Learning From The Classics Podcast: Stoicism In Literature

This track is a recording of my weekly LIVE PODCAST, Learning from the Classics, dated April 25th 2025.

In this LIVE session, I will relate prompts from Classic Literature to the challenges we face every day. There is a certain sense of security in understanding that some struggles are universal and not personal to ourselves. In such novels, there is also a reconciliation to be had with souls we cannot and will not ever meet but who teach us so much.

All LIVES are available week to week on a playlist.

Transcript

Okay we're going to get started.

I'm going to um I'm going to begin by saying that almost qualifying what I'm doing here by saying that literature is therapy and this is why I am so invested and I hope you are too.

Today in each live moving forwards we're going to look at two questions and those questions um will be focused on how female authors have established female characters to set a stoic example that's translatable.

We're going to translate that to our experiences in the 21st century.

Okay so stoicism a philosophical concept that transcends time in its core principles.

So those principles remain relevant and applicable across different eras and cultures.

While the specific historical context and challenges faced by Stoics may vary and obviously they will because a long time has a lot of time has passed since the 5th century when Zeno the Greek philosopher established the Stoic philosophy and now.

But the underlying principles virtue,

Self-control,

Acceptance of what's beyond our control those principles remain the same.

So we can draw on this philosophy and this is something that has always resonated with me.

The idea of the mastery of the things that we can control and the acceptance of those things that we cannot in order to create an internal constant.

Because without an internal constant we can experience a tumultuous life and there are enough influences externally every day pulling on our energy.

So for us to maintain it's a bit like maintaining that biological 37 degrees you know that constant temperature that we need in order to survive and function properly and respire and all of our biological internal chemical reactions to take place it's the same principle.

So we need that constant so this is what Stoicism is and what is not spoken about enough and what I'm trying to do is promote the idea of looking into literature specifically female authors and the characters they have created in order to relate it to us as women.

So to recap Stoicism is focusing our and cultivating an inner strength resilience our resilience to external forces through virtue which is obviously not tied to a specific time period.

The core tenets of Stoicism focusing on what we control and accepting the inevitable.

Okay so in order to adapt this to modern life we look at the experiences we have and we need some guide.

There are many guides that are available many voices available that are masculine and none that I can see that are feminine apart from mine.

So this is where I am starting I am flying the flag.

Now so we're going to look at the Blue Stocking Group.

The Blue Stocking Group was something that was established in the mid 1700s and the Blue Stocking Group was something that was influential to those authors we are looking at we are listening to I am reading to you so it's quite significant in that it was predominantly a female group constructive of and incorporated by influential women of that time and it referenced Stoicism they were Christians but it referenced Stoicism frequently there was an interest by the women in that group and there were some men in Stoicism and this was used to create a set of core values and principles if you like and that looking at that we can say right as women we can say okay I can see there is more recent obviously it's not it's not going back as far as you know it's a more recent adaptation of the core philosophy and by reading literature we can say ah these characters within these novels have been constructed to practice this philosophy I can that's a working example something that I can relate to so that's where we are at with these sessions okay so we've got Elizabeth Carter and what she did she was a core member of the Blue Stocking Group okay and as I said it's a network of intellectual women known for their literally philosophical pursuits they were well to do we have to remember they were already influential already coming from a place of wealth and privilege which is relevant which afforded them the time to discuss these ideas okay but they were well connected with the male philosophers of the time and the artists and writers and so on which afforded them a voice and if we look back in history the voices the history that's been written is essentially by those with the power to write it wasn't written by the poor man or the poor woman so you've got Elizabeth Carter you've got Catherine Macaulay amongst others but Elizabeth Carter was a core member of the society because she was the one who took the discourses of Epictetus and she translated them so Epictetus a stoic philosopher and her life's work was translating this heavy volume of instruction to popular speak to something that was more consumable by those in the 18th century and she was highly regarded for this by both men and women she was also an influential writer poet classicist and polymath she had a lot going for her so she completed that translation in 1758 and we should also remember that being a christian some of the some of the principles of Epictetus didn't quite align with her christianity so where when you translate something you would have some of those were omitted so that the translation would have been open to debate shall we say she did that for a reason so again remember everything you read if it has been translated is still open to interpretation there's still room for maneuver the power of the person who translated it has to be recognized but essentially she did an amazing thing so why is this relevant because the blue stocking group as i've said before well they set the foundations for then jane austen the bronte sisters george elliott okay who was also a woman to then write their novels and consider a philosophy beyond and what they had considered before so it went beyond religion and any form of education that a woman or man who is an author can adopt be influenced by is relevant so that's why the blue stocking group were relevant and this is um so they were seen as a line of descent if you like from the blue stocking group and when we read their works we can see in it other ideas coming through not just the reinforcement of the patriarchal vision of woman existing as someone who is merely an element of and an adornment of patriarchal society but actually something in their own right okay and so this philosophy championed by the blue stocking group the stoic philosophy was the foundation upon which these authors created their works so when looking at any author any work that you are interested in reading you have taken inspiration from be aware that there is a line if it's a classic piece of classic literature this is i need to qualify that um there is a line of influence and a set of foundations that have been put in place by what they have read before they wrote what they wrote but ideas don't just happen and then become classic pieces of literature there's a little bit more to it than that so i'm going to go back to the the first question um of the day the first question of the day is how to decide which choice to adopt or which path to take each day so every day we're going to have small choices we're going to have what to eat what to wear um and then we can have larger choices who do we spend our time with how do we invest our money which practice should we put energy into um and with each of those choices we need to approach it if we are practicing stoics we need to approach it in a logical way so obviously there are going to be emotions attached with some choices we make probably not so much with the smaller choices so the eating the wearing this although eating can be really connected with the emotions and wearing the wearing of clothes okay but what we are promoting as stoics is um the difficult path the challenging path so with the smaller choices you have that shall i eat another chocolate biscuit or shall i have a cup of tea and then you say to yourself logically right how am i going to feel after indulging overindulging what is that going to mean for me for the rest of the day for example so that's trivial questions about you could say trivial topics there's smaller choices we make but still they can be approached with the same philosophy okay so if we look at the stoic philosophy you've got the inner circle of choice haven't you the things you can control the choices you make the the amount of information you have available to you the knowledge you have even on such a thing right what you are consuming what you choose to put into your body for example this is just about a smaller choice here and then you have the external so and you know your knowledge of how that's going to make you feel and then you have the external um forces which are well there's a packet of biscuits are still laying there what am i going to do can't really do very much about that existing it's always going to be there the temptation will always be there so what can i do i could control how i react to that temptation for example again they are smaller choices with larger choices life-changing choices everything becomes elevated a thousandfold but we can start with the small choices according to marcus aurelius choosing wisely means aligning your actions with virtue this involves choosing the more difficult path it is easier to eat the biscuit absolutely um if you have any allergies or if you have for example i do i do not eat bread i do not eat anything with wheat in very few carbohydrates because i would be ill for about eight weeks if i did that if i overindulge so i can manage something very small infrequently but if i overindulge with that it would have a knock-on effect and i would be ill for a considerable amount of time so it's a more difficult path to say no of course it is we're not saying it's going to be easy but the more you say no the easier it gets cultivate a stoic perspective perspective embrace your unique path embrace who you are understand your limitations and work with those those are the things you can control okay so we're thinking rationally we're not thinking emotionally i feel bad i've just got to put something else in there we are trying to rationalize it and say guess what that's going to make you feel worse think about the outcome of your choice visualize the outcome and say right that's the knowledge i'm working with now what am i going to choose to do your circle of choice your inner circle that's what you have the power over everything else external forces you do not accept okay so aurelia said if someone is able to show me that what i think or do is not right i will happily change for i seek the truth by which no one was ever truly harmed it is the person who continues in his self-deception and ignorance who is harmed and that might well be self-inflicted if you choose to deny yourself the truth you are harming yourself and that goes back to the week before last when i spoke of virtue the establishment of our own set of morals values understandings we establish those and we're mindful of them we are mindful of our limitations when we make reasoned decisions so the circle of choice or we call it the dichotomy of control the idea we have control over our own thoughts beliefs desires and actions but not over external events other people's opinions or outcomes now this is more relevant when we're looking at larger questions larger choices of the day will be relating to other people and other situations externally that can influence us and affect our well-being so within our circle of choice judgments desires actions outside external events other people's actions and the results of those actions that are not in our control so stoic philosophy is teaching us to embrace the more challenging path okay actions that are useful and aligned with our own strengths is it in my interest to do that now this sounds very straightforward but of course when you have so many conflicting thoughts and feelings it's not actually that straightforward that's this is why we have to be mindful of our philosophy and hold on to that inner core set of values and understandings and limitations and try and navigate life ever mindful of that okay so how to decide which choice to make is the question let's look at what Charlotte Bronte did with that so if you don't know the story of Jane Eyre she set this girl up as somebody who comes across a lot of challenges from a very early age she's a little girl she's an orphan she is abused and rejected she ends up in a school where she continues to be abused but she finds a friend then she leaves the school she goes to be a governess and she meets somebody called mr Rochester she has faced many challenges and she has learned through the example of a friend Helen Burns to be less emotionally reactive to those challenges and approach external challenges with fortitude strength and a clear set of morals and values and understanding of who she is okay so she goes to this mr Rochester's house and she falls in love with mr Rochester she knows she needs to leave because what's happened is mr Rochester is actually married she doesn't have a complete understanding what the future is going to hold for her she doesn't know what to do remember she's an orphan she doesn't know she has any other choice and yet she's in this place okay she's in Thornfield she's with him everything's okay but she finds out that he's already married to this mad woman in the attic so she's taking a leap into the unknown she knows she has to leave because he's asked her to be her his mistress and she said no now this is the 18th century she hasn't got a lot of choices here she hasn't got anywhere else to go what's she going to do she has a strong understanding of who she is she's going to take a leap into the unknown and she's going to leave she doesn't know where she's going she doesn't take anything with her that she has obtained from her relationship albeit a friendship with mr Rochester she just trusts her moral instincts and a vision she experiences obviously this is an extreme she has nowhere to go and yet she goes anyway now this is an example of a stoic approach to her very difficult choice a big choice a life um choice but Charlotte Bronte is setting her up as somebody who makes that choice with fortitude with virtue and and is true to herself Jane's decision is guided by her moral conscience and her understanding of right and wrong even though that means sacrificing her relationship with mr Rochester so inside of her circle of choice she's got these morals and values she's holding on to them with all her might but outside of that circle of choice she doesn't know what's going to happen as a result and she takes the leap of faith anyway a famous quote about Jane Eyre leaving Rochester is I am no bird and no net ensnares me I am a free human being with an independent will which I now exert to leave you and this emphasizes her newfound sense of independence and her refusal to be confined by either a societal expectation or Rochester's desire I am my own person Charlotte Bronte has set Jane Eyre up as somebody who is very well aware of who she is she has faced challenges and she will face them again okay so this is chapter 27 Charlotte is leading by example she's establishing Jane as a woman of principle regardless of the personal cost and that's why this is monumental um in literary terms because this was a time where women just did what the hell they were told think of his misery she says to herself think of his danger look at his state when left alone soothe him save him and love him who in the world cares for you or who would be injured by what you do and then her reply to herself is I care for myself the more solitary the more friendless the more unsustained I am the more I will respect myself what an example this is setting an example for us in the 21st century when trying something new take that leap of faith if you think you can't do it no there's someone out there who's confidently doing it and they're doing it wrong and they have no plans to do it any better so believe in your excellence as much as they believe in their mediocrity just do it anyway dive in what have you got to lose you have your own set of morals beliefs and understandings of who you are and it is your job as a woman to hold on to those it is our job as women and we are naturally stoic we are not celebrated for being stoic but we are we go through if we have had children we go through childbirth many physical huge demands on ourselves which take their toll and we suffer in silence and we plow on we show up for everybody all the time we are amenable we are accepting we are kind we are forgiving all stoic qualities and yet there's nobody flying the flag for that we do it anyway question number two how to react when a senior family bigger says something designed to upset us so as i said two questions per week this is question number two i will be looking at elizabeth bennett for this question so if you don't know the story of pride and prejudice elizabeth bennett comes from a challenging situation where she has many sisters an older sister very slightly older she's the second sister and younger siblings and some of them don't behave very well all the time the older sisters i'd say quite stoic in her approach to life and her relationships and then you have elizabeth who is very sure of what she's willing to accept and what she won't accept and she is also at times a little judgmental of others but she retains a sense of who she is and what she represents which is a gentleman's daughter and how she should behave at all times and she doesn't ever stoop low enough to belittle herself in front of others even though she is called upon to do that frequently by her family and her mother who are irresponsible i would say to say the least so elizabeth her love matches mr darcy but mr darcy is one of these unattainable characters and she is unattainable to him because he has offended her very early on in the novel but then essentially it comes full circle as every romance should and she realizes he is something different and she falls in love with him he has an aunt called lady catherine de beurre who is obviously a lady and she holds a very a position of very high status socially speaking and she provokes elizabeth she provokes her because she believes her nephew darcy to be too good for elizabeth and she's not going to have it darcy has proposed to elizabeth he is in love with elizabeth but he does not know that elizabeth feels the same lady catherine comes to see elizabeth and she challenges her and elizabeth reacts now if you haven't heard the story as i say listen to my tracks the whole story is there word for word elizabeth's reaction to lady catherine's provocations is characterized by a refusal to be controlled so jane austen sets this main protagonist up as a woman who defends her family even though she knows them in the wrong who's maintaining her own agency her own independence and refuses to be controlled by the aristocracy groundbreaking stuff for the time and she stands firm in her refusal because lady catherine asks her to promise and to confirm that she would not marry mr darcy um if she were asked and she refuses to confirm that so she's refusing to placate somebody who is seen as a social she is socially inferior to and what she says is i will make no promise of the kind which shows her refusal to be dictated to and she defends her family's honor and her own position and she maintains a cool and distant demeanor which is key which i love because that's part of the stoic philosophy as stoics we practice that mastery that control of the situation by refusing to be drawn into it and there are characters within life within in every day that we will come across that will try and do that be they family members be they people that close to us they cannot settle unless they've drawn us in and it is our job as stoics and as women who are amenable and impressionable and feel emotions deeply it's our job to protect our inner core and by our actions say no we do that by maintaining this this level of calm okay it's like a homeostatic level it's something that you cannot waver and when you practice that in any given interaction with another human being and they become aware of your boundaries and they become aware of your level-headedness they will back away with difficulty depending on the character sometimes it really infuriates them but it doesn't matter how they're behaving because you are maintaining which is what happened with lady Catherine de Bourgh she was furious but Elizabeth wasn't having it even though inside Elizabeth was in knots so she keeps the conversation about the rumor of her engagement to Mr Darcy a secret she's saying look you know he in her mind he has asked me to marry him but i know it's probably nothing's going to happen from it now because it's all gone horribly wrong but i am not going to put this woman's mind at rest i have my own inner turmoil going on here and how dare she come and try and attack me as if i've got enough going on so this reaction to Lady Catherine's provocations is written in such a perfect way to describe the stoic ideal and this is what Jane Austen is promoting and this is what i am promoting as well okay i'm going to go on to the comments now any comments um they're the two questions for this week if you have anything that you are you know any questions you are seeking to be answered or anything that you don't quite understand or you can always message me on my group chat um keep listening to the tracks and sharing the lives if possible the blue stocking group joe says sounds amazing really forward-thinking women fascinated to learn more about them yes i agree interesting to consider the influence of that group on classic books very powerful to consider the control we have how we use it to make choices sometimes how difficult it is many times yeah difficult to decide those choices yeah leap of faith it does take courage joe i agree with you um but it's something we are all called to do it involves courage but i think if you cling on to that understanding of who you are you get more of a sense of a clearer sense of who you're protecting right and a love for that person and a willingness to fly the flag for them and i think we have to remember that part of this is about self-love it is about empowerment it is about holding on to a core understanding of where we are approaching life from and what we are willing to accept and what we not and i think we owe it to ourselves to do that every day in and in the attainment of our higher selves well i'd like to say it did go on 45 minutes even though i thought it'd be quicker today i'd like to say to everybody thank you so much for coming um it really means a lot to see you each week and i am going to be northanger abbey is now in the wings so that will be next week first chapter and i'm going to be looking at george elliott too as i say all these authors have um have that in common that they are influenced by the blue stocking group and they have references to stoicism which is something that is a thread that's running through everything i'm reading robin says the act of not engaging being drawn into others antics you say with coolness is this the same as acting with grace yes i guess so thank you for the encouragement love your readings thank you margaret that's lovely to hear from you okay so i am going to be off now um keep listening and i shall see you same time next week bye

Reviews

Fascinating—sorry I don’t catch these live, I’ll keep trying— do you think in Jane eyre, even though she was being stoic when she left him, was she using religion as an excuse or Vice Versa? Or her decision of righteousness was based in religiosity, then she stoically followed up… fascinating discourse though, thank you!🥰🙏🏼