Holons

Spiritual Teacher, Morgan O. Smith; Comedian, Nathan Griffith with special guest, Gabrielle Bell.
In this discussion we talk about what is a holon and the different sublevels with the levels within mysticism.

Transcript

Well,

What else you got Gabrielle?

What else do you got?

You still want to know the different types of enlightenment though.

If that's not a concern to you right now you don't have to worry about it but that's where you're headed.

It's pretty over my head and you and you listen,

I wrote down you got psychic,

Subtle,

Causal,

Non-dual,

Gross,

Nature,

Mysticism.

Yeah and non-dual has levels too so even though you have non-dual,

Non-dual has a set of levels as well.

So it gets really,

There's a lot of information that it would go over most people's heads because just the idea that non-dual has other levels in itself,

It's too much to handle.

But not even non-dual has its own levels and they have and they're named too.

So there's teriatita and there's all these other levels too that's teria this and teria that.

Let me see if I have it here on my phone.

I have my phone off.

Hold on let me turn my phone for a second see if I can if I can pronounce these words I'll read it off to you.

Let's see if I can do this.

Just give me a sec.

I'll just talk in the meantime but yeah but they all have their levels.

Nature,

Mysticism,

Causal and subtle also have their levels too.

They're not just all one thing.

They have their levels.

This is why it's so hard if you get if you get 10 people in the room who had spiritual awakenings like genuine spiritual awakenings,

You may have 10 people in the room that don't even agree.

I was talking to a guy and I was telling the group that at Satori that there's nothing to see.

This is something I stick to that there's nothing to see in this state.

A person came and said no you never had that experience because you do see Satori.

But again it depends on what level Satori we're talking about.

If you're talking about Satori the non-dual level the highest level there is nothing to see.

Because how can you see yourself if there's no distinction between you and others?

Because there's no you and others you can't see nothing.

Arguing about how many angels can dance on the head of a pin to me doesn't make any sense.

That doesn't up to the average person but there was a war happening there that day in that debate.

It was like who's right and who's wrong.

But it depends on what level we're talking about here.

But at a non-dual level if it's truly non-dual there's nothing to see.

At the same time though everything's being seen because you have the awareness of absolutely everything.

So seeing from that standpoint that's true.

But seeing with your eyes you can't see anything with your eyes.

Because I was taught through my teachers that if you see anything that's not it.

So keep going.

So I kept going until there was nothing left to see.

And I can attest to the fact that when you reach that level there's nothing to see.

The light there's a big bright light and then you merge with it and then you dissolve in this light which is all consciousness.

It becomes this ocean of consciousness that could be seen because you haven't merged with it yet.

Once you merge with it and you dissolve in it there's nothing more to see.

Everything else that I speak from that point on is a divine feeling.

So being all universes and all creatures and all births and all deaths and all time and space nothing's being seen there.

It's all a feeling.

Because God doesn't need to see itself.

When he wants to see it will do what it does by creating us.

But inside of that.

It will have this the opportunity to see from that standpoint.

But from its standpoint there's nothing to see.

It doesn't need eyes.

So there's no seeing but is there knowing?

There's absolute knowing.

There's absolute knowing.

There's absolute awareness.

There's absolute realization.

There's absolute bliss.

There's absolute truth.

There's absolute beauty.

There's absolute perfection.

But you don't necessarily see anything physically.

No.

But you can have other experiences mystical experiences where you see a lot where there's lots to see.

It depends on what level we're talking about.

Like at the natural at the nature stage there's things that you can see.

The subtle stage there's things that you can see.

Once you get into causal you don't see anything in causal because causal has no shape and form.

And then when you're non-dual even shape and form disappears.

Yet it's there because it's non-dual.

Is this like a hierarchy or is it more of a like a web or a?

More like a web or more like a holarchy as opposed to a hierarchy.

So more of a whole hierarchy.

And within the hole within the hole within the hole within holes within holes.

I went right over Nathan's head.

No I got it.

You did not get it.

Come on.

It's funny.

It's like being kicked.

You know the guy when he's like this is Sparta and he kicks him over into the hole.

He's going in a hole into another hole.

He's not going.

It's like a circle of holes.

You just just falling through.

Well just can't stop.

Well look at it this way.

Even though I just said it's a hole within the hole within the hole within the hole.

Keep in mind that a non-dual stage all holes that are within holes are the same thing.

So what I just said there is a bit of bullshit.

Only because how do I explain holes that are all happening all together.

I can't do that.

So I said a hole within the hole within the hole because in duality that happens all the time.

So like for example our physical bodies are only what it is because it's made up of subatomic particles and subatomic particles are within particles and particles are within atoms and atoms are within molecules and molecules are within cells and cells are within tissue and full human beings are within societies and societies are within countries and countries are within planets and planets are within a solar system and the solar system is within a galaxy.

Those are what I call holes.

H-o-l-e holes within hole within holes.

Right so if I know that was wrong but whatever.

But you can't have a molecule without a society without atoms.

You have to have atoms.

There has to be a group of atoms to create molecules and have to be a group of molecules to create cells and so on and so on and so on.

Those are called holons.

H-o-l-o-n.

Holons.

That's what I meant.

So the holon within the holon within the holon.

So you can say holes within holes within holes but it means holon within the holon within the holon.

So that everything is a holon.

Everything within the universe is a holon.

So when you have the experience of oneness of being one with absolutely everything you realize that you're the universe but not only are you the universe the whole universe itself is also a holon within God.

Yet God is also within all these holons and all that stuff is happening simultaneously and that's what happens if I could explain that with words.

So holon within the holon within the holon within the holon but at the non-dual stage all holons within holons is the holon.

It kind of reminds me of that art.

You know the art you ever see on Instagram where they keep on going in to the photo?

The digital art?

It's kind of reminds me of that but it just keeps going right?

Yeah it just keeps going.