Hey,
Everyone,
And welcome back to the podcast and this weekend's conversation with my guest,
Michael.
Now,
As Michael admits,
He had a pretty idyllic childhood growing up in Orange County.
But then,
Right before he started college,
He discovered that his father had been fighting multiple myeloma,
Which is a form of blood cancer,
And was diagnosed with it on Michael's 10th birthday.
So for about eight years,
Michael's parents kept the diagnosis away from him.
You know,
They wanted him to have a carefree life,
To not live with that worry,
To not live with that burden.
And we talk about that in this episode,
What that was like,
What that revelation was like,
And how his father's diagnosis changed the course of Michael's life.
As well,
Michael shares a few magical miracle stories,
And one of them is pretty powerful.
I mean,
It's a little bit funny,
But when you hear the interpretation of the healer that was working on Michael,
You begin to understand.
This is a conversation about family,
It's a conversation about love,
And it's a conversation about those who love us,
And how they'll stop at nothing to help us live better and richer lives.
I was laying on the table.
And.
.
.
Being,
You know,
The healer is facilitating,
You know,
The flow of qi throughout my body.
And there's a point where I felt like I got slapped in the face.
I just.
I got slapped in the face.
And.
.
.
I.
.
.
Past.
The qigong practitioner like did he just Hit me in the face.
And she's like,
No,
I'm far away from the table.
My name is Michael Brahim and I am originally from Orange County.
Grew up in Laguna Hills.
In Newport Beach and I'm Persian and Jewish.
Um,
Which is interesting during this war,
Also in America.
So,
Um,
That's an interesting,
Interesting experience to see Israel to be able to see Israel and the U.
S.
Be at war with Iran.
Um and uh.
.
.
I live in LA currently.
And I'm a holistic psychiatrist.
I love what I do.
And part of the reason why I love what I do is I get to learn from the people.
I work with.
And.
Aye.
Really just love talking to people in general and being a psychiatrist just feeds into that joy to have.
Wow,
Do you know how rare it is for someone to tell me that they love what they do?
It's rare.
Um,
Okay.
So you said holistic psychiatrist.
Can you tell me exactly what that means?
Yeah,
So holistic psychiatry is.
.
.
An approach to psychiatry that utilizes not only the conventional methods of treatment,
Such as,
You know,
Medication prescribing,
It can be conventional therapy modalities like cognitive behavioral therapy or psychodynamic therapy.
So it's taking what's typically used as the gold standard and also Other treatments that are not as common,
Such as using supplements,
Maybe getting lab work done,
Addressing nutritional deficiencies.
It could be,
I'm recommending patients do Tai Chi.
Yoga,
I might refer them to a traditional Chinese medicine physician or a chiropractor.
So it's really utilizing a variety of other modalities that have been around for a long time,
Such as acupuncture,
For example,
And combining that with.
What psychiatrists typically offer.
Amazing.
I was just talking to someone the other day and I see an acupuncturist here about twice a month.
And I was telling them that I just read a book,
An old book from the 80s,
Dare we go back that far.
And it was about a Harvard trained surgeon who China and the US decided to meet up and share knowledge.
And he went to China and witnessed and learned about acupuncture for quite a while.
He was astonished.
First of all,
The rooms filled with patients and then at the lines of people waiting to be seen by the acupuncturists.
And what he said blew my mind that people don't necessarily go because they have symptoms.
They go before they have symptoms so that it's a normal part of their life to maintain balance and create balance by being proactive and getting that body work,
Um,
That work on,
On everything that's going on before anything starts to happen.
So I thought,
Oh my gosh,
It's just like,
I don't know,
You know,
When you get,
Take your car in for an oil change,
It doesn't mean anything's wrong.
You just take it in so that it can be maintained and have incredible performance.
So I think it's brilliant what you're doing.
I mean,
Frankly,
We need a lot more people doing what you're doing.
Because,
I mean,
I think you're probably aware of the studies that sometimes diet and nutritional deficiency can create,
You know,
In some cases they've discovered either depression or mood swings,
Or,
You know,
They've discovered that even with some autistic individuals that going on a gluten-free diet can change the way they orient themselves to the world.
So,
I don't know,
I want to give you 10,
000 rounds of applause.
Thank you.
Thank you.
There's a lot of simple solutions.
To a lot of mental health issues that have been around for hundreds if not thousands of years.
And.
.
.
We're the field that's been really focused on medications that only been around for 40 to 50 years.
Here's a question.
Would child you be surprised by the work that you're doing now?
I would say.
.
.
Yes and no.
Would it be surprised by.
.
.
The quote-unquote seriousness of being a doctor.
But not surprised by choosing a profession that involves a lot of human to human.
Interaction.
So you've kind of always been someone that like humans,
Just like me.
I mean,
Before we started kind of the official podcast,
I,
I confessed that I was someone that loves to meet people.
So you've kind of been someone who likes people your whole life.
Some people are not built that way.
Yeah,
I've always enjoyed connecting with people.
I think during my medical school journey,
I found it intriguing.
That I had friends who chose a specialty like anesthesiology,
Where they said,
Oh,
I want to choose a specialty where you don't have to hear from anyone.
I'm like.
How do you even want to become a doctor if you don't want to really.
.
.
Engage patients.
But again,
There's a specialty for all types of people.
Yeah,
Yeah,
That's true.
It's not one size fits all in this universe.
What I am especially intrigued by,
And I'm going to confess this and I'm going to put you on the spot,
Is that you went to osteopathic medical school.
And excuse me,
I think that is the coolest thing ever.
Now,
I think some of my listeners don't know what osteopathy is.
So can you kind of just give a little kind of rundown?
Description of what exactly that entails.
So.
I think it's around 10 to 20% of doctors in the U.
S.
Are DOs,
Which is doctor of medicine.
Osteopathy and the term osteopathic is the association is with the study of like bone.
And so osteopathic physicians have extra 300 hours or more extra training on how to manipulate people's bones,
Muscle.
Fascia.
To help with facilitation of healing.
And very grateful for that extra training.
I'd say,
Unfortunately,
Especially in the field of psychiatry.
Providing hands-on treatment is not.
.
.
It's kind of.
.
.
It's not common.
For psychiatrists to do hands-on treatment,
Especially with concerns about,
I wouldn't say abuse,
But I would say the field is not really condoning psychiatrists offering body work.
That is a true story,
I feel like you know I have had talk therapy over the years,
And then recently in the last few years I've been getting into somatic therapy.
So,
But that's somatic release and that's somatic therapy is very different than the talk therapy and they kind of you know,
Never the twain shall meet.
Lately,
I've been getting some pretty powerful orthobionomy that is kind of teaching me to understand my body.
And actually,
I would,
This is gonna sound strange,
But rejoin my body because I don't think I realized how divorced I was from my body and have been my whole life.
And for me,
Part of the story is about,
I don't know,
Friends with my body,
Would you say that in your training at that school and kind of what you've experienced since in your life with everything that you've kind of been involved in and working with,
That in general,
And I hate making blanket statements,
But this might be a blanket question,
In general,
Do you think that most people in this country don't honor their bodies the way they should.
Absolutely.
I think.
.
.
That's backed by the stat that Per capita,
US has the.
Highest rate of mental.
And physical.
Disorders.
In the world.
And.
.
.
A lot of people are disconnected from their bodies,
Which means that they're missing out on the signals telling them that the way you're doing this job or this job itself is wrong.
Not conducive for how you want to live your life or this relationship.
Or the way you're living it.
And so being disconnected from our bodies.
Leads to people not living the lives that they actually want to live.
Yeah,
And I think I became quite an adept,
Quite skilled at ignoring what my body was telling me.
And then,
You know,
Then you have the inciting incident where something just goes very wrong.
And you're not.
You literally can't look away and you have to try to figure out how to find get back to stasis or balance,
Which is not,
You know,
You can't do it in 24 hours.
It takes a while and it takes an investment in your.
I don't know,
In your mental health,
Whether it's through Tai Chi,
As you said meditation,
But also through physical movement and maybe solitude or time out in nature,
Every person is different for what's going to be kind of healing and and good for them.
I,
You know,
I know a little bit about your backstory,
And I just find this,
It's interesting.
Thank you for sharing that you're both,
You know,
Persian and Jewish,
What an interesting kind of world do inhabit both of those worlds.
You know,
Tenuous,
Probably stressful,
Confusing,
Although I'm maybe projecting onto you so you can throw all those away.
Um When you were growing up,
Did you grow up in a religious household?
I mean,
Did you have.
.
.
Was your house a Persian household,
I guess?
And then how has that evolved over time?
Do you have a connection to source?
What does that look like?
I'd love to hear whatever you have to say about that.
In the sense that the media we consumed was primarily American.
Listened to a lot of American music.
A lot of rock music,
A lot of disco.
And my first grade teacher.
Thought I was autistic.
So she told my mom in first grade,
Don't speak Farsi to him.
So I didn't really.
Speak any other languages in my own household.
My parents will speak Farsi to me,
But yeah,
English was the primary language I was spoken.
Played a lot of video games.
And so there were elements of,
You know,
I did go to a Jewish private school for my whole life from first grade to 12th grade.
So That was an important part,
But I think.
Being an American was still the most prominent.
Would go to synagogue here and there,
But that still felt like it was the most prominent aspect of my identity growing up.
That which led to me being able to relate to everybody.
Yeah,
Really.
I mean,
I don't know if you saw in my bio,
But I grew up in Guyana and then in Pakistan and I'm a third culture kid,
Which I just discovered a few years ago.
I had no idea,
But I fit the psychological profile.
And so I really have an affinity and a love for that part of the world.
It's art,
It's architecture,
It's food.
But specifically the people,
I mean the people that I met were just.
So generous and kind and wonderful and witty and intelligent and inspired and I mean I think people are like that everywhere,
But when you come from,
You know,
The US,
And then you go to,
You know,
This part of the world that is so very different.
And you're a kid,
I was just in awe of everything.
It was just kind of the best.
And I try to explain that to people,
But I think there's a difference between being a kid and going somewhere that foreign and being an adult and choosing to visit that place.
It really led me to understand that I kind of like the fact that everybody's different and that everybody isn't the same.
It's,
I mean,
I think that's one of the best parts about being alive is that you can There's so much to learn about this world.
Do you ever,
Have you ever gone back to that part of the world?
Iran?
No,
Because it would just be hard,
You know,
I have a really Jewish last name,
So there's complications with that.
But I've been to Israel.
Uh.
.
.
Four times,
Almost considering moving there last year.
Because I've been to Israel and you've experienced Jerusalem.
It's like a whole.
Feels like a whole other dimension that you feel like.
You're not supposed to leave.
It's like,
That's like your.
.
.
It's like the source in a lot of ways for a lot of belief systems throughout the world.
And there's like a sense of magic and awe and wonder.
In Jerusalem that I wanted to live.
Around there.
But ended up not moving because I had the sense that a big war,
A bigger war was coming.
And that came to be true.
Well,
I've never been to Jerusalem,
But I've certainly talked to people who have and yeah,
It's it's a you know,
Maybe the British or the English would,
The Druids would say,
You know,
It's an enchanted place.
It's like at the center of ley lines or something where there's just this buildup of powerful sacred energy.
And it's just palpable when you walk around and you can feel it.
And it's,
It's almost like it's fed by the millions of prayers and blessings and imprecations that people have kind of,
I don't know,
That have been stirring in that pot for thousands of years.
There's a place here like that out in Santa Fe called Chimayo.
It's this old,
Old,
Old church that is very famous and very sacred.
And,
You know,
They have like a little tiny well there where you can pray and then put a picture up of your prayer and that you can take a little of the sand that's been blessed.
And so it's,
That's another place that has been been,
You know,
Thousands and tens of thousands of people have just gone and and prayed and and visited it and those places are You know they're essential for humanity for connecting with the divine but also feeling you know when I think I've never been to Jerusalem again but you can go to Jerusalem,
I imagine and feel closer to that sacred presence would you say that's true.
Yeah,
It's just magnetic.
Yeah.
Just feel it.
Your body and I just have the sense that you don't want to leave.
Yeah,
Yeah.
Um,
Can I ask?
Now I know a little bit about the story of your family and your father.
Would you say that that what you went through as a family led you to enter.
Osteopathic school Not necessarily.
What really led me down the path of osteopathic medicine.
In holistic psychiatry was.
.
.
This paranormal experience.
Where I had my dad's Spirit.
Day after Christmas.
So this is December 26th of 2007.
So my dad died October 11th,
2007.
So now it's December 26.
2007.
And a patient.
Second day that I was seeing him when I was volunteering in the hospital.
So that my dad's spirit came to him to tell me that I need to obtain the knowledge.
That was,
That's it.
That was like the message.
And he said if you don't receive this message now,
It's going to come in other forms in the future.
And then two weeks later.
At the college that I went to,
This professor that I wanted to do research with told me that instead of doing research on acupuncture,
Which is why I approached him originally,
He said,
There's this project that I've been funding.
It's an underground project for 10 years.
Where he was studying healers who could heal cells from a distance,
From thousands of miles away.
And so you wanted me to do.
Literature searches.
To find other studies that kind of.
.
.
Or similar in the sense of human beings doing unbelievable things around healing.
And health and it was that experience of being exposed to that literature of humans such as This man in India that didn't eat for 60 years just by doing photosynthesis with his eyes.
Kids in China.
You know,
Teleporting a fruit fly into an empty water bottle.
Just unbelievable things that humans can do that.
Gave me the sense that humans have an unbelievable capacity to heal themselves.
And any human being can channel.
A variety of.
Information and healing experiences.
That all influenced me to.
.
.
Choose a path of medicine that I was able to learn.
You know,
What it means to be healthy and what it means to enable health.
And so I was choosing between.
Becoming a naturopathic doctor versus an osteopathic.
Physician and I ended up choosing becoming an osteopathic physician.
Because DOs have the opportunity to specialize.
Um,
Naturopathic doctors don't get to specialize to a specific specialty.
I have to ask you,
Okay,
Because my father passed away in late April and obviously I do this podcast and I,
I don't know,
Over 300 stories of people's experiences with things that are I don't know,
You'd call them supra natural or paranormal or whatever,
You know,
However this showed up in their life.
And,
You know,
I deeply believe in it.
And so one of the things is,
You know,
I've been like,
Okay,
Dad,
I'm like looking at my imaginary wristwatch.
I'm like,
Are you going to come?
I mean,
Are you going to come visit me?
Are you going to say goodbye?
What's going on here?
So I've been waiting.
So I am hearing your story with envy about,
You know,
Your patient coming in and saying,
Hey,
I have a message from your father.
Here it is.
What was your response were you kind of flabbergasted were you shocked,
Do you think what is happening.
Yeah,
I was shocked and I was a little I remember feeling a little angry because There was a vagueness to what he was saying,
Like obtain the knowledge.
Mike.
And I asked him like,
What does that mean?
And the patient was like,
I don't know.
So.
.
.
But,
Uh.
.
.
Yeah,
It was just a combination of shock and anger and confusion.
Like,
What am I supposed to do with this?
And I think.
.
.
I mean.
.
.
Whether it was the research they did during college or.
.
.
All these other life experiences I've had in my life.
I think I've obtained the knowledge.
Yeah.
It's,
You know,
It's.
It's hard to say.
If I really discover that knowledge,
But.
.
.
Yeah,
It's something I think about.
Almost every day.
Yeah,
It's almost like.
.
.
I don't know,
It's almost like your father set you a quest.
And.
It was a bit of a vague quest.
But it kind of,
I don't know,
To me,
It sounds like it primed the pump a little bit for you to be.
More aware of the path that you were choosing.
Would you say that's right?
I think it was that experience with that patient,
Because I really enjoyed talking to that patient.
I'd spend Christmas Day and the day after Christmas with him.
And like four hours both days.
And so it was that experience that.
.
.
Really confirmed,
I think it was really those two days that confirmed that,
Oh yeah,
You want to become a doctor.
Yeah.
So at least confirm that there's a magic.
As their sense of magic.
Associated with being in service in the medical field.
And I just want to share really quickly like that magic.
I.
.
.
Had a at a new patient that I saw yesterday.
And it was probably.
.
.
I haven't seen that many.
Homeless patients since I've been in practice.
And um.
.
.
In the outpatient setting.
And I read.
Their notes before,
I'm like,
Oh,
This might be a challenging experience.
And I.
.
.
Me and him,
We ended up,
I don't think I've ever laughed more.
N A first visit than I ever have in the last 10 years.
There's this like magic that happens.
Especially with like one-on-one with people that It's just,
It's such a privilege to be able to have that.
Experience.
With a human being when you're talking about depression and struggle,
Like the fact that I was able to have that experience with him was.
.
.
It was memorable.
That's that's Amazing.
Um,
You know to that kind of as a little side.
Question here because I think.
You're probably the perfect person to ask this question.
I'm,
I'm very mystical and you and I briefly touched earlier on in this conversation about Um.
.
.
I don't know.
I mean,
I think personally myself,
It is difficult to live in this culture if you are different in any way.
For me,
I really feel like There's a lot here that asks us to conform.
That's how I feel.
I read a lot of books on shamanism and magic and mystical from all cultures because I like to learn about that stuff.
And I recently read something that I thought was pretty profound and very interesting and I'd like you to just comment on it if you feel comfortable with that.
I was reading a book about that was telling indigenous stories of healing.
The story specifically was about a young man who had been diagnosed probably like 20 or 23 is schizophrenic.
He was indigenous,
And he was really struggling in the community that he lived in,
And people were avoiding him,
They were scared of him.
A pretty well-known Indigenous healer,
About a 70-year-old man,
Came into town.
He was visiting.
Um and He met this young man and he said,
Oh.
Okay.
And he later he said he had a soul sickness.
It was something inside his soul that that was crying out to be heard and felt discombobulated disconnected from reality in this community and so he took this young man in.
For a period of six months to a year.
And by the end of that time,
That you couldn't even tell that this young man had.
Any sort of mental disconnect,
I guess you could say,
Or schizophrenia.
What do you think of this story and have you heard of stories like this?
I've heard the stories like this for.
.
.
Almost 20 years.
And so.
I think it was.
Pretty early on in my adult years,
Based on the research that I was involved with.
That's pretty common for quote-unquote shamans and healers for a variety of cultures to be viewed as psychotic.
Um and unfortunately in the U.
S.
People that are very sensitive and have this state of their energetic presence being more permeable to their environment.
That if they live in a society that's very sick.
They will internalize that and they might be diagnosed with schizophrenia.
A lot of the work that I do as a psychiatrist is helping patients who are psychotic or manic.
And have the diagnoses of schizophrenia or bipolar disorder.
Is really providing them with a.
.
.
Lifestyle or a comprehensive plan.
That.
Gets them in a place where they get to heal.
And live in a way that's sustainable with how they are.
Energetically and physically.
So these are often the most gifted.
People in our society.
And.
.
.
You know,
I often tell them that you're not like everyone else in a positive way,
Not a negative way.
And highlight their gifts rather than.
.
.
Their physical attributes as being burdens to them.
I'm just going to say right now I'm bowing down to you for the work that you do.
For these people because I wonder if you are the first person in their life who's been so accepting and kind.
And thoughtful in your response to them,
But also letting them know that,
Hey,
You know,
There's,
You might have some struggles,
But inherently,
There's nothing wrong with you and we can find a way forward,
We can find some sort of holistic way to make living this existence.
Tolerable or okay,
While you're also doing all the other therapies you're doing with them to help them kind of.
I don't know,
Adjust to this world or live in it more successfully or navigate it in a way that feels good to them.
I want to highlight something that you said that is kind of part of the problem.
That I think a lot of the training in psychiatry is.
.
.
This is a disorder that you have,
You need to learn how to manage it.
And so you mentioned like,
Oh,
It sounds like you might support people to find a way to tolerate,
Like,
Their life,
Like.
.
.
In a way like kind of managing their way through.
Where I like to go with patience.
Especially ones who've been hospitalized many,
Many times.
And they've been told,
Like,
You're going to be on meds for the rest of your life.
And like,
Your quality of life is probably going to be limited.
Is really going to the place of like No,
Let's get you to thrive.
Let's get you to the point of,
How can we get you to the point where you're really enjoying life and you feel alive?
That's the standard that I really try to encourage patients to think because Maybe this is a spiritual belief of mine,
But I don't think we're here to tolerate life.
I think we're really here.
Of all this energy.
Goes into you being born into this world.
And we have this like capacity,
Like people like heal.
You know,
Quote unquote,
Miraculously,
Like all these like unbelievable things are happening,
Like.
That same energy.
Can go towards.
Really living a very meaningful life.
I think that's what is meaningful,
I think.
Everyone should experience a very meaningful life.
It might not look the way you want it to.
But in the end.
.
.
There is meaning behind it.
You Thank you.
I love the words thrive and meaning.
So you combine them beautifully and thank you for,
Um,
For kind of correcting me and reorienting me.
That's super helpful.
I'd love to ask you the question.
Now,
I know a little bit about your story with your childhood and your father.
Would you mind just giving a little background about what happened with him?
I think.
Do you think that the choice that they did not tell you about his diagnosis,
Do you think that that in any way shaped your path again kind of,
I asked you about osteopathy but.
About your path to doing what you're doing now,
Holistic,
This holistic,
Beautiful work that you're doing.
Well,
I think what is.
.
.
What I've learned about.
How my dad found out about his illness was we were driving home.
We're about to drive home from LA to Orange County.
After Shabbat dinner on a Friday.
Inside the front seat.
My mom said.
Oh,
Don't sit in the front seat,
Because if you get into an accident,
You'll get hurt.
You're more likely to get hurt.
And I told.
By parents.
No,
I want to sit in the front because if dad dies,
I want to die with him.
And this inspired my dad to get life insurance.
I'm gonna get life insurance and you do blood work.
And Sonya's getting blood work.
Their approvalities,
And.
.
.
Eventually.
On my 10th birthday,
He found out that he had cancer.
So I had two years to live,
So.
My parents just had the sense that and my sister was five.
And um.
.
.
They just had the sense that.
.
.
It was going to ruin my childhood.
If I found out that my dad had cancer.
So.
I'm very grateful to them because I'm.
I am sensitive myself emotionally,
I think.
I would worry a lot about how long my dad would have lived for.
Thankfully,
When I was told it had cancer,
I found out right before I started college.
So he had outlived,
At that point in time,
Six years beyond.
His prognosis.
I would say that whole experience.
Them allowing me to not be privy to that information.
Kind of laid a foundation for me to be emotionally healthy,
Or increased my chance of having a greater sense of a foundation of living a really playful.
Where I could really be a kid.
That.
I think contributes to my sense of imagination,
Creativity.
And sense of play in my life now.
Um And I think it also.
.
.
Highlighted the importance of,
Because I've seen this a lot in my work.
Where a lot of the patients that I see,
Part of their.
.
.
Their trauma,
Their unresolved trauma is being a parentified child.
Having to act like a parent or having so much responsibility as a kid.
It actually gets in the way of.
.
.
An adult or human learning how to live life for themselves.
And so a lot of the patients I have who've been parentified as a child,
They're more likely to be disconnected from their body.
And also,
They really do.
Have a hard time.
Connecting with like.
What they want to do for themselves,
Which leads to unresolved trauma of.
Living a life that's not yours.
Michael,
Can I just tell you that you describe me?
So interesting.
Thank you.
I just learned something about myself.
I find it fascinating that I confess that I was divorced from my body and then you just said that.
But I survived and I'm still here and now I've learned something so I can take that and move forward.
This sounds like a ridiculous question with all of the kind of beautiful magic and synchronicity.
Liminal experience that you've shared already.
But do you have another story that you'd like to share where you feel like you witnessed or experienced something magical,
Miraculous or mysterious?
And it's probably the most important thing I've ever experienced in my life that I'm still integrating day to day.
So yeah.
I.
.
.
You know,
Because I studied energy medicine during college,
Learning about healers,
Being able to make an effect from a distance.
Aye.
I see an energy healer monthly,
A Qigong practitioner.
And in a session,
I think it was a few years ago,
I was laying on the table.
And.
.
.
Being,
You know,
The healer is facilitating,
You know,
The flow of qi throughout my body.
And there was a point where I felt like I got slapped in the face.
I got slapped in the face.
And.
.
.
I.
.
.
Past.
The Qigong practitioner,
Like,
Did he just.
.
.
Hit me in the face.
And she's like,
No,
I'm far away from the table.
I'm like,
Okay.
And it was like 20 minutes later that.
She started.
Crying.
Uncontrollably,
Which has never happened.
In over,
I think the three years that we've.
Work together and she was saying like your dad's.
Presence is so strong in this room and she said he slapped you for you to receive this message that you need to take life less seriously.
And so.
That is probably the main thing I struggle with.
In my life day to day is I'm too serious.
There's a sense of.
.
.
I want to say control.
But like making sure things like putting a lot of work and effort.
An intention of like,
It needs to look like this.
Versus I think the message that my dad was trying to share is like whatever's supposed to happen's supposed to happen,
Just like relax and enjoy the ride of life.
So.
That was,
I mean.
That's probably the most paranormal thing I've ever experienced.
I got slapped in the face like there's no,
I can't.
There was no,
Uh.
.
.
You know,
There was no question that I felt something.
And so,
Um,
It was like a wake-up slap.
That is something that I think about very often.
It's just really hard to integrate that lesson with what you see in the world when you.
.
.
Look at your bank account when you see what it's when you see others take life so seriously.
It's like How can you not?
That is probably one of the most important experiences that I've had in my life.
Thanks for listening,
Everyone.
But especially,
I want to thank Michael for coming on the show and sharing his stories,
His experiences,
And his journey with his family.
And now is when I ask for ratings or reviews.
On whichever platform you choose to listen,
Please do consider leaving a rating or writing a little review.
Those ratings and reviews help others find this little labor of love of mine.
Thank you for listening.
And here's my one request.
Be like Michael.
Like many guests before him,
Michael is open to the mystery.
I mean,
He is open to the possibility that reality is not what it seems.
So be like Michael and embrace the magic.
Embrace the not knowing.
Embrace that uneasy place where there's no solid ground.
And the answer could be anything.
Be like Michael and live it.
In the mystery,
And I have a sense that if you do that,
Your life is at risk.
It's going to get a whole lot more fun.