In Conversation With Sadhguru

Actress Pranitha Subhash catches up with Sadhguru at the backwaters of KRS Dam, during Sadhguru's two-week ride across the Cauvery basin. She asks Sadhguru about Cauvery Calling, water, agriculture and various other aspects of revitalizing Cauvery.

Transcript

How are you Guruji?

I'm very well.

Thank you for coming all the way and supporting.

I'm glad you heard your heart heard the call of Kaveri.

It's our responsibility I think to be here and such a wonderful cause that you have initiated and I think as actors it's all the more our responsibility to support this cause.

Everybody should,

Especially those of you who can who have the privilege of being able to influence young people.

It's very important.

Truly.

So I've been seeing how you treat water so sacredly.

I just saw how when you drink water,

You touch it with so much reverence like how we touch a God's photo.

So what is it that you want to tell us about it?

See,

You're reverential to gods that you've not seen.

I'm reverential to god that I've seen.

The food that you eat,

The water that you drink,

The air that you breathe,

The soil that you walk upon.

These are the ones which are keeping you alive.

You're made of that?

Yes.

Your very body is made of that,

Isn't it?

I heard that you said in the interview,

It's an ingredient,

It's life-making ingredient.

Isn't it?

It's a life-making ingredient.

Absolutely,

Very true.

So what is the most valuable thing in your life right now?

Life itself.

Life itself,

Nothing else.

You're alive right now,

That's all.

So three days if we don't give you a drop of water and I dress up like god and come,

Whatever god you like.

You like Ganapati,

I'll dress up like Ganapati and come.

Yeah,

I think so.

Yeah.

What will you ask?

For water.

Water,

Then what?

So,

There is… we've always been conscious of it that water is alive.

It's a life force.

If it's not alive,

How does it make you alive?

If air is not alive,

How does it make you alive?

It's the very basis of your life.

But the so-called physical sciences have been denying it for a long time.

Water is just H2O,

All this is rubbish and everything.

But now you see,

Last… I think in the last couple of years,

Somebody got a Nobel Prize.

People have been asking,

Sadhguru,

You must read about it.

I said,

I won't.

We've been saying this for thousands of years.

But you went on saying it's rubbish.

The moment somebody does something in the laboratory,

We lived in the world and we observed certain things.

We observed what's happening within ourselves.

But somebody observed something in an instrument or a machine,

And then they say that this is the reality.

And now you give him a Nobel Prize and now you think it's true the whole world.

I don't like that because we have always known this,

Water is life.

And we know water has memory.

In South India,

We store water in a certain way,

We keep it in a certain kind of pot,

We… people even worship the water pot.

I just saw you do that.

That is what really I thought that's… that's something we need to teach our kids.

If you have no reverence for what is source of your life,

What other things have your reverence?

It's all empty reverence.

Truly,

Truly.

You are reverential towards something that you've not seen,

Just because somebody has taught you.

No,

I am reverential to all those things that matter to me – water,

Soil,

Air,

Food,

People,

People,

Man,

Woman,

Child,

Animal,

Tree,

Everything,

I am very reverential to all of them because I know this is what is making our life right now.

It's lovely.

So what… I feel like today's kids,

I don't know,

They hear a lot about all these causes,

About saving water but it's… Today's kids are not the problem,

Obviously parents are the problem.

Truly,

Yeah,

The definition that… See,

A child does not come with any preconceived anything.

Right.

It is a kind of influence that they come under.

Right.

There is… recently,

I don't know if you saw a quote,

I said,

There are no bad children,

There are only bad influences.

Yeah,

True.

So what is it that,

I don't know,

One must teach the next generation… Of course,

It's not their fault,

It's all our fault that the state of water today,

But what is it that they can learn and… See,

The important thing is,

You are alive.

That's a basic fact.

Rest is all made up by you,

Isn't it?

True.

You are essentially alive.

Everything else is made up in your head.

Right.

You are mistaking psychological reality for existential reality.

That's the main problem.

What's happening in your mind,

You think it's real.

I'm sorry you're in cinema,

But… so I can use this example.

People go sit in a cinema theater,

Lights off.

It'll not work if lights are on.

Lights off,

Then watch the cinema,

Get involved,

Enjoy the movie.

When it closes,

They must come out.

But a whole lot of people think that's for real.

That's what is happening to human beings.

You have a cinema theater in your mind,

It's playing all kinds of badly directed movies.

True,

Very true.

And you start thinking that is the reality.

No,

It is just your psychological nonsense.

So your psychological drama,

Your thinking is existentially true.

That is the basis of all these problems that we have.

So today,

You pray to some other god.

It's your psychological stuff.

Depending on which culture you're born in,

Which family you're born in,

Accordingly you're looking up to some god,

Isn't it?

Everybody is looking up only.

So all of them are side by side on the cloud?

I'm asking.

No,

I mean it's more of imagination.

So it's your psychological reality.

But water is existential reality.

If one day you don't have water to drink,

It's not psychological.

So Cauvery Calling is not a psychological thing,

It's existential,

It's real.

True.

I've been seeing your Save the Rivers campaign… Rally for Rivers.

And how… now we're onto a particular river that's Cauvery.

So tell us more about how you think Cauvery should be.

The purpose… The purpose of Rally for Rivers was to… one thing is to get the support of the citizens of this country and then push for a policy change.

So we got the support of hundred-and-sixty-two million people.

Yes,

I heard.

And… That's an amazing… Central government responded.

Right.

And they made this… the Rally for Rivers recommendation,

Which is a seven-hundred-and-sixty page policy document,

Recommendation.

They sent it as official recommendation to all the states.

So policy-wise,

We've done the job.

Now on the ground we have to do… there's one project we're doing in Maharashtra,

In the Bhagadi River,

In Yavatmav.

This we're doing hands-on.

Government has allotted budget and hands-on we're doing along with the government agencies.

But this is a different kind of project.

In this there are three ingredients.

There is a farmer,

There is the government and the people.

So we want all three engaged because all three are beneficiaries or they will suffer,

Both ways.

For the farmer,

His income needs to go up.

They're committing suicide in thousands.

Every year thousands are committing suicide.

His income needs to go up.

For this we have a solution in the form of agroforestry.

This is not an experiment with him.

For last eighteen years we have manifested this with nearly 70,

000 farmers that their incomes have gone up three hundred to eight hundred percent in five to seven years' time.

So it is an established model.

So we want him to benefit.

His income should go up.

But initially there is a little bit of hesitation and first three to four years there could be a little bit of loss.

Dr.

Vandana Chowdhury To make them understand that… Sadhguru No,

For that we engage the government.

Dr.

Vandana Chowdhury Right.

Now we wanted a subsidy for first four years.

Both the governments,

Tamil Nadu and Karnataka have agreed to this.

The next thing is why the farmer is not planting trees.

Earlier all farms had trees.

Now they're not planting trees because the laws are such,

Even if you grow a tree in your own land and if you cut it tomorrow,

They'll come and arrest you.

So now we are shooting for a law where a farmer can grow what he wants,

Fell it when he wants,

Transport it when he wants and sell it where he wants.

Like if you run a industry,

You can sell it wherever you want.

Why is it the farmer is not allowed to do it?

We're just exploiting him.

To a point where they're committing suicide in lakhs.

Across the country,

300,

000,

Three lakh people have committed suicide.

What more disaster do you want?

Are you waiting for millions or what?

So farmer will benefit.

The government,

The timber import right now is 70,

000 crores raw timber,

1.

2 lakh crores worth of timber products we are importing from other countries.

If the farmer grows this,

In about eight years' time,

Government… Tamil Nadu only we calculated… What does it need import?

Tamil Nadu government will have a GST of 29,

000 crores.

So government will benefit and the people will benefit because the land is fertile,

Your food will be more nutritious,

Your water problems will go away because the monsoons are anyway coming,

We are not able to hold it in the land.

If trees are there,

You will hold it in the land.

We are thinking of 242 crore trees.

If 242 crore trees are planted,

Approximately nine to twelve trillion liters of water will be sequestered in the land.

What is twelve trillion liters of water means the entire Cauvery's flow in one year,

See massive amount of water,

Entire Cauvery's flow in one year is 21.

2 trillion liters.

We are talking about twelve trillion liters of extra water going into the land.

Your lakes will be full,

Your ponds will be full,

Your wells will be full,

River will be good and above all,

Soil will be rich.

Because without the leaves from the… leaves from the tree and animal waste,

There is no way to enrich the soil.

So all these things will happen,

All the three parties benefit because I know in anything,

If everybody benefits,

Only then it will succeed.

If I benefit,

You don't benefit,

You will make sure it doesn't work.

If you benefit and I… if you… you benefit and I don't benefit,

I will make sure it doesn't work.

This is the way world works.

So also now you told us about all the freshwater bodies,

What is your take on the desalination because we have so much water on this planet,

Unfortunately it's all salt water.

You want to drink it up,

I'm sorry.

Unfortunately it's all salt water.

So what's your take on that?

It is not unfortunately,

Oh my god.

I mean imagine if all of it was freshwater.

Then we would all die.

Yeah.

Yes.

If all of it was freshwater,

We wouldn't be… there wouldn't be life here.

You know when we say something,

Even in the English expression and even in all languages,

We say the salt of the earth,

You're the salt of the earth because without salts you wouldn't exist.

Right.

So… Wow.

Very insightful because I didn't think of it this way.

Now people unfortunately a whole lot of upstarts are talking about this that why are we letting all the river water into the ocean,

We must dam everything and use it.

Right.

We must understand you are not the only life on the planet.

True.

There are billions of other life.

In southern India,

This is a little rocky soil,

If you go there,

Take a teaspoonful of soil,

There are anywhere between 10,

000 to 50,

000 species of microbes in one teaspoon.

In one teaspoon,

There are more microbes than all the people on the planet.

So they also have to live.

Yeah.

Because if you and me are gone,

Planet will flourish.

I mean to say if all human beings are gone… All the… yeah.

All the damage that we've done.

Don't be scared,

I'm not… No,

No,

I've seen… I've seen this video,

I've seen where… If all of us are gone,

Planet will flourish.

The microbes are gone,

Insects are gone,

Worms are gone,

Planet will not live,

Everything will die.

So they are the real inhabitants.

Right.

We are enjoying on… over them,

But we must ensure they live because if they don't live,

We won't live.

Not only that,

If the river water doesn't go into the ocean,

The salt water will enter the soil.

In India,

Looking at the substrata,

It can enter anywhere between a hundred to hundred and thirty kilometers inside.

We have 7,

400 kilometers of coastline.

Right.

And a hundred kilometers inside if it comes,

One-third of India you will lose to salt water.

And those people who are living there,

What will they do?

They will all come where there is water.

When thirsty people come here,

You can't stop them.

They will come in millions.

The kind of civil strife you will create in the country is unbelievable.

So minimum,

I would say if you ask me,

Fifty percent of the river should go into the ocean.

That population pressures we have,

At least twenty-five percent must go into the ocean.

If it doesn't go,

Slowly marine water ingress will happen into the land where we'll lose one-third of India.

I'm sure this is something which people wouldn't have thought of.

People are not thinking about anything except their next meal.

Themselves,

Yeah.

About themselves.

Absolutely.

Nobody is thinking about conserving resources.

And again,

As you said,

This is not a resource,

It's a life-making ingredient.

Yes.

And I think that's a code that all of us must go by because we all consider water as a resource as if it's all meant for us,

But that's not how it is,

Right?

It's… You and me will come and go.

Come and go… The Cauvery continues to flow.

Forever.

Wow!

That's beautiful.

Thank you very much.

Reviews

Sadhguru is so knowledgeable. Thank you for this.

Wow! What a brilliant mind!
Thank you for sharing your thoughts!

Thanks for your interesting conversation. Very useful🌺

Deepest gratitude sweet soul siblings!
🙏⭕🙏
Love,light and blessed be..🌳🌲🌴 deeply thankful to have expanded love to your beautiful paradise-in-the-making.
💚💙💜
Namaste