The Crazy Thought That Keeps A Codependent Addicted To A Narcissist For Approval

In this episode, we unpack the one thought that a codependent person holds onto while in a relationship with a narcissist that keeps them stuck. If you are struggling with communication with a narcissist, it may be time to evaluate your beliefs.

Transcript

So today we're going to be talking about the dynamic between codependence and narcissistic others.

And what's this thing?

Like,

What is this addiction that somebody who has low self-esteem,

Who has suffered abandonment,

Who may be struggling with attachment disorder,

Somebody who has grown up feeling seen but unheard,

Somebody who has been moved around from foster family to foster family,

Somebody who has experienced emotional trauma,

Psychological trauma,

Domestic abuse,

Sexual abuse,

Somebody in society who grows up feeling like they're struggling with a sense of identity,

Who has,

Through the years,

Learned that if they smile instead of cry,

They suffer less abuse in their environment.

Or if they pretend to be happy,

Then they can secure attachments to other people.

People like them if they are people pleasers,

And people don't like them if they're not people pleasers.

And that frustrates them.

Someone who is healthy and who has grown up in a healthy home,

Because if you are unhealthy,

That is not your fault,

That is a consequence.

Someone who is healthy isn't better than you,

It's a cause and effect.

It is karma.

It is healthy mom,

Healthy dad,

Much healthier children.

Unhealthy mom,

Unhealthy dad,

Unhealthier children.

And it's a very simplistic but fair way of looking at what happens in our society and in our families and in our culture.

If I struggle with codependency,

There's a reason.

And as a recovering codependent mother,

I can tell you that my son who struggles with codependency,

It's not his fault.

It's my fault.

It's his father's fault.

If you want to assign blame,

If you want to understand why.

And if you look at me and my life,

You have to take into consideration the adult children of alcoholics that raised me and my grandparents who were alcoholics and one who committed suicide and so on and so on.

And similar is said to be true on my ex-husband's side.

So we're all products of our environment.

And so if I'm struggling with codependency and I am out in society,

Then I have been conditioned to stuff my feelings.

When you stuff your feelings,

You cannot develop an identity.

You don't know who you are.

And that's not your fault.

You don't have boundaries.

And that's not your fault.

So your mental health struggles.

You struggle at work.

You struggle with friendships.

You struggle to say no when you mean no.

You struggle to say yes when you mean yes.

You struggle to laugh out loud when everyone else is laughing out loud.

You second guess yourself in conversations.

You're not even there.

You're anticipating what you should say while anticipating what the person you are speaking to might say.

You're always ahead of yourself or you're always in the past berating yourself.

It's a terrible way to live.

Now,

If you struggle with codependency,

Chances are that you're going to manifest a narcissistic relationship or two in your life.

It may actually even be a pattern in your life where you have narcissistic friends,

You have a narcissistic partner,

You have a narcissistic mother or father or both.

Every way you look,

You're attracting people who take advantage of you.

So energy flows,

Right?

Right?

And so if you think about codependence,

They're constantly giving off energy.

And where does it flow?

It flows into the hearts and the minds and the arms of a taker.

And so we have to look at that.

And without a border and without a boundary of who you are,

You're not going to be able to take care of yourself.

Now,

I want to talk about one of the major issues that we struggle with in codependent narcissistic relationships.

And that is this idea that it is everything is your fault.

If you're a codependent,

Everything is your fault.

You feel over responsible.

You feel guilty for things that you have no control over.

And sadly,

You also manifest a partner who makes you feel guilty for things that you can't control and that you are not guilty of.

So you have this internal negative self-talk,

This internal negative self-impression where everything is your fault.

And then you now have someone from the outside telling you and conditioning you to believe that everything is your fault.

Now,

Inside the mind of somebody who is highly codependent,

It sounds something like this.

If I can just figure out how to say what needs to get said,

He or she will understand me.

If I can find a way to express myself,

Certainly they will understand me.

They will hear me.

They will meet me halfway.

They will love me.

They will connect with me.

They will understand that I'm a good person.

I just want to love them.

I just want to be on the same page with them.

I just want to feel them.

If I can just say what needs to get said,

Then we will be able to get through this.

And that thinking is dysfunctional because a codependent person assumes that the people that they're dealing with think that way.

When you are a codependent,

You very often and you have to be fair.

You have to be fair in your analysis of self.

You have to know whether or not you are a fair person and whether or not you are hearing people or you just expect people to hear you.

So you have to find the middle ground.

But if you were someone who says,

You know what,

I'm beat up by these conversations,

They go round and round,

They're crazy making,

Narcissists are known for their word salads,

For their crazy making communication,

And you're somebody who's like,

I'm done.

Like,

I see that this is a road that goes round and round.

It's a maze and it's confusing.

And you've identified that and you're fair and you know that you've tried to listen and you've thought about their position and it's not coming back.

What you have to do is you have to question the belief that's keeping you stuck,

Which is subconscious.

When you live below the veil as a codependent,

You don't recognize that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing,

Saying the same thing,

Acting the same way and expecting a different result.

So you might feel crazy.

I sure as heck know I did.

My conversations with my ex-husband were the most frustrating experiences of my life.

And we've been apart many,

Many years.

I could pick up the phone,

Have a conversation with him tomorrow and feel just as frustrated as if I was still married to him.

He is wired to not hear me.

If you are not praising him,

He cannot hear you.

If you are not acquiescing,

He cannot hear you.

And so the trauma bonds are associated with periods of time where a narcissist seems to hear you.

But you have to pay attention to when they're hearing you.

If they're hearing you only when you agree,

You're repeating your childhood patterns.

If a narcissist is only kind to you and grateful for you when you are apologetic,

You're repeating your childhood patterns.

The trauma bond is associated with having some intermittent validation and acknowledgement and praise and then losing it when you no longer agree with them or you need to work a situation out or you need to set a boundary or you'd like to be heard or there's a problem with the kids and you need to discuss some serious issue or you're trying to plan a family vacation and you got sick the last time you went to this area of the world and the narcissist still wants to go and you're asking this person to hear you or there just isn't money to buy that car right now and the narcissist doesn't hear you,

Whatever it is,

You need to have someone meet you halfway.

It's not going to happen.

If you are struggling with codependent symptoms and you've come from a dysfunctional childhood,

It's time to stop looking outside of you.

It's time to start looking inside of you.

You're looking for the beliefs that are keeping you stuck.

You're looking for the thoughts that are keeping you stuck.

You're looking for the definition of insanity below the veil of consciousness.

I can tell you that once I stopped looking at my ex-husband,

Once I stopped expecting him to change and I asked myself,

What am I doing wrong here?

What is happening?

What I realized was it was me.

Sure,

He had some personality issues and we just were in a good mix.

Not at all and I was growing resentful and tired and angry after three children and a business and issues with my mother and my father.

Everything felt like the walls were closing in on me and it was through that pain that I realized I can't run away from this anymore.

There aren't enough distractions to help me avoid the reality of my body breaking down.

I was my system,

My temple was breaking down.

It was breaking down from the inside out because of my thought processes that were dysfunctional.

So I was poisoned early on in my childhood to believe that I was not good enough.

I was poisoned very early on in my childhood to seek validation.

I was poisoned very early on to feel powerless,

To feel a sense of shame for who I am and what I was.

There was nothing that I believed that I could do that was good enough.

Shame and guilt was a part of my everyday life.

It was my skin.

And so yes,

You know,

When I met someone I thought,

Well,

If I can gain their approval,

Then maybe I won't feel so much shame.

I didn't realize that shame had been given to me.

It was a sweater.

I call it the S.

O.

S.

The Sweater of Shame.

I didn't realize that the shame was keeping me locked in these trauma-bonded experiences.

That it was shame that helped me sit at that kitchen table like I was rooted there and seeking my ex-husband's approval.

It was shame that kept me thinking,

Lisa,

Just say it different next time.

You're saying it wrong.

He can't hear you.

Figure out how to say it this way.

Right?

I did the same thing with my mom and the same thing with my dad.

I remember being nine years old,

Writing my mom a poem,

Trying to get her to hear me and see me,

Connect with me,

Leaving the poem on her pillow and then being terrified of what she was going to think.

But it was my little prayer that she'll see me and we'll be able to connect.

And when I asked her about it,

I remember I was shivering.

I was standing at the top of the steps and I said,

Mom,

Did you get the note that I left you on your pillow?

She didn't even acknowledge that I had left a poem on my pillow.

She ignored it.

I had to ask her if she got it.

And then she said,

Yes,

I got it.

And then there was crickets.

I had to ask her again.

It was so painful.

I was terrified.

What did she think?

And when I asked her,

What did you think?

And she said,

I read it.

And that was it.

No discussion,

No nothing.

She wouldn't meet me halfway.

My mother had serious,

Serious issues with me.

I was thankful that through her dementia diagnosis,

We were able to move to a plane where I was able to let go and forgive.

And in that space,

I actually felt my mother's love,

Which was very mind bending.

But I was thankful for it.

But through my years,

Through codependent recovery,

Through working at my own mental health and improving my own mental health,

I really had to pay attention to the links that stink that were in my brain,

That were my neural wiring,

That were my conditioned behaviors.

Remember,

Codependency is an identity issue.

You don't know who you are.

It becomes a behavioral issue,

Which is tied to learned patterns of thoughts,

Which show up in our relationships.

So we're stuck not because we're rooted like a tree.

We're stuck because of the programs that are subconscious,

That were created by the programs when we were powerless little children,

When all we wanted to do was love and be loved and that was exploited,

Abused and misunderstood by parents who did not understand how important they were or carry their own trauma.

Eventually,

Hopefully,

We all move to a place,

A higher place.

I call it the eye in the sky where we can see karma unfold and we understand that many people who victimize do so because they were victims.

It's not an easy place to get to because you have to come face to face with your own trauma.

You've got to learn to pin the tail on a donkey.

You've got to learn to identify yourself as a victim so that you can identify what borders you need to secure within yourself emotionally.

And it is a process and oftentimes a lifelong journey.

But as someone who's been on this path for many years,

I can tell you it is absolutely worth everything you have to get to and go through,

Whether it's a breakup or a divorce or life coaching or therapy or whatever it is that you have to go through,

Ending relationships,

Staying up at night to study,

Journaling,

Whatever it is that you have to go through.

Meditation.

I meditate every single day.

I work on myself anywhere from an hour and a half to two hours a day,

And I do it lovingly.

It keeps me centered.

I find my peace.

What do people want in life?

Happiness,

Peace and contentment.

And I used to seek it outside of myself.

And now I am so joyful.

I feel abundant because now I know that peace I seek,

I can only find inside of me.

And I am so grateful that I can do it every single day.

And I pray the same for you.

Thank you so much for being here.

My name is Lisa Arimano.

I'm the breakthrough life coach and bestselling author and the creator of the 12 week breakthrough coaching program and law of attraction masterclass.

Both my online programs help people uncover the programs that were created in childhood that are keeping them stuck inside dysfunctional relationships.

My online law of attraction masterclass helps people heal the scarcity mindset and helps them figure out what programs are preventing them from living the most abundant life.

All of my programs incorporate meditations to help unblock the subconscious mind and move you forward.

Namaste,

Everybody.

Make it a great day.

Bye for now.

Reviews

This is just what I needed for support after leaving a 28 year relationship with a covert narcissist.

Amazing talk Lisa. I am getting such helpful information that is helping me sort through this relationship. Thank you👀🙏❤️

Whew... you keep hitting the nail on the head. I'm not sure there is any hope for me at 66 and still raising (grand) children. Now it's they that are my abusers, instead of my parents, siblings or husband(s). I pray I find the magic pill one day soon.

All this information is so very true and all very helpful. Thank you.

That's was a really great one Lisa. I have paid $500 for your course one year ago. I still haven't taken it. I'm so busy (or hiding. ) Anyway, that is the only reason I'm not leaving a big domain here. You have helped me so much.

Thank you for this. You are spot on. I’ve been going through a very difficult marriage with a narc and we are currently at a point in our relationship where we’re deciding whether to keep trying or go our separate ways. I’m the one who suggested divorce so he is being very nice and agreeable at the moment. It always messes with my head and makes me second-guess if things really were that bad. This is far from the first time being in this situation and I do have lots of memories and evidence of the reality but it is just so hard to finally make that decision with two little kids and no job. It’s very scary! But deep down I know I’ll never be at peace until I finally break away.

I needed this so badly . I’m in a relationship with a guy that I thought had good intentions, we’ve been seeing each other almost a year. He just physically assaulted me today, he knows I’ve been a victim of domestic abuse before and have had a lot of trauma. You don’t know how much I needed to hear this right now.
thank u for the work ur doing.

As a co dependent...that blew my mind. It was inspiring.

Thank you so much! It was like you were talking about me. After listening to this I am feeling more grateful for my healing learning journey and for where I am now.

So informative, Lisa. Thank you!

Spot on insights if you have a history of attracting a narcissist significant other…

Lisa goes straight to the point. Very good!

Oh Lisa, thank God for you. I've listened to SO many of your talks & meditations. My God how you have helped me!! There aren't enough words of gratitude to give. May you forever be blessed.

So good to finally understand what was going on, why it didnt work out. Thank you Lisa. 🥰❤️🌹

So painful even though I know I’ve tried everything and deserve better. I’m really looking at attachment vs love. Are codependents and narcissists capable of being in love?

💔😔. I want to be healthy and strong. Truly working on my inner child and the courage to heal childhood molestation trauma. He feels threatened by my dedication to healing and the time I’m taking away from him. Because I’m Learning to have boundaries and to say no. I now challenge his manipulation and control and you can imagine how that’s going.

I’m learning in my relationships with others to respond versus reacting. That has been very good and a growing experience. Not perfect but a work in progress. I am learning to hold a mirror up to myself and see things from different perspectives now whereas I never could before. Because I’ve been a victim all my life and finally understanding what that means.

I want to grow up emotionally mentally and spiritually. A big part of my immaturity and fear is that it could take my whole life to heal. That’s very overwhelming at times.

I’m so blessed to have a brother who was raised in the same household with a codependent mom and a narcissistic father. He’s done many years of work on himself and never gave up on helping me to wake up.

Now we’re traveling on the same path not easy but so worth it. I’m not crazy I’m not the only one who suffers this pain and humiliation or than negative self image and talk. If only we could all love ourselves at the time of birth. What a different world it would be.

Thank you Lisa. Blessings for a brighter and healthier New Year.

Namasté 🙏🏼♥️🤗

Hi Lisa,

Every time I listen to one of your many contributions here on Insight Timer, something or a lot ➡️ like with this podcast❗ resonates!❗Thank you!❗

Namaste, CheekyFuel

thank you Lisa you're a gift to me after finally leaving my abusive marriage 🙏

Omg ! This is so me! I need to stop the shame! It’s like a broken record in my head! With that observation and with repetition ,and consistency I shall overcome this programming! Thank you Lisa for the tools to become the real me! Absolutely the road back to our divine self. I humbly Thank you over and over I give thanks!! 🙏❤️🤗

Lisa did it again! Blew my mind wide open around why my relationship looks the way it does. I feel she has the expertise to really speak to this topic.

Thank you for this. Working on changing my pattern of falling for narcissists.