Inner Freedom In Relationships

How can we stay connected with ourselves? In episode 9, Diana and Sheira guide us to moments of safe and empowered inner space. When we learn how to "hang out" with ourselves, we discover inner resources that make healthy, sustainable relationships possible. We tap into our energetic and psychological capacities, making room for our own suffering instead of projecting it onto others. That is when true compassion opens up for us -- and the other person.

Transcript

Hi everybody and welcome to Two Eyes Women Talking.

My name is Shira Khan.

Hi everyone.

This is Diana Zahir.

I'm so happy to be here with you and with Shira.

We've been together for 30 years as friends and students and teachers.

We're so excited to talk about the mystery and the path and this present moment.

So let's get started.

Episode 9.

Here we go.

Let's come together.

Let's practice what we learned in episode 8 about checking on ourselves,

Visiting ourselves,

Going over to our own side of the street,

Seeing what's going on over here,

Knowing that we are full of love and capacity and concern for others as well.

But we're including ourselves in a kind of two-prong awareness,

We could say.

So let's check in together.

We're all together learning.

There's this companionship and safety and there's this bold new way of remembering me,

My own existence.

Checking my breath,

Checking my body,

Checking my heart and my mind,

Noticing anything over here that wants my attention,

Knowing that I will be guided exactly where I need to go.

And doing this in little moments,

Maybe once a day.

It's a very big change internally to genuinely remember ourselves once a day.

So before we begin our conversation today and elaborate on this learning,

I'd like you to try to stand up with me.

If you can't stand up and you want to sit down or lie down,

No problem.

But if you can stand,

I want you to feel the weight of your body.

I want you to feel the weight of your body.

I want you to feel your feet in contact with the floor,

The carpet,

The tile,

The wood,

Your shoes,

Your socks.

Let yourself feel feet connected,

Grounded,

Existing.

Any sensations,

Any experiences in your feet.

Maybe you're feeling a kind of dropping in,

A comfortable heaviness starting to happen,

An experience of gravity,

Of embodiment.

And maybe it moves up into the legs.

Maybe it moves higher into the body.

It doesn't matter.

Whatever you notice is what we care about.

So as we're going through our conversation today and you shift position and you go sit down or you go lie down or maybe you want to stand again,

I want to invite you into this experience of feeling yourself vertically like a lighthouse.

Whatever imagery works for you,

A mountain,

An ancient redwood tree.

I want you to feel your own hereness.

And today we're going to incorporate the body and we're going to talk more about this remembering of our own experience and the possibility of having inner freedom while we are with others.

So let's begin our conversation.

So let's begin our conversation.

I love that metaphor about the mountain or the redwood tree.

When I'm feeling in concert with my body and friendly with my body,

I feel like I'm part of nature.

So I can relate to feeling like a tree or a mountain if that friendliness is there.

I also think it helps us feel company with something that we're not alone in our bodies.

I have a lot of people who love the lighthouse imagery,

Just the sense that I'm in a lighthouse or the lighthouse is me or the lighthouse is holding me.

There's something so friendly and heartwarming and it gives us confidence to imagine I'm here with the redwood tree or I'm being held by the mountain.

It's very reassuring.

It's very relaxing in a way.

Yeah.

I also am aware with the lighthouse metaphor,

When I'm in the presence of somebody who's uplifting to others,

It's like a lighthouse beaming out.

And I think we've all been that person sometimes.

Lifting is such a good word.

It's not how it feels.

Our legs are grounded,

Our feet are grounded,

But we feel lifted up somehow.

We can be in our bodies differently,

Like we're wearing a gorgeous gown or this beautiful outfit or we've got a crown on our head.

There's just a way our carriage feels different,

Our posture is different.

There's a way we're fully being here with a kind of regal quality or a majestic quality.

And I think that's a really important thing to remember.

A majestic quality.

So I'm really looking forward to whenever we record because the things that we're talking about,

I get to experience.

So my mind is quiet.

I feel myself looking out.

I feel myself connected to my body,

My lower half.

I wonder what the listeners are feeling too as they hear this and get to touch into what's happening in the present as we record this,

But it's now being captured.

So yeah,

I'm wondering what folks are feeling.

Well,

I think you and I both want to acknowledge the importance of this vertical experience in many ways and for many reasons,

But especially when we're talking about the merging.

Because when we unconsciously merge with someone,

We end up moving out of this space of vertical experience and feeling this regalness of who we are,

Who our true nature is,

And we end up feeling pulled into this horizontal place.

It's okay if we're enjoying the merging and we're choosing to merge,

That horizontal can feel really fun.

But when it's unconscious,

Especially if there's negative merging,

It's super uncomfortable and it's very different to feel powerless and horizontal and feel pulled at or pushed at or we're unconsciously pulling or pushing at the other.

So it's very nice we're kind of delineating this today,

What it feels like to feel vertical with myself,

With the life force or my own body and the moments when we feel pulled into battle with the other or pulled into the ripping or pulled into the misunderstanding in this horizontal way we can't get out of.

There's a lot of suffering in that.

Yeah.

I like the way you're physicalizing this because we have the phrase in our language,

Stand up for myself,

Which means to stick up for yourself and advocate for yourself.

But what is happening here,

What you've done is physicalize that into a state that we can feel and experience in our body.

Well,

It's a clue.

We're all falling asleep and waking up again and forgetting and remembering,

But if I can catch myself feeling horizontal in a way I don't like,

That can be a clue like,

Oh wow,

Maybe I'm negatively merging right now.

What if I tried one of those exercises to feel vertical again?

Yeah,

Sometimes my merging feels like I'm going over to somebody's side of the street and other times it feels like I'm lying down and then someone's steamrolling over me coming over to my side of the street.

So standing up versus lying down,

Going over versus letting somebody else go over me.

Yeah.

So I invite people to think about those phrases and see which ones apply to you.

I keep wanting to bring in this innocence that we all have.

We're not doing anything on purpose.

We're not trying to cause harm to other people and I think there's this belief when we consider hanging out in the vertical or remembering the vertical.

That I will be very unkind or I will be rejecting or I'll be stingy with my love.

So I also want people to keep watching that when you are in this lighthouse state,

When you feel this kind of quality inside you that's unusual.

Do you feel closed or is there warmth coming out of you for the other?

I think it surprises us that when we feel this good and this well,

We are actually more able to connect in a loving way.

But the mind is concerned about this radical shift.

So it's giving us conversation about be careful.

You might not be able to take care of people.

You might be neglectful.

But let's see what happens and maybe this is a point when we can talk about why this happens and why we lose this connection to ourself.

What's going on in our psyche?

Yes.

Speaking of of innocence,

So in my work with people and my understanding of my own life,

The pervasive experience of being human,

One of them is deep down feeling alone and being afraid to be alone.

So we have this part of the psyche that's called the critical voice.

Sometimes it's known as,

I use the word inner critic also to describe it and Freud identified it as the superego.

It's a protective part of our psyche.

It's a part of our psyche.

It's a protective part of our psyche.

But when it gets too upset basically,

It goes into alarm mode and then it can become destructive instead of constructive.

So it's crucial to learn how to stop it if it's hurting ourselves or others.

And to also understand how it's the critical voice that comes in and is giving us directives to merge.

It'll be the voice saying like,

You have to go over and fix that person so that this situation calms down and then you can feel calm,

Cool,

And collected again.

I think you have to really say that again,

Shira.

That is so important.

And again,

We're not judging ourselves that we have a critical voice.

This is part of our mental structure,

But this is what's behind the merging.

Can you say that again,

Maybe?

It's trying to help us alleviate the pain of the situation.

So it'll come in and say,

You need to fix this thing that the other person is doing so that you can feel connected to that person and calm in your environment again.

And a lot of times it'll say that,

It'll direct that fixing toward ourselves.

Like this thing is all your fault and you've got to fix yourself so that the other person will love you again and then you'll feel connected again.

The vitriol,

The virulence,

The aggression of the critical voice is commensurate with the pain inside.

Deep,

Deep down,

We'll do anything not to feel alone.

This is really emerging as we're understanding how attachment works in humans.

We're understanding our wiring.

So while it's important to make sure that your critical voice is not hurting you or other people or that it's not pushing you toward dangerous situations or dangerous people,

And if it is doing that,

It needs to be stopped,

Then the next step is to understand where it's coming from.

And what's exciting about what we're doing on this podcast is we're offering tools for friendliness so that it is safe to be with the vulnerable feelings,

Especially the vulnerability about feeling alone versus that deep desire to belong.

Those are two sides of the same coin.

Those are such vulnerable feelings that we have to know how to have empathy in order to feel those feelings safely.

Otherwise,

They're too overwhelming.

Yeah,

And it takes time.

It takes time and it takes companionship.

We offer that as teachers with our people.

We also want to offer that companionship on this podcast.

And in our friendship,

We want to model,

We want to be a model,

We want to be a model,

We want to model that companionship so that people can feel it and have that as a model for how to be with yourself deep down.

Yeah.

So I know we're going to have other podcasts that are dedicated to working with a critical voice and healing it and creating more inner space where we can feel ourselves and have that connection to who we really are.

But I think for today,

One way we could have this in our minds is that innocently and consciously,

We let our history keep us company so we don't feel alone and we don't feel our pain.

And the critical voice could be seen as kind of the enforcer of that relationship.

So when we're looking at something as radical as feeling vertical and feeling all the wellness in that,

Feeling the aliveness and my energy flowing,

My love flowing,

The critical voice will have no idea what to do with that and set off all the alarm systems because it's used to a certain way of helping us be on the planet and get through our day that has to do with this very historical and ancient and generational relationship to history.

Yes.

And it actually is accustomed to having us connect with others in a certain way too,

To keep us safe.

And a lot of times it's having us connect to others through merging.

And it gives us messages like,

If you don't agree with whatever this person thinks about you or says about you,

Or if you don't do exactly what this other person wants,

If you don't like what if you don't lie down and let the other person take over.

Participate in the way that you're supposed to.

That you will lose the connection.

Yeah,

That's right.

So to be vertical is going to push up against that.

Yeah.

So we're all in our history keeping each other company in history.

Huh.

It's a very thick,

Unconscious activity.

We're on automatic pilot in history.

And we're wanting you to consider a little visit to self,

A little visit to your inner harbor,

Your inner home,

Your inner sanctuary.

And one of the ways we can do that is feeling this vertical experience.

And then we can go back to the default.

We're just shifting the program so subtly for a couple of breaths.

The way you say that and the energy you bring reminds me that from a certain perspective,

It can seem like it's going to be scary to be with yourself.

It can seem like it's going to be scary to be alone.

It can seem like it's going to be very uncomfortable and negative to feel the deep feelings.

But with this framework,

We're suggesting that you be very kind as you go about it.

And we're suggesting these tools to help you have an experience of kindness so that it's safe to go in.

And we're all here together and it's brief.

I'm going to stop our conversation for just a moment so we can all check in on ourselves.

This is important material,

But it's equally important to stop and see.

How are we doing inside right now?

How are you doing with you?

How are you feeling?

Maybe you want to take a couple of breaths,

Put your hand on your heart,

Pay a little visit to yourself.

This is our integration and we're all working on it together.

And now let's go back to our conversation.

Let's go back to our conversation.

I want to add some words to what we were saying before the little break.

When we're talking about history and kind of the unconscious protective role of history to keep us company,

When I'm saying history,

I'm talking about the negative part of our historical memory.

The fun and positive and life-enhancing parts of history are fabulous.

We don't want to make those go away.

They're nourishment for us in our lives.

But this part of history that's heavy for us or too much to reconnect with,

That has the energy of suffering.

And that's really what we're trying to befriend.

In our own way,

At our own pace,

With the right kind of companionship,

We're needing to reconnect with this suffering and give it what it needs,

Give it what it didn't get,

And listen to it and hear what's in there for me.

Because when that exchange happens,

When that interaction happens,

There is this kind of alchemy energetically where space begins to arrive in us and can become part of our daily life,

Where I know myself as containing this space,

Or I know myself as this space.

And the more I visit myself,

I get to be in this space.

And then true nature can come in there,

And my life is very different.

It actually has more capacity.

There's more availability to love and to help and to feel my strength and to champion.

But without this inner space,

This inner freedom,

It's nearly impossible to find myself,

To feel myself,

Because I'm in relationship with this history,

With this suffering,

And the critical voices,

They're trying to help me.

But this is not pleasant,

And it can be very terrifying and brutal.

And brutal.

I'm having a memory come up as you're sharing this,

And so many of the sentences are ones that I wish that I had known before,

But I want to apply to the memory now.

When you say,

What did I need?

What was not there that I could bring now that would help me feel differently about it?

What did the people need who were involved to alleviate their pain?

Yeah,

Because everybody's suffering.

Unless we've befriended our suffering,

And it's been able to heal,

Most people on the planet are going through suffering right now.

Okay,

So this is a memory of one of my most intense moments of suffering from childhood,

Which I'd like to share.

And I want to say again,

I wish if my parents had known and been able to apply what we're teaching here,

It would have made a huge difference in their lives and in my life.

So my parents negatively merged constantly,

Which is to say,

They fought.

They were always in a fight.

If you think of the worst fight between your caregivers,

It was like that daily with them.

So we were on a vacation,

And we didn't have a lot of money either,

But they decided to go to a special restaurant in the Hudson Valley.

It was going to be perhaps an island of time when we would get along and have a nice experience in this special restaurant.

So it was called Despues,

By the way.

It was a French restaurant.

I don't think it's there anymore.

Anyway,

We went in and had lunch,

And then it was time to order dessert.

So I won't name names,

But one of the kids got a dessert,

And my dad didn't order one for himself.

So he started to eat one of the kids' desserts,

And the kid started crying.

The kid wanted her own dessert and didn't want my dad to eat it.

So my mother very angrily started berating my dad about eating the dessert,

And they got into a shouting match.

Everyone in the restaurant turned around and looked at us.

All the conversation stopped.

They were shouting at the top of their lungs,

And the manager had to come over and escort my dad outside.

The kids were sobbing.

My mother might have been crying.

I'm not sure.

But they would not stop fighting on their own,

And they would not stop fighting on their own,

And they were willing to bring this fight to the whole entire restaurant.

So what I remember from that is how scared I was.

I was also really embarrassed,

But the fear was about how real the discord was between them and that I couldn't be in denial of it anymore because it was so big and it was public.

So after starting to talk about this material with you,

The memory has come up again,

But I have a really different relationship with it.

By the way,

That wasn't the only time that I witnessed my dad take the dessert of someone he was supposed to be taking care of.

And when I look back and I look at his behavior.

.

.

So as a kid,

I was just so scared,

And I wished that they would stop fighting.

They were too busy fighting to protect me.

It was completely overwhelming,

But when I look back at it now,

I could see that my dad was trying to say with his behavior that he felt deprived and that he wanted some sweetness and he wanted some nourishment.

And I really feel sad for my dad.

He had a terrible lack of sweetness in his life.

So there's something about coming out of the merging,

Coming out of the fight and coming out of the history and looking at the human need of it and what was really going on underneath that makes me hold the memory very differently.

And if I could go back in time the way I'm an adult now,

I would have put my hand on my dad's shoulder and I would have looked him in the eye and I would have said,

Would you like me to buy you a hot fudge sundae?

And I would have said,

I would be happy to do that for you.

That's what he needed.

So now he's not the bad guy.

My mom was trying to protect the kids and she didn't protect my dad.

She went about it all wrong but I see what she was trying to do.

I just feel sad for everybody.

It is so sad for everybody,

For all of us when we're in that recycling of history and we don't know ourselves other than that definition,

That identity.

I'm the one who doesn't have enough sweetness and I live my life believing that it's so innocent and can cause such harm.

When we don't know who we are or we forget and then we can remember again,

There is pain inside of us and we unconsciously create pain.

It's this repetitive,

Generational cycle.

I feel so touched by your memory,

Shara,

And I appreciate you sharing the vulnerability and tenderness of it because I think so many of us have memories,

All generations of all of our family lines where we watched unhappy parents act out together because they didn't know they could do anything else and it hurts and we might have all kinds of feelings or we might have memories if people are feeling touched by this or triggered or your own lack of safety growing up or just watching the unhappiness of parents.

I just want to honor that in all of us to feel a little bit safer right now,

Put a blanket around you,

Hold a pillow,

Know that this was historical and we can breathe through it.

If there's someone in your life that you want to talk to after the podcast about it,

Maybe there was an opening in you that could get some new support.

This is the opportunity that we can learn something new.

We can learn to do something new with ourselves and that can affect all of our relationships with our parents if they're still in bodies,

With our children,

With our friends and lovers and colleagues.

If I know how to be here with me or I'm growing that muscle,

I will create new patterns on the planet.

I will create new relationship patterns that have more capacity,

They have more awareness.

We can communicate more directly like the adult part of you that could go to him and just say,

Can I buy you a hot fudge sundae?

That person is at the helm of our lives.

That's why I wanted to tell the story.

Right.

Because I want to share this alternative to merging and to share a story where when you know what is operating inside,

Deep down in the person,

Then the behavior makes sense and there can be empathy instead of just the fighting level of it.

Yeah,

We have new eyes,

Don't we?

We still want to take care of our hearts if they're feeling feelings from history.

Or our nervous systems or our bodies.

But this part of awareness,

It's so different.

I have these ahas and it's about what happened and it's about these other people.

But as we started today,

It's kind of nice we're going to end today with this idea of being vertical.

It's the lighthouse part of me that can see.

It's that redwood tree or that redwood tree or that mountain that has the capacity for this vision.

It's more expansive vision.

Yes,

And it's the story I told was about my history,

But the topic we're talking about relationships in our current lives and how to show up for ourselves first and then be in relationship with the partner.

So to know that there's stuff going on for me and there's stuff going on for my partner that's underneath this fight we're having.

Yeah.

And to make space for that.

Absolutely.

And if our parents had known,

And of course they couldn't know because they didn't get educated that way,

But if they had known about that possibility,

We might have watched very different things happen in our homes.

So that can inspire us that I can be the generation where new things happen in my home because I know how to do this with me.

More to come on this topic and many others.

I'm so glad we got to do this today.

Yes,

And I want to thank all of the listeners for engaging with us and with this material.

Have a beautiful day and a beautiful night everybody and be sure to enjoy your closeness with yourself and with everything you love.

Bye for now.

See you next time.