"Bases Of Psychic Power" Series: Night, Day & Light (5/7)

I studied & practiced with the "Iddhipāda-Vibhaṅga Sutta — An Analysis Of The Bases Of Power" for about 4 months daily. These Roads To Power are desire, persistence, intent, and discernment. Most of this 7-part podcast series are my considerations, questions, experiences, explorations, suggestions, interpretations & practices with this sutta. Part 5 develops these powers via immersion into the same features, attributes, & signs by day as by night and vice versa as well as how to brighten the mind.

Transcript

Perceptions of Night,

Daytime,

And Light.

This is part five in a seven-part series on studying and practicing with the Idipada,

Fifanga Sutta,

An analysis of the bases of power.

For the perceptions of day and night,

I'll read two different translations of this section,

Partial,

And then speak without notes.

First,

In how does a monk dwell by night as by day and by day as by night?

There is the case where a monk at night develops the base of power endowed with concentration founded on desire and the fabrications of exertion by means of the same modes,

Permutations,

And signs and themes that he uses by day.

And by day he develops the base of power endowed with concentration founded on desire and the fabrications of exertion by means of the same modes and signs and themes that he uses by night.

This is how a monk dwells by night as by day and by day as by night.

The second translation,

In how does a mendicant meditate as by day as by night and by night as by day,

It's when a mendicant develops the base of psychic power that has immersion due to enthusiasm,

An act of effort with the same features,

Attributes,

And signs by day as by night,

And they develop it with the same features,

Attributes,

And signs by night as by day.

That's how a monk,

Our mendicant,

Meditates as by day,

So by night,

As by night,

So by day.

So this is repeated for each of the other three bases of power,

Roads to power,

With persistence or energy,

And then intent or mind,

And then discernment,

And the other translations given for discernment.

So right away we have various elements here.

We're dealing with the idipadas and concentration,

Or the other one,

Translation is immersion,

And then it's founded on each of the idipadas,

And then the one kind of constant running through all this is the fabrication of exertion or act of effort,

Because the Buddha was big on energy and effort,

Yeah,

It wasn't for the lazy.

And then we get into even more detailed things that kind of throw me for a loop here.

There's three different things here.

The Nisar Bhikkhu's translation gives the same modes,

Permutations,

In brackets,

And signs,

And themes,

While Sujatus,

Bhikkhu's Sujatus,

Uses features,

Attributes,

And signs.

So both agree with signs as a translation.

We've got modes and themes for one,

Features and attributes for the other,

And then of course the last one,

Day and night.

So all these different elements.

So I'll just start with the first one,

With desire,

Or Sujatus's enthusiasm.

So the question that occurred to me with this is,

Well,

What am I enthusiastic about,

Or where is there enthusiasm and desire in the daytime,

And what and where is there enthusiasm and desire at night?

Before I get into this,

Another quick aside is that this is my current understanding,

Obviously,

Up until now,

And these reflections are just up until now,

Because our world is rapidly changing around the time I'm speaking this,

And has been for probably two years now,

Even more so than usual it seems,

In January of 2022.

So if I just have to look at desire in my own experience,

Enthusiasm in my own experience,

Of course it changes and has changed throughout the year.

Where I used to desire some things,

Oh,

I no longer desire,

And when I was enthusiastic about ones I'm no longer enthusiastic about.

Now of course these can change,

They seem to be more of a spiritual bent nature of work,

But just some examples are friendship,

Especially spiritual friendship,

If we can use that word spiritually.

Those who are interested in the type of things I'm interested in,

Knowing suffering and the end of suffering,

Knowing truth and reality,

How to better oneself and help others,

Help oneself and help others,

Which goes right along with those previous two.

And those are also other desires and enthusiastic things of study and practice that involve and work that involves those things as well.

So I guess we could look at the opposite,

Of what I'm not enthusiastic about or desirous about.

I guess it would be kind of the contrary to those.

Basically needless distractions,

That's just a perception,

When I can't see the value and the opportunity in everything for what I mentioned before,

And seeing where whatever occurs or doesn't occur can either lead towards the aforementioned or away from the aforementioned.

So then we notice enthusiasm and desire in others and can apply that to what I've just mentioned here.

So when we go into that further,

How does this apply to day and night?

So I would say eventually these will maybe start more naturally blending into less distinctions of day and night.

So right now,

Those desires and enthusiasms perhaps would be more outwardly displayed during the day and more inwardly displayed or ideally inwardly displayed,

Carried out,

Just contemplated,

Reflected on at night.

So then when we go into looking at using the same modes,

Permutations,

Signs and themes,

Or features,

Attributes and signs by day as by night to mix these translations,

How do those come in?

A mode,

A sign and a theme,

Features and attributes.

A mode is a way of doing things.

Things are indicators of something else.

Themes are commonalities amongst occurrences,

Perhaps one translation or way of looking at it.

Features,

What features do day and night have?

Attributes,

What does one attribute to day?

What does one attribute to night?

And all this in the context of enthusiasm and desire.

So there's a lot there to try to sort through or maybe we don't even need to sort through it.

The audience and I here hold this in awareness for contemplation.

So what are some of the modes that happen in daytime?

Well,

I'm assuming it would be different for monastics than lay people,

Although I'm sure there's plenty of commonalities between the two and I can't speak towards monastic life,

So much other than living a life of solitude but still within society or maybe more solitude than normal but not so much anymore with the lockdowns as people are getting a taste of that.

So modes during the day would be going out,

Doing things when commercial businesses are open,

Places where people gather,

Things that people can do during the day outside on electronics,

Inside communicating with people who have business hours,

Appointments,

Get togethers virtually or in real life.

And so perhaps this would speak to spiritual friendship.

So a daytime sign would be of course light and this plays into the rest of the sutta,

Sunlight,

Artificial light if indoors,

If not access to the sun,

Movement outside of people,

More activity in general,

More action,

More interaction,

Work,

Careers,

All sorts of activity and themes.

I guess that would cover plenty of themes.

I'm just going to say that covers pretty much the features and attributes of day for me that I can know at least externally.

Internally,

It seemed to be somewhat going along with that unless doing practice or study.

And how about by night,

Kind of night modes are there.

We've got more rest,

Right?

More winding down,

Maybe relaxation.

People are maybe getting intimate,

Unwinding,

Maybe doing chores that they didn't have time for during the day.

There also seems to be maybe a little bit more criminal activity at night,

Not exposed to daylight,

Maybe more ill-mindedness in general,

Or maybe not if there's sleep of course is another huge thing.

At night,

There's dreaming,

Rest,

Maybe there's nightlife if that's still going on,

People going out and partying,

Probably not as much now.

And so those are also some of the signs and themes,

Features and attributes of night.

So from a lay perspective,

Which may be more challenging than living in an environment that's somewhat stable and a lot of the unwholesome ways of the world are being secluded from,

So I don't have a lot of the gross challenges to deal with.

And so how in lay life could this be adopting some of these modes,

Signs and themes,

Features and attributes of the day into the night and those of the night into day?

And how could it be practical to do so?

And why would you even want to do that?

Well,

I'll get into other areas that are maybe more metaphysical about this question in other episodes,

On other episodes of this podcast series.

One thing is limitation and lack of limitation.

So if one is tied into these just ways of the world that seem to operate by day and the same as by night,

They're kind of locked into certain limitations because of going along with the flow of the world.

So maybe if we start to like mix and match these,

Then there tends to be more possibilities open up while routines and ritualistic behavior almost and certain habits can be helpful in providing a sense of stability,

Regularity and knowing what will happen in this veneer of safety.

It's very helpful for some.

For some it kind of turns into a rut,

But perhaps what was talked about here,

Is talked about here could help loosen the bonds of some of those rituals,

Habits,

Routines,

And hopefully with the concentration built in,

It won't be as destabilizing for ourselves and others.

Anyone choosing to look into this practices.

So now moving on to the persistence,

Iti pada.

So what persists during the day and night,

Night and day?

For me,

Persistence would be really seems to be noticeable and called forth when almost forced to do something,

When there's either a deadline or a need or inspiration strikes.

So if I get inspired about a work topic,

I usually persist with that.

A lot of times that happens mostly during the day,

But sometimes at night,

Wanting to really get it done.

So staying at it,

Persisting at it,

Sometimes wanting to help others or making commitments to help others,

Committing to following through and then persistence is needed to carry that out.

Certain regular obligations,

Maybe at first persistent,

More persistence is needed and then once that becomes habitual,

Not as much persistence is needed.

How does the world persist?

Kind of in the same ways,

Kind of whatever programs and training they've been done,

They've accomplished,

They have undertaken and so persistence will operate within those lifestyles and obligations to whatever degree and causes and conditions make possible or not possible.

And so persistence at night,

If we're all adults here,

Perhaps sometimes it's with lovemaking,

Doesn't seem to be too much persistence needed in sleeping or too much persistence needed in relaxing.

Maybe there's persistence needed in staying indoors or maybe that's a surrendering of persistence,

I'm not sure.

Or maybe it's the opposite of really need to persist in getting and staying outside at night because there's no really desire to do so.

So intent.

Now the third nidipada,

What are some of the intents that seem to be operating much of the day?

For me,

Going back to what I said earlier,

Kind of with the desire,

Those seem to be founded on like intents.

And for me,

It seems this actually kind of starts at intent because if I have the intent and can see the power of intent,

How most of our thoughts,

Words and actions are driven by intent,

Even if it's an automatic or habitual thought,

Speaking or action,

At one point there was an intent involved.

Even if it was learned from our parents and then they learned it from their parents or wherever it started,

Something happened where somebody made an intention to think,

Speak and or act in a certain way due to some cause and condition.

From my understanding of this anyway.

And so I can become aware of those then.

I can see if it's a wise intent,

Right intent or if it will lead towards our benefit and long-term happiness and the benefit and long-term happiness of others or not.

If we have that discernment to know that that's that way and that'll tie into the next one.

But this intent during the day,

Again for me would be truth,

Wisdom,

Kindness,

These core values,

Being free,

Courageous,

Being of service,

This constant recalling of that intent and this is where mindfulness comes in to remember those,

Remembering of that,

Having that presence to remind of this.

Then during the night,

Such intense,

Intense,

Intense,

Turn more inward and reflective perhaps.

The key is weaving this into every moment.

So where our thoughts,

Speech and actions are derived from this,

They spring forth from this.

And when that commitment and faith is there,

Then it doesn't necessarily have to be in mind all the time.

It can just inform thoughts,

Speech,

Actions when the mindfulness isn't as present.

And this is also where the precepts help on this too,

Having a firm ethical basis from which to operate from.

But one way to look at it at night too is sleep.

Of course we all need the right amount of sleep for us,

But if we're on an awakening path,

Realizing awakening,

You know how much is our nighttime sleep kind of symbolic of leading away from awakening,

Realizing awakening.

We look at being free externally and internally during the day and night and how is that?

Is there areas where I can flip-flop the two to boost each one?

Moving now on to discernment,

The fourth idipada.

So what are some of the modes,

Permutations,

Signs and themes,

Features and attributes of discernment in the day and night?

This word permutation too,

I like this.

If something permeates something,

It goes all the way through it,

Right?

So something that goes all the way through the daytime.

And daytime,

These perceptions of course,

Again it's important to notice these perceptions we're working with,

Which can be very malleable,

Wieldy.

And so what is something that's just a persistent permeation throughout the daytime in regards to discernment,

If I'm approaching this right?

And then concentration or immersion factors in here too.

Well you know,

During the daytime it's daylight usually,

Lots of parts of the world,

Some parts of the world not so much.

But that perception of daylight is pretty much constant during the day,

Whether we're aware of it or not.

At least to some degree perhaps.

That's one way we can discern night and day,

The movement of the sun through the sky ever so slightly,

But how many of us really look up into the sky that often during the day and night?

How often do we become aware of daylight,

Darkness,

Either outside or inside structures?

What about in meditation?

How would this help?

What are some other persistent perceptions that are operating internally and externally in the daytime?

Well,

In the daytime,

And I guess at night too,

People are constantly,

Usually either crying out for love or showing love.

Crying out for love may be showing ego agendas,

Programs,

Or carrying them out,

Promoting certain ones,

Disregarding others with more external activity again during the day.

And where do we make discernments at the day?

What are some of the signs we can discern in the daytime?

Themes,

Features,

And attributes.

So some of these I talked about earlier,

So I won't repeat them anymore.

Now how do we discern our use or muscle of discernment for the benefit in this context?

So if we don't even know how the world,

Or especially ourselves,

How I can tell night from day,

What's going on with me more so during the day,

More so during the night,

Then there's little chance to go as by day,

As by night,

And by night,

As by day.

So distinguishing,

Discriminating,

Knowing the difference,

Ironically,

In order to be able to swap out the two,

Or invert the two,

Or flip the two,

Using some of those,

Or knowing some of those differences in the daytime,

And night,

And night,

And day,

Being aware of these.

Really a mind-blowing thing,

And kind of a wake-up call to see and know how much we don't see and know about how things operate in the day,

How things operate at night,

Or at least we think we know on the surface.

But then when we try to interpose the two,

It kind of scrambles things up a little bit.

And I quickly realized that what I thought I knew,

Especially what I thought I knew was possible,

Is seen in a whole different light,

So to speak.

And so that's my kind of spontaneous rambling without my notes on the perceptions of day and night.

This section on light,

The perception of light,

And daylight is likely one of the more straightforward passages in this whole sutta.

Maybe not,

Though,

With the 32 parts of the body.

So just taking the two different translations here and riffing on them without any notes.

And how,

With an open and unenveloped heart,

Does a mendicant develop a mind that's full of radiance?

It's when a mendicant has properly grasped the perception of light,

And has properly grasped the perception of day.

That's how,

With an open and unenveloped heart,

A mendicant develops a mind that's full of radiance.

And that's the Sutta Central translation by Bante Sujato.

This next one from Thena Sarabiku.

And how does a monk,

By means of an awareness open and unhampered,

Develop a brightened mind?

There is the case where a monk has the perception of light,

The perception of daytime,

At any hour of the day,

Well in hand and well established.

This is how a monk,

By means of an awareness open and unhampered,

Develops a brightened mind.

So both these words of radiance and brightness,

They're pretty comparable.

As far as my understanding goes,

As far as my current understanding goes,

So the main comparisons here are the perception of light grasped properly,

Contrasted with having the perception of light well in hand,

Well established,

And the same with daylight.

So the main question here is,

How does one properly grasp the perception of light?

What's the unproper or not proper grasping of the perception of light?

So if this question can be answered,

Then I think that translation is fairly helpful.

But then we go into well in hand,

Well established,

With the perception of light.

Well,

That seems a little bit more descriptive,

But how do you have the perception of light,

Perception of daytime,

At any hour of the day,

By the way,

Well in hand and well established?

Well,

Any hour of the day is interesting here too.

So for dealing with the previous section of night and day,

Day and night perceptions of night and the day and day and the night,

Well this adds another layer of light on top of our,

In addition to or under or throughout both day and night.

So this one for me was particularly interesting to practice at night,

Obviously,

Where the perception of light comes primarily internally.

It's more noticeable then because not flooded with external light.

A lot of people talk about an internal light that they can see when meditating,

Certain meditations.

Then of course we have this notion some call false light,

Which I'm not going to go into depth here.

Maybe it might be interesting to note artificial light from like a fluorescent light versus natural daylight that's maybe not too bright,

Maybe not too dim.

So when we talk about well in hand,

Well established,

Again well in hand would be something that's ready to go.

There's some sense of immediate agency if something's in your hand,

Some amount of influence to it,

With it,

And well established.

Guessing this would mean like think of a big business that's really established,

A huge mega name that's been around for years and years and years.

So I would think maybe Toyota would be a well established car brand currently in 2022.

So how would you establish the perception of light well?

What would be the opposite of that?

How could you establish perception of light that's not well?

Is the difference discernible?

And can the importance be detected of well versus the opposite?

And why is it important?

And how does this relate to a brightened mind or a mind that's full of radiance?

And then we throw in daytime into the mix as well.

What is the perception of light,

The perception of daytime?

It would be observing phenomena and saying or knowing,

Labeling,

Calling.

Oh,

That's light.

Oh,

That's daytime.

Now is this the same for everybody?

My guess would be probably not.

Is there a lot of consistency in this amongst people?

Oh yeah,

Lots.

But it's those little differences that make all the difference.

At the time of this recording,

I have an open call out for a podcast just asking two simple questions.

What is light and how do you know?

Perhaps such an episode will facilitate listeners brightened,

Mind full of radiance.

It's worth noting here,

An open and unenveloped heart that reminds me of a teacher mentioning the true heart's release.

And the other translation here is awareness,

Open and unhampered.

So we're talking about the heart and awareness here.

I have to look at the translation again,

But maybe it's citta or maybe not.

I don't know yet.

The height and full maturation of a heart and mind seems like this is it.

Trying to come up with anything beyond this other than completely realized liberation.

And of course,

Such a brightened mind and heart full of radiance,

Open and unhampered,

Unenveloped is fertile ground for realizing awakening,

Liberation,

Release.

So this is the part with my notes of the sutta that deals with perceptions of night,

Daytime,

Light.

It involves the portion.

And how does a monk dwell by night as by day and by day as by night?

There is the case where a monk at night develops the base of power endowed with concentration,

Founded on desire and the fabrications of exertion by means of the same modes,

Permutations and signs and themes that he uses by day.

And by day he develops the base of power endowed with concentration,

Founded on desire and the fabrications of exertion by means of the same modes and signs and themes that he uses by night.

This is how a monk dwells by night as by day and by day as by night.

And how does a monk by means of an awareness open and unhampered develop a brightened mind?

There is the case where a monk has the perception of light,

The perception of daytime at any hour of the day,

Well in hand and well established.

This is how a monk by means of an awareness open and unhampered develops a brightened mind.

And then the above is repeated for persistence,

Intent and discrimination,

The other three yeti pata.

And how does a mendicant meditate as by day so by night,

As by night so by day?

It's when a mendicant develops the basis of psychic power that has immersion due to enthusiasm and active effort with the same features,

Attributes and signs by day as by night.

And they develop it with the same features,

Attributes and signs by night as by day.

That's how a mendicant meditates as by day so by night,

As by night so by day.

And how,

With an open and unenveloped heart,

Does a mendicant develop a mind that's full of radiance?

It's when a mendicant has properly grasped the perception of light and has properly grasped the perception of day.

That's how,

With an open and unenveloped heart,

A mendicant develops a mind that's full of radiance.

And again here,

The above portion is repeated three more times instead of enthusiasm.

It goes for energy,

Mental development and inquiry,

The other three yeti pata.

So I mostly practice with the former translation which contains more specific detail than the latter.

The latter,

At least for the first part of it,

At least for the second part of it where the second translation just says,

Properly grasp the perception of light and perception of day but doesn't give any more detail on that.

For the time being,

There seems to be three groups of bigger and primary questions about this.

Number one,

Why these instructions?

Why would the Buddha give these instructions?

You can maybe see more about how light equates to radiance in a bright mind.

But why would anyone want to dwell by night as by day and by day as by night?

Is it just to be more awake,

More wakefulness?

Does it have deeper purposes or meanings or benefits?

And then how would it relate to the development of these so-called psychic powers?

And I'll likely speculate on some of that in later parts of this series.

The second group here is,

You know,

How exactly does one do this?

How does one meditate as by day,

So by night,

As by night,

So by day,

To develop the basis of psychic power that has immersion due to enthusiasm and active effort,

Energy and active effort,

Mental development and active effort,

And inquiry and active effort?

Are the translation desire in the fabrications of exertion,

Persistence in the fabrications of exertion,

Intent in the fabrication of exertion,

And discrimination in the fabrications of exertion?

By the way,

If you haven't noticed,

The Buddha was kind of big on exertion and effort.

How exactly does one meditate this way?

Details,

Because not too many details are given here.

And then number three,

For contemplation and meditation on this,

What are the various relative perceptions,

Processes,

And dynamics of,

Breaking this down further,

What are these various relative perceptions,

Processes,

And dynamics of day,

Night,

Night and day,

Day and night,

Light,

Darkness,

Varying degrees and amounts of light and darkness together?

And how about the more uncommon perceptions of daytime during the night,

Nighttime during the day,

Light when dark,

And darkness when light?

So again,

What are the relative perceptions around all those?

What are the processes involved in those?

Perceptual processes,

Mental processes,

Physical sensing processes,

Etc.

And then dynamics that come into play with all those,

Either individually or playing on each other,

Transitioning between the two,

How one might build up some perceptual muscle and progress on some of these,

How might that be done,

And what might be the differences along the way of that training,

And why might that be important?

And then how about the more metaphorical perceptions for light,

Such as awakening,

Knowledge,

Realization,

Benevolence,

Vision,

Illumination,

And then the metaphorical perceptions for darkness,

Like ignorance,

Are those important to consider?

If so,

Why?

So then some more minor questions here.

How do we discern and detect day and night in the body,

Or not even involving the body if you don't want to?

And I would say maybe to venture a guess at that question,

How does one even connect with perceptions to begin with?

And perhaps that's through contact,

Feeling,

Or sensing,

And or active thought.

When there's contact with a perception,

Then we're connecting with that perception and awareness,

Right?

Awareness of that perception is being contacted.

And so it's then an awareness.

Some people might be able to connect with perceptions of day and night through feeling or sensing.

So imagine what does it feel like in general before this training for night and for day?

And some people connect with the world through active thought.

However,

This perhaps can be very challenging because the mind doesn't really stay on track a lot.

It gets distracted easy.

Something else grabs its attention,

Loses.

Certain things lose luster and appeal,

Or importance or seeming importance.

Also with the feeling or sensing,

A lot of times that might be hard to control,

Might not have much choice over that.

And so then breaking down kind of some examples of what some of these modes,

Permutations,

Signs,

Themes,

Features,

And attributes for day might be.

And a few here are sunlight,

You know,

During the day.

Maybe there's activity and energy during the day,

At least of a certain kind.

Maybe there's more mass movement of people,

Animals,

Or many animals.

Maybe more traffic,

Vehicles,

Sounds of birds,

Warmth from sunlight,

Depending on what part of the world you are.

And also depending on the season and location,

Maybe the elements of earth or physical objects and air and movement,

Or the element of air can be represented by movement.

Maybe more prevalent during the day.

So if there's physical objects that can be seen,

Noticed,

And gone after,

Pursued,

Seems to be more easily done in daylight.

And with that pursuit of physical objects,

Doing things,

The air element might come into more play through movement,

People going from object to object.

And maybe there's more and more numerous connections,

But maybe there are more superficial connections amongst fellow human beings during the day.

Hi,

How are you,

How you doing,

Kind of thing.

So some examples are modes,

Permutations,

Signs,

Themes,

Features,

And attributes for night.

Protection.

A lot of people,

Depending on where you're at in the world,

Seek shelter at night for protection from the elements,

Maybe other creatures and humans.

For rest,

A lot of people rest at night.

Comfort might be more comfortable,

Or comfort might be sought more at night.

Of course,

Sleep and stillness at night.

Sounds of insects and night creatures.

And again,

Depending on the season and location,

Maybe the elements of fire,

Warmth and coolness might play more into effect here.

If it's cold out,

Hunker down and stay warm.

Or if it's their extreme heat out,

Then try to cool with an air conditioning system if possible.

Maybe the element of water,

Having a place to go to the bathroom at night if need be.

And this might be more challenging to find in buildings,

Unless you're at home,

Obviously,

With the needed facilities.

But perhaps this might be easier in nature,

Because there's less people around and present outdoors.

And maybe there's fewer but deeper,

More intimate connections between humans at night.

So another question here,

To what significant extent are consciousness and energy involved with these perceptions of day and night and light,

And how are they involved?

One way to frame experience is through consciousness and energy.

So what are their importance when it comes to perceptions like this?

We've got the classic misperception story about mistaking a stick for a snake in low light.

So maybe either there's fear or low light walking through a wooded area.

One sees a stick,

But it's not being perceived as a stick.

Instead one perceives it as a snake.

But upon closer examination,

There's a re-perception,

If that's a word,

A less of a misperception in identifying the object as a stick and not a snake.

So this is more easily done when light is present,

When the proper conditions are there to make more accurate and helpful perceptions in the world.

Then how does that play into the purported outcome in the sutta of these so-called psychic powers?

But one way to perhaps practice with this portion is by holding in awareness one or various perceptions of light and day during night,

And one or various perceptions of night during day as your meditation objects for these two different time periods.

And I found this interesting practicing with this.

The easier one I found was at night,

Meditating on light at night,

Because it seems to fulfill a double role here,

Because one is supposed to properly grasp perception of light and the perception of day,

And these two go together.

And then it's recommended to develop the same features,

Attributes,

And signs by night as by day.

Then light kind of will take care of two birds with one stone,

Perhaps,

To mix a metaphor,

Maybe.

But when it comes to the obverse of this,

By day developing the base of power endowed with concentration founded on echchit-dhisidhipada and the fabrications of exertion by means of the same modes,

Signs,

And themes that one uses by night,

That seems a little more tricky.

So those examples I gave,

While I didn't do this so much,

One could pick any one of these examples that's normally found during the day and meditate on it at night and vice versa,

Or combinations of these,

Or just a general sense or impression at once,

Then noticing some of the things that challenge and hinder this,

How and why the attention gets drawn away from this.

And also opening to other ways,

Obviously,

To approach this and being okay with really being clueless and not really knowing exactly how to go about this.

So giving oneself permission to experiment,

Continue questioning,

Seeking out wisdom and advice,

Instructions on this.

So at times this is kind of a stark and sometimes intense exploration of polarity for me,

Realizing how different and persistent these perceptions of night and day can be,

Of light and the absence of light.

And kind of a minor question here that came up with this is about the jhanas.

Can there be jhanas when using this?

By day he develops the basic power endowed with concentration founded on desire and the fabrications of exertion by means of the same modes and signs and themes that he uses by night.

Or the other translation,

Immersion due to enthusiasm and active effort with the same features,

Attributes and signs by day as by night.

Can there be jhanas using that as the meditation object since immersion and concentration are involved?

I don't know.

I hear some people say jhanas can only be developed in a specific way,

Doing a specific kind of method.

And then I hear things like jhanas can be jhanas around anything,

Like absorption into things that are wholesome and unwholesome.

But do we mean jhanas like the attributes that are really often considered with the first four jhanas,

For instance,

The form jhanas?

Or we just mean that as a generic term for absorption and immersion in certain states of concentration that aren't as specific.

And then the more practical around this,

How does or would prolonged and consistent meditation and dwelling by night as by day and by day as by night influence those one lives with are those who are nearby and are practical measures needed with this?

If so,

What are these practical measures and why would they be needed?

And that's the portion pertaining to the perceptions of night,

Daytime and light in the sutta using my notes.