be on TV as like an anchor or something. But mom said, No, Too competitive, April, Don't do that. So I find myself here in this day and age of social media and now we can do live streaming. And Roy and I are on this journey to, With our net friending movement, It's to help connect people who wouldn't otherwise connect if they didn't find each other, Maybe through us and through others that we know. And we're putting together a people search engine, Not a database, But an actual people search engine where people who have the intent to find somebody that overlaps with them can do so using video and search. And it's so needed because you can't find people right now on Google. Like if I went out right now to Google and said, I'm looking for a mom who's about 46, Who happens to have a nonverbal child, You don't have to put in what to find somebody like that on Google or even on Facebook or YouTube. There's only so many keywords you can put in. But if you do it with intent, Like the way we're doing it, You could truly find your divine connections through our search engine and through live video and through the other people that we're connected with. And I believe that's why my nonprofits didn't work out because I think God has greater plans for me in connecting more and more people than just here within my local city. So that is the mission we're on. That is a really fun mission. And what a great purpose too, Because you know, When we're younger and we're in school or we're like in clubs or activities, It's so much easier to find somebody who's a little bit more like minded or we can connect with, But then like adulthood hits and you're not in school and you're not in these things, Or maybe you don't want to hang out with your coworkers or something. And then it's like, Where do I find people, You know, Besides joining a Facebook group or a meetup or something. And so this is a really cool idea. I'm excited to see like, How far are you in the process? Is it like, Can people search now or is it a ways before? No, See, We need the people to embrace our vision. That's what we're looking for is the people to help us build this, To walk alongside of us and see the vision and go, Oh, How can I serve you? Oh, I love it. Yeah. I love that. That's true. So if somebody is like, Oh, I can help. I could, I can serve, I can join in this. Where would they like, How would they contact you to let you know? They can reach out to me on Facebook. If you just facebook. Com slash April Roga or type my name in the search bar, It's April like the month. And then R O G A is my last name. You can check out our website net friending. Com because we are now that we're like, I'm doing this podcast and stuff. I'm like, It gives me a little incentive to kind of get it a little more set up to at least have a page with myself showing what I've done so far in my journey with putting together some videos and people that I've encountered on my journey. It's really all about, At the end of the day, It's about having people not be isolated because whether you're a special needs parent, A stay at home mom, Homeschool mom, Even some people in the corporate environment, There's still people out there who are isolated because maybe they work too many hours or they're in the home because they can't leave. We want everybody to be able to find somebody they can deeply connect with, Even if they can't leave their house to do it. I love that. And you know, April, I was thinking because your name is April, It's kind of spring is in April. Right. And it's like, It's kind of like a quick reminder. Like if you're ever getting too heavy in those winter feelings, It's like, Oh, But the spring is coming. Like it's kind of just a natural hope within you. I love that. Anyway, I was just thinking of that as I was looking at your name, I'll tell you my middle name is Dawn. Cause then you'll really feel like that's April Dawn. Yeah. That's amazing. That's really cool. Okay. So April, What is, Since we did talk about your parents a little bit, What is a great lesson you've learned from your parents at some point in your life, Whether it was growing up or as an adult, What is the lesson that from observing your parents, You were able to learn and apply it to your own life? See, Sometimes she stumps me like that. I see how she is. I guess to always stand up for myself. Cause my mother was always, Always not afraid to speak out when she felt there was an injustice in the world, Maybe even to a fault, But I definitely got some of my spunk from, From watching her in action over the years. And with my dad up until recently, I would say fairness, Cause he was always very fair with me. He always allowed me to speak my mind and, And he was willing to hear, Even when I was young, Like he wanted to know my thoughts on a matter rather than just giving the advice or telling you to do it this way. He included me as part of the conversation and allowed me to feel like I had some control in the outcome. But yeah, I like that, That you had a voice. Yeah. That's when we go back to grief, Like grief and like a loss of a partner, Like that, That level of heartbreak. Like I hopefully I don't have to experience that until I'm way older, Like, You know, But yeah, That's some tough stuff there, Girl, But I'm glad that you've been able to learn really solid lessons that has shaped your own life. And I think helps set you up for the success that you're able to have now, Which is really beautiful. Thank you. You're welcome. In April, What is something that you think is underrated? I know this is going to sound really like ridiculous, But connection. I love it. Tell me more. I think there's, There's people who use that word so, So loosely. It's just like, I don't, Connection is so important and nowadays because of social media, It's so elusive. There's people who talk about it, Who say it's important to tell you to do it and they're not doing it. And it's, It should be, It should be rated way higher than it is because I've seen the power of it through live streaming. I've seen the power of building relationships quickly and deeply just by opening up and being vulnerable with people that you would not have met otherwise and, And how that could help you in whatever journey you're on to, To grow. You can learn so much from other people. You don't have to necessarily talk with them every day, But instead of doing news, Weather and sports conversations, Be vulnerable to somebody. Share an issue of life with them that you're going through and not just with anybody, Make sure it's the right person. I can, I can help you. I'm going to whisper into the mic. I can help you do that. But yeah, We're just, Everybody's in such a fast paced society now and they're just going from this to that and not stopping to smell the roses, So to speak. I love that. I love, Yeah. Connection is such a great thing. And I love how you said to share an issue of life, Talk about life, Talk about the deep stuff, Talk about what you think about what's on your mind, What's on your heart. Like what do you, What keeps you up at night? Sometimes talk about that, Get real and getting real. Doesn't mean you have to be like sobbing and talking about like all of your mental health unless you want to do that. But it's just talking about more than what you had for dinner last night. Talk about the stuff that moves you that, You know, Really excites you or shakes you up, You know, All that good stuff. I love it. I love that. That's such a good one. And April, What is something that you wish everyone knew? I wish everyone knew like, Wow. I wish everyone knew how to love themselves because that is always going to be the first and most important thing you need to do in order to be able to love someone else. I love that. Okay. Now I'm going to throw in another one though. So I thought I was like, Oh, Good. I think this is the last one that I'm going to be stumped on. I think, I don't think you'll be stumped on this one, But I think, Okay, Sue. So I think this is important because we did start off talking about autism. So what is something you wish everyone knew about a child with autism? That they are probably the most innocent people that walk among us. They're so untainted. They don't have all of this junk in their trunk, So to speak of they don't hold grudges like most of us do. And they want to be loved just like everybody else. And they're not people that you should be afraid of because there've been times when I've been walking through the supermarket with my son and he makes weird noises and flaps his arms. And I've seen people move their shoulder up kind of towards their neck, Towards their chin and like they're scared. And I would say, Don't be scared of what you're unfamiliar with, What you don't know about. Instead, Just open up and be willing to talk to that stranger in the grocery store and ask them a question or engage in conversation. And you'd be surprised what you might learn. I love that. I get almost a little emotional with that because it is such a deep truth and I love how you said, Don't be scared of something you're unfamiliar with. Find the joy in it and just even be present, Be neutral if you can. That was just such a great answer. Such a great answer, April. I loved it. That was really good. Thank you. Now I feel like the next question I'm like, How do I follow that? Because that was so deep and so good. And so now what was a book that changed your life that you would like to recommend? I don't read. I don't read. I watched like TED Talks and stuff. Oh, Share a TED Talk that really like you were like, Go watch this TED Talk today. It was so good. I'm a fan of Brene Brown and vulnerability and empathy. And I just, I love Brene Brown. So I learned about the difference between empathy and sympathy from listening to her in that sympathy is like when you, Somebody says they just lost their child and you're like, Well, The other person says, Well, At least you had a child. The comments of it, Well, At least this, At least you had this in your life because I never had that. And that's sympathy. I don't even think that they say that sympathy, But that's just sounds like complete rudeness to me. Yeah. That sounds like dismissiveness. Like for me, Sympathy is more like, Oh, I feel so bad for you. Oh, Poor her. Right? Yeah. Yeah. But empathy is really just, It's what's going to drive connection. And that is just being able to be present for another person and just let them know you're there for them. You don't have to actually do something to fix them. Like a lot of people want to do like, Oh, I want to fix this for you. Just offer, Like when somebody passes away, Don't do the pretentious bonding and be like, Oh, My prayers and my thoughts are with you and all the canned responses. Just say, You know, I'm so sorry to hear that. What can I do for you? Or just say, I'm here for you if you need me. It doesn't have to be elaborate. Thank you so much for giving what to do instead, Because that is such an important piece of that information is like, Well then what can I do? What is the helpful thing to do? So I really like that. So thank you for sharing that part. I think there's a lot of truth to that too. Just like, But don't say, What can I do if you really don't want to do anything? Oh yes. If you're not open to like doing something, If they reach out to you, Then just say, I'm so sorry. Or I'm sorry to hear that or something like that. But don't offer if you don't really want to offer because sometimes people take you up on it and then you're like, We don't want any of that weirdness going on. So if it's coming from love and you truly want to help. Yes. Okay. Last question, April. What is a piece of advice that you have been given by somebody that runs through the back of your mind? And this could be at any point in your life where you were like, Ooh, That was, I still hear that. I still hear them saying that to me. I have to go with my recent cause my journey recently has been the, Has bared the most fruit. I think what really stays with me is this one liner from my husband, The way you see a person is the way you treat that person. And here's, Here's the important part that stays with me. And especially so if that person is you. I am constantly self checking, Self assessing, Always knowing how I see myself because I know that how I see myself is how I'm going to treat myself. And he's always there to check me on that. It's a call me out on it when I am treating myself badly, Poorly. Yeah. I have a lot of stuff that I can share with the world and it always tends to come out in conversation. These things that I've learned where I hear somebody saying something about themselves and I just know right at the right time, What to say to, To question, Why are you saying that? Because you see that in yourself, But why do you see yourself that way? Cause that's the incorrect way of looking at yourself. You're supposed to treat yourself amazingly. Yes, It definitely, I love that though. That's really good. The way you see a person is how you'll treat a person, Especially yourself. Like that's really, That's a really good one to play in the back of your mind. And you know, Like there's a little trick that I learned that Whitney Cummings does. Do you know Tim Ferriss? I've heard of him. Yes. Okay. So he wrote a book called tool of Titans and it has like all like just little summaries of the interviews that he's done with people and Whitney Cummings was in there and I didn't really, I mean, I've seen her in like a couple of episodes of a TV show, But I didn't really know much more about her or had never really seen your standup or anything, But she was in there and she said, Whenever she needs somebody, Especially if it's a difficult conversation or just like one of the first things she'll always say in her mind is I love you like towards that person. She'll think when she's like interacting with somebody, I love you. And it just changes her whole flow and how she's approaching them. And I was like, Wow, That's really good. And so I started doing that myself. Like if I'm in an interaction with somebody and it's starting to feel, I don't know, Maybe not as good, Or maybe I'm feeling annoyed by something they're saying or something like that. I'll just think I love you. And it totally shifts the way I'm approaching that conversation and how I even feel in it. And so that is like, So if anybody wants to try that yourself, Go ahead. Think Whitney Cummings and Tim Ferriss, But it is like definitely a solid tool that feels like that's not going to work. But if you're sitting in your mind thinking like, Oh, They're annoying. You're just getting more annoyed versus thinking, I love you. It shifts your perspective. So see, You just triggered me because of conversation. Um, Kyle sees says pretty much the same thing that whenever you're going through something that is uncomfortable or you're like not feeling it and you're like, Or you want to say, I hate that. But instead at the end, Say, And I love that. And I do that at work when I'm annoyed at somebody or gosh, These people are aggravating me today. And I go, And I love that. And it's just, You can't help but smile. Yeah. Kyle sees is really good. I like his stuff. That's awesome. And I love that. That's great. Well, April, This has been such a fun conversation and really helpful. I know it feels weird to say it was a fun conversation because you shared some really heavy stuff. Um, But I say it's fun in the, I hope you know what I mean by it was like a fun, Like I really enjoyed spending this time with you and hearing just a small part of your story and that you're able to hopefully some somebody who's listening was like, Dang, I know I'm going through stuff. And now I know somebody else who's been going through some really hard stuff had, Like I said, Like that long winter and to not isolate myself, To find support, To trust when it feels like good support and to trust when it feels like somebody isn't actually being supportive and just honor that and look for the helpers and look for the good and do your own personal journey, Do your own work as well, Because that was a big theme of yours as well. Like to, You got to do the work. You can't skip that part too. No, Not at all. And I see too many people who just want the quick answers. And I say, I'll probably butcher my own one liner that I came up with, But there's, There's people who want, You're going to like this one. If I don't butcher it, There's people who want, Um, Drive through answers to gourmet questions. Ooh, I want the quick, Give me the quick, But you know, The question is really deep and it's complex and it requires like a, You know, A gourmet answer, But they want the drive through answer. Like just give it to me and put it in a bag and let's go. And you have to be invested in, In your personal growth and you have to put in the time. And if, If that means cutting out a couple of games of candy crush and general hospital like I did, Do it, Do it, Do it. That's right. I had to delete candy crush from my phone because it was getting in the way of me doing things I needed to do. So that's real life example right there. But I love that. And that is so true. And honestly, Like, I really think if you break it down, The quick answer is do the work. That's it to the work show for yourself every single day, Do the work you got to, And man, April, This is so fun. And if you do call you and what are, When you do, Or if you do, If you hear from him, Whatever we should, We can do a follow up and see how you are, If you want to, If it was like an experience where you're like, Oh, This would be cool to share, But if it's not, Then you know, We could follow up on another topic. Okay. Okay. Well, Thank you so much, April. This was so fun. Ditto. Thank you for having me. Bye everyone. Toodles. Thanks for listening to today's episode. Remember, You're welcome to download, Share and subscribe. As always, You can connect with me through Instagram at beautifully changed or through my blog at beautifully changed. Com. I'm sending so much love and positivity your way. Remember, You are enough, The world needs you and you make a positive difference. Now go out there and create your best life. Bye.