Feeling Lonely

Are you feeling lonely or disconnected right now? We’re here, friend. In this special episode we talk about how to deal with loneliness. We recorded this episode right before the coronavirus hit the U.S. and our Pretty Spiritual Podcast had to pause in-person recordings. We’re so grateful for the timing, because now more than ever, spiritual tools for dealing with loneliness feel really important. Join us if you are feeling alone—physically, emotionally, or spiritually. xoxo

Transcript

Thanks for joining us here on Pretty Spiritual where we're attempting the unthinkable about how to navigate this messy,

Beautiful,

Imperfect life with spiritual tools,

Principles,

And our own personal stories.

So we're not experts,

We're not religious,

We're definitely silly.

We're honest,

Real,

And willing to share.

So join us as we connect,

Bond,

And grow together.

Hey everybody.

Welcome back to Pretty Spiritual podcast.

Hello.

Hello.

I'm Annie and to my right is Ella.

Hi,

I'm Ella.

And to my left is Lindsay Pony.

Hello,

I am Lindsay.

So today- Pony.

Ryan.

Pony.

Pony.

My pony.

Okay.

We're serious.

So today our topic is loneliness.

And this was a special request from our friend Susie.

She requested this topic and we love her and we wanted to talk about it.

We love all of you.

Oh yeah,

We love all of you.

And we love Susie and we're grateful that she wrote in and shared with us about this topic and requested it.

So she lives in a really big city.

It's a city full of tons of people.

And she said that being around so many people can actually amplify the feeling of loneliness if she's not taking opposite action.

So in her message she said,

I'd like to hear about loneliness because I have felt that ache of loneliness in relationships before.

It's a weird internal perception of separation,

Maybe even like a God-sized hole.

So thank you Susie for sharing.

I relate.

Wow.

Yeah.

Ready?

So researching this topic and just preparing for it,

We want to say off the bat that solitude is completely different from loneliness.

Being physically alone doesn't mean that you're lonely.

We can be lonely with other people around us.

We can be lonely by ourselves.

And Dr.

Stephanie Cacioppo.

.

.

Beautiful attempt,

Beautiful.

Dr.

Stephanie Cacioppo is the director of the Brain Dynamics Lab at the University of Chicago and she studies loneliness.

She's a neuroscientist and that is her study is loneliness.

There's a great interview that is on the tools page of our website,

Prettyspiritualpodcast.

Com.

So you can read that.

There's also a terrific interview with her now deceased husband,

Dr.

John Cacioppo.

And they actually studied loneliness together.

They're both neuroscientists,

Really kind of cool.

But Cacioppo defines loneliness as a state of mind characterized by a dissociation between what an individual wants or expects from a relationship and what that individual experiences in that relationship.

So essentially loneliness is perceived isolation.

Loneliness doesn't discriminate.

It can impact anyone.

The doctor shared that one in three Americans is impacted by loneliness.

One in 12 is severely impacted.

And the researchers said that loneliness is actually contagious and it progresses over time,

It worsens.

So the example that her husband,

Who's now deceased,

Dr.

John Cacioppo shared is,

Let's say that you and I are neighbors and we're friends,

But I have become lonely for some reason.

As a suddenly lonely person,

I'm now more likely to deal with you cautiously,

Defensively,

And as a potential threat to me because you might leave or somehow add to my pain.

And the neighbor,

You,

Recognize that.

So we're going to have more and more negative social reactions,

Even if they're really subtle.

And then over three or four years,

We're more likely to stop being friends.

So that's one less friendship or connection for both of us.

To just wrap up this intro,

Loneliness is linked with a 26 per se increase in odds of premature mortality.

So that means lonely people are more likely to die sooner.

And I just want to say that all this sounds really depressing,

But also it's a fact of life for a lot of people and information like this can often help us move towards a solution.

So whether you have ongoing loneliness or you're experiencing it suddenly right now,

We just want to talk about what loneliness has been like in our own lives and then share tools that work for us.

And also we want to say that we love you and you're not alone.

So Pony,

Why don't you start us off and share about your experiences with loneliness?

What an uncomfortable treat to get to share with you all about loneliness today.

Thank you so much.

And yeah,

Annie sent this text this morning and doing all this research for this over the past couple of days and loneliness,

I was feeling so much gratitude because what we have created between the three of us,

Like searching and wanting to grow spiritually and wanting to find wellness and then how that was the connection that we had together and formed and found out how much growing we could do when the structure was safe and friendly and loving and how that just kept growing and getting bigger.

Just like with how I think that loneliness and isolation is that loop that kind of feeds into itself.

I also feel the same way,

Building that community,

Getting those friends,

Getting the people that you connect with,

Want to grow with is really,

Really important.

And I'm so glad that all of you are here and that we're together and that we're talking about this and that you're listening and we're here for you.

I just really wanted to extend that,

That we're here for you and that what we're building here and why we're doing this is truly just to connect with you all.

And so thank you for being here.

And please reach out to us always whenever we're so.

.

.

Usually for me what happens when I see one of the listener emails come through is like I'm having a really difficult time and then I see that email and it's just like reminds me of that vital connection and much needed moments.

So we'll always respond to you and we'll be so comforted and buoyed up by your communication with us.

Yeah,

What was really cool in researching about this was that loneliness has its evolutionary place.

Loneliness is a piece of biology that functions to help us recognize our social needs.

Before modern times,

Back when we lived in tribes,

We knew 50 to 100 people and we would know them our whole lives and we would depend on them and we would have to stay connected and collaborate to ensure that we would live and survive.

That was how we continued on.

So to have this biological adaptation that starts signaling to us when we start to lose the connection with other people is really old and ancient and was very useful for the times.

So now in these modern times,

What it's like to feel loneliness,

I really appreciate the listener who wrote in and talked about the internal perception of separation and this perceived isolation because if we've evolved and we don't need the loneliness cue as much because as you know,

We're more connected than we ever have been before.

But if we're not tapping into that vulnerable,

Bigger piece underneath all of this,

Then we just get into the loop of I'm isolated,

I'm becoming more isolated.

So just as I was reflecting and touching on this and thinking about loneliness in my own modern life and what that feels like and just how grateful I am to have the communities that I've reached out to and these women in my life and then what we've tried to build here and really connect and bond and grow together,

Which has been our ultimate goal.

If we could just help one person to not feel alone and realizing how much we grow in a loving environment,

That's really our aim here.

But I'm dancing around the subject because I certainly don't want to talk about this.

So let me get inside the rib cage,

Drop down.

The loneliness piece for me,

My friend calls me a really good people collector.

And I always think that's so nice that she thinks that.

But it's to say that I had to really kind of drop in and have some time with myself to recognize where the loneliness piece is for me.

I thought about all the ways I find myself lonely in a world in rooms full of friends and communities and busy social interactions daily.

The place that I find myself most lonely,

Spoiler alert,

I am going to talk about the relationship to my mother.

This is an easy place that used to be a lot more sticky for me.

And I just want to say that because it's gotten better before I could never touch into this or recognize or look at or not cry every day.

So this is growth,

Being able to show up and talk about how disconnected and isolated I feel.

And I think that's what they were talking about,

Like this perceived isolation.

Because in modern times now,

It's not,

I'm not going to be like left alone and not survive.

But I feel disconnected from my peers.

You know,

I feel really alone that I don't have this relationship with my mom.

And I don't have that support.

I don't the loneliness and the loss of never knowing what a connected,

Healthy mother daughter relationship is.

And now with her ailing health,

It's like becoming more real and evidence this whole other layer of that I won't ever have this,

You know.

I can't even fantasize that like,

One day she's just going to show up and supply that connection and love and stability that I see my peers receiving.

And this is a really deep loneliness that aches in dark corners.

And I don't have a lot of people to talk to about it.

And that makes the loneliness seem like even bigger.

It's that that disconnection,

Right?

It's that not being able to collaborate and have that social interaction piece that makes me feel different.

And so then I kind of recede back and into darker corners.

So if loneliness is a signal for me to pay attention to my social needs,

I can really start asking like,

What are my social needs in this situation?

This ancient pain could just be the remnants of what once meant death.

Now in this modern time,

It's simply means specific attention to this area could help me to relieve this pain.

And I will talk more about how to do that maybe hopefully in the tool section.

Sweet.

We love you so much.

We do love you.

Thank you so much for sharing.

Thanks for having us.

Thank you so much for sharing things with us.

Thank you.

We love you so much.

Miss Ella,

What do you have to share about loneliness?

Let it out.

Let it out.

Let the tears flow.

Man,

I have a lot to say about this.

I experienced such pervasive loneliness and like even I want to use the word alienation.

I think that's a for me,

That's a word that really captures it in a different way.

And I think alienation is a word,

At least to my heart,

That captures the kind of world we live in today where we're so connected and we're so alienated at the same time.

And I mean,

Like human biology hasn't had a chance to catch up to like what this world is that we're living in today.

And so it makes sense that we don't know how to connect given like the way technology connects us in maybe a superficial way,

But doesn't satisfy the like deep human need for connection.

Or at least I don't really know how to use technology to get that.

Maybe it's possible.

I don't know how,

Please let me know.

Slide on into our DMs right away.

I'm just going to throw in that maybe this podcast is a positive way to use technology to connect.

We can hope.

We are hoping.

I love it.

Love your enthusiasm.

Love your energy.

So what it was like for me when I was living this way is that I would have like a really dysfunctionally attached relationship with like one other person,

Usually a sex partner or a slash.

I don't want to say boyfriend because people made clear that they were not my boyfriend.

A hostage type situation.

And then I just wouldn't interact with other people and I would have this one relationship that I relied on to like meet all of my needs,

Which of course is not possible.

And then what happened is I ended up in this community at this monastery and it's very isolated.

So it's like a 14 mile dirt road to get in and out.

You don't like if you're coming in,

You're coming in,

You know,

You don't end up there by accident.

During the summer,

There are like a couple hundred humans in the valley,

Many fewer than that during the winter and spring practice periods.

So I was in this really uncomfortable place where all of a sudden people were like really getting to see everything.

And I was so uncomfortable because like you can't hide when you live like that.

You're in the middle of nowhere with a bunch of people.

And so people see what's going on behind the scenes.

And like I don't even know how to use words to talk about how uncomfortable it was for me.

Like I would rather how it felt at the time is like I would rather die than let people see me be depressed and not be able to get out of bed or be in a cycle of like binging and purging that I wanted to hide from people and like a whole bunch of dysfunction around food.

It was like all of a sudden all this was broadcast to my community and it was so uncomfortable.

And at the same time,

It was exactly the medicine I needed.

And I never would have chosen it for myself.

But I like ended up in this place where I didn't actually have a choice about what people were going to get to see about me.

Community ended up being this like incredibly healing experience and learning how to be part of a community that I did actually want to belong to.

That was also a really incredible experience and learning how to be a person who was okay letting people see her and pretty much all circumstances was also a really healing thing because I started to realize that the parts of myself that I wanted to hide from other people or even from myself,

We all have those.

And there was so much grace and humility for me in like some days I get to be the person who falls apart and like lets other people put her back together and other days it's someone else's turn to do that.

And it's my job to show up and be there for that person.

But anyway,

Learning how to do that was an incredible experience.

And now the way loneliness feels is what you,

How you were defining it and it was really helpful for me because it's this place where I seek comfort and understanding usually from a certain person,

Usually in a certain way and I don't get it.

What is remarkable for me about it is that when I give myself the space to look,

I actually am receiving comfort and understanding and love.

I'm just not getting it in the way that I want from the person that I want and I'll talk about what that experience is like for me and how I meet it with spiritual tools.

The last thing I wanted to say,

There is an organization called the Cost of Loneliness Project and we'll put that on the tools page too.

They have received funding from government agencies because people in power actually recognize that loneliness is a public health crisis.

People who are sick with loneliness are the people who show up at school with a gun.

There is an actual crisis being caused by loneliness and it's a place where I think it's really important to invest energy and understanding and compassion because we all experience that and left untreated,

It can take us to some really dark places.

It took me to some really dark places where I just didn't want to be alive anymore and I don't think that's,

Unfortunately,

I don't think that's a very uncommon experience today.

Anyway,

I'm glad we're talking about this as uncomfortable as it is and if you're feeling lonely,

I hope that it can be comforting to hear that you're not alone.

You're really not alone.

Thank you,

Ella.

So tender.

I know.

Annie,

Would you like to share with us what it's like to be lonely or experience?

Thank you.

Pony,

I related to what you said about,

Use the word people collector,

But in your notes,

You'd said human friend collector and I love that because I love people and I love the connection of friendship and I really look to form bonds with people.

It's just natural for me.

So the periods of loneliness in my life are typically during periods when I felt really guarded and scared and I didn't want to let people see what I thought were undesirable parts of me or maybe I didn't want to stop a behavior I knew that people wouldn't quote approve of.

I felt that loneliness because I had either consciously or unconsciously created separation between me and other people and I was kind of hiding.

And I guess I had some internal loneliness,

So separate from the external loneliness,

But an internal loneliness because I was separating or denying some part of myself inside.

There was a refusal to let all of me be there.

It was as though I thought if I just don't acknowledge this part of myself to myself,

Then there's no problem.

Classic.

Love it.

So an especially confusing and lonely time for me was during that first year after I got help and stopped drinking.

And in that time,

I was really lonely.

I had a lot of friends.

I lived in this really fabulous community house,

But I never talked to anyone about this major transition of learning to live as a sober person.

I was ashamed and confused by it and I kept myself separate from other people who were on the same journey being sober.

So this whole new part of me was emerging and I wasn't letting any sunlight onto it or what I was becoming.

And when I spent time around other people who were working to be sober,

I actively would not connect.

Like I felt apart from them.

I wouldn't make eye contact at gatherings.

I was just like,

Do not get near me.

If I did attempt to have some coffee with someone from this new community,

I felt really weird and guarded.

So this wasn't intentional,

But I was scared and there was something inside of me that thought that this was a way to protect myself.

Like I didn't consciously think I'm not going to make eye contact.

I'm going to steer clear of these people,

But it just,

There was this part of me that wasn't able to be seen yet.

And so that was my solution was this disconnect.

So I'm not merging with this one community,

But then at the same time,

I wasn't letting friends,

Like long childhood friends and family see where I was.

You know,

I pretended everything was fine,

That I wasn't confused and uncertain.

I barely told anyone that I was in this process of healing from alcohol,

You know,

Because I just,

I felt different and disconnected.

So the doctor that I referenced at the beginning,

Dr.

John Cacioppo really stressed that to heal from loneliness,

People need confidence.

He calls it a rich reciprocal bond.

I really like that rich reciprocal bond.

So it means you're giving as good as you're getting.

So it's not just,

It can't be,

Although relationships like therapists and things like this are incredibly helpful,

They can't replace the rich reciprocal bond because the therapist you're just receiving.

Whereas when I have these confidants and I'm letting them see me,

I'm showing them as much as they're showing me.

So it's this two way street of helping and being helped.

And so I was essentially,

You know,

The example I just shared,

I was totally cutting myself off from having that kind of relationship with someone on this really huge part of my life journey.

And I was trying to go it alone basically,

Which was a super old tool.

So when we get to the tools,

I'll share some tools because it turns out going it alone doesn't cure loneliness.

Wait a minute.

What?

That's stupid.

My plan.

My whole investment in life is crumbling.

So Pony,

Talk to us about your tools.

Thank you both so much for what you shared.

And Ella,

I liked,

I don't know if I liked it,

But when you were talking about.

.

.

I'm a confidant,

You guys.

That's right.

Thank God.

The piece about where I want this person to fulfill these needs that I have,

And I want this one person to fulfill them specifically in a certain way.

So for me,

What my tool looks like,

Going along with that is that I recognizing that I am my greatest self healer.

I have the ability to show up and provide the healing and resources and power that I need myself.

And it takes a lot of steps.

There's a lot of things along the way to even figure out how to recognize this and know this.

But if you could just trust me for a minute that it's true,

Then when I'm feeling this loneliness,

This really aching,

These needs that are creating more feelings,

More beliefs,

I try to pinpoint what fundamental need for connection is not being met right now.

What are the resources and tools I need to meet this need?

How can I get this need for companionship and connection met?

In my personal experience,

Talking about my mom,

One of the last conversations that she was really able to have really helped me because she was really upset.

She was really sad.

And she just kept saying,

I just miss my mom.

I just miss my mom.

And her mom had been passed for a while.

And her mom was,

She was a lot like my mom.

She did the best she could,

But she wasn't able to be a mom.

And what I heard from my mom that day was how much we long for that.

And how much she couldn't even recognize that she was longing for that need,

That need of that connection,

Of feeling those things.

And I'm so grateful for that conversation.

I'm so glad because I realized that I too could go on really hoping that one day if I said the right thing or did the right thing,

That that's when this person was going to be able to show up and be that person that I needed.

And what has happened now is how I get that mother need met.

There are lots of ways that I do this,

But I see that there's a deficit.

I see that I need this connection in a real motherly way and I get that met by,

I love everybody else's moms.

I love them so much.

I try and have relationships with moms.

My professional job is I try to take care of moms by taking care of their children.

That has been really fulfilling in a way that has clicked in some of the pieces for me.

It's that connection.

I am providing what I needed myself.

I go to a self-help group that is only old women.

I go there and I talk about how sad I am about my mom and how much I don't have all these things.

And then I get invited to Christmas dinner.

And I have all of these women who show up and really,

Really love me and they share intimately with me and they show me that there are ways to get older and that I can be a functioning human and older adult later on.

This is a very personal story for me.

So I'm not sure what your cure for loneliness is.

I don't know the ways that you are lonely.

It's so personal that my best tool for you is to just take some time and trust that if you sit with and really explore and excavate,

You can look and see what you're needing.

And then hopefully you can find some ways to be able to show up and get those needs met.

Some of the things that I saw online,

Take a colleague out to coffee if you like your coworkers or even if you don't,

Get out there.

I think about volunteering is such a great way to go and make some connections.

Look for people.

What are you interested in?

Are you super into cosplay?

Do you?

What is it but you're too afraid or you're too lazy?

Oftentimes I'm like,

One of the things I'm doing right now is I'm saying yes to one thing a month.

I am getting out there and doing one thing even though I'm happy at home or whatever it is.

Like going to improv?

Yeah.

It's like Annie and I are trying out for improv.

I think you guys are the bravest people I have ever met.

Exactly.

So it's just there's so many things that you could try and do and explore that put yourself in a compromising position that's really scary and awkward.

That's my plan.

That's my whole plan.

I wanted to shout out to the spiritual friendly episode that we have because there are so many tips and tools on there on how to build community,

How to make friends,

How to show up authentically and like being vulnerable because when you open that door,

Someone else will do it right back with you.

It has been my experience.

That's so great.

Thank you so much,

Pony.

Perfect.

How about you,

Ella?

Yeah.

I'm so glad we're talking about this.

So I've been trying to remember the details of this particular incident.

And I think it was around a time a year and a half or so ago where for six or eight weeks I thought I had cancer and I had gotten some test results back from doctor that were there were levels that were indicative of a particular kind of cancer.

And I ended up not having cancer,

Thankfully,

But there was so much feeling that came up around it and this really deep kind of like existential feeling of loneliness on top of my relationships with other human beings had taken on this incredibly deep quality where I was like so heartbroken and like the most beautiful way by like love between human beings and like,

You know,

Thinking about you guys or my parents and I would just cry because it was like so tender.

I was also watching The Handmaid's Tale,

Which I can just say in public now I have no business watching though I plan to continue watching it.

That was also having quite a tremendous impact on me.

And I remember one night really wanting comfort from my ex.

He had said something when I expressed feeling around something from the show that made me feel like extra alienated.

And so I really wanted this one person to show up for me and instead of doing that he was doing like the opposite of like,

That's what it felt like.

And so I was basically up all night crying.

So cute and fun.

At some point I got to this like really desperate place where there was nothing left to reach for but whatever that thing was inside myself,

My spirit,

My higher power,

My higher self,

Whatever that deep,

Deep,

Deepest connection is.

And I wish for myself and for others who work this way that there was some other path to access that.

Like I wish we didn't have to suffer so much to be willing to tap into the safety and love and comfort and understanding that exists in that place.

But at the end of the day,

That was the only place I was getting it.

And when I was desperate enough,

I finally reached for it there.

And when it all falls apart,

That's when I get to meet the deepest part of myself.

And that's the part where I find that the comfort and love and understanding I'm seeking from outside myself actually exists inside myself.

And it hurts a lot to get there but it's this very deep and inexhaustible well.

It's like one of my friends at the time said,

She's like,

You're trying to squeeze water out of a rock,

You're like dying of thirst and then you look down and you're standing in a river.

And it's like we just,

It's just this like simple shift in orientation that allows us to see what's available to us and it's not in the place we're trying to get it from and it looks different than what we expected but there it is.

And the other,

So that's one tool is suffer deeply until you're willing to look down and see that you're standing in a river.

So simple,

So fun.

It's worth it turns out.

How thirsty are you?

And then the other,

None of the neither of these is a simple tool,

I apologize.

But take the incredibly uncomfortable,

Vulnerable actions like Lindsay was saying that ensure your belonging in your chosen community and that means you show up,

You like show up at the same time,

Week after week,

Month after month,

Same group,

You let people get to know you,

You tell the truth about where you're at and you let it be vulnerable and gross and uncomfortable.

And you show up for other people and you let them show up for you and you,

It helps to have a commitment there so people are expecting to see you.

It helps to have like a actual individual buddy or maybe a couple of them who bring accountability into the mix and just be with people in all of your emanations and let yourself be seen,

Let yourself connect,

Let yourself just be held by these people and see what happens when you share and connect and bond with people.

It's such a,

For me,

It's meant that in situations where I feel like a monster,

I felt that way last night and I dragged myself out of bed where I was comforting myself with Netflix and brought myself to this place where I've been practicing doing all those actions and I just,

I felt so salty and pissed off and I couldn't,

I wasn't allowed to be around people because I was toxic or whatever.

I just went anyway and I got and told the truth about how I was feeling and got met with so much love and understanding and people relating and I just can't say enough about how great that feels,

Especially when a lot of us have been brought up in a way where it's like,

If you feel like that,

Then you don't get to be around people.

That is BS.

Go share your saltiness with others.

I love that tool.

Also before modern times,

It wasn't about this rugged individualism.

Our culture has shifted from us being together and help each other and working into this,

What I consider kind of false ideology of we're rugged individuals who handle all of this,

Do all of this on their own and that has not been the space for me to be able to grow at all.

It's not even a real thing,

Turns out.

Those are some great tools.

I love a salty tool.

These tools I'm going to share,

Usually I share things that I'm working on,

But these are actually directly from Dr.

Stephanie and Dr.

John Cacioppo and my apologies to these people if I am doing this last name wrong.

I want to share these tools and call this out because they're honestly the tools that we talk about and experiment with all the time.

This is the cool thing about what we're doing here with the podcast,

What you are doing in your life listening to this podcast and then also out in the world,

What all of us are doing.

These tools really are universal towards creating love and connection.

In my language,

I call it spirituality.

These doctors,

The neuroscientists,

They call it science,

But they work.

These are tools from two neuroscientists whose life work is studying loneliness.

Again,

You can read about these tools on the tools page of our website.

This is a direct quote from the woman.

Interconnection,

Connection and interaction.

First,

Stay connected and make a daily effort to express gratitude.

Next,

Do something helpful or nice for others without expecting anything in return.

Collaborate with others and work together in harmony.

Volunteer to help people in need.

Choose to engage with people,

Including strangers on different levels and on a broad range of topics and listen to them.

Finally,

Share positive news rather than negative information and expect the best from people.

Essentially,

It's building those rich reciprocal bonds.

Always we say with the caveat,

Do it with healthy boundaries because I know that us and a lot of people who listen struggle with things like codependency,

But a rich reciprocal bond isn't one person giving more than the other.

It's a two-way flow.

Holy mackerel,

I feel like with that quote,

She just summed up our entire podcast series.

Cool.

We're done.

It's great.

Goodbye forever.

Or are we secretly neuroscientists and we just didn't know?

Oh,

We know.

Hashtag killing it.

That's what we have to share today about loneliness.

It might change tomorrow,

But we would love to hear from you.

We would also love your help if you would rate and or review us on Apple Podcasts.

We would be so grateful.

We want to build this community.

Yeah,

That is how we build the community and we will never be featured or be able to be on other things if we don't have a certain number of reviews.

That's totally fine,

But in the effort of us connecting and growing together,

That's really the only reason why we're having that request.

Only if it's real and authentic for you,

If that happens,

Great,

And if not,

Also great.

Also great.

We're glad that you're here.

We love you.

You can also connect with us on social media,

Pretty Spiritual Podcast.

Can't wait to meet then.

We love you.

Bye.

Reviews

I'm going to be honest as you all were which I LOVED. I didn't have high hopes for this but how wrong I was. I felt so connected with you all especially Pony as I have similar issues with my mum. I croed with you when you talked and wanted to hug you. You seem real and genuine which is really special. Also looming at your beautiful ladies I'd never think you could be lonely and I know that sounds crazy because anyone can but not everyone talks about it as most like to portray a perfect life that look a certain way. So thank you for that and sharing such vulnerabilities x

Thank you for this🙏🫂 A supportive talk with compassionate messaging. Im checking out your podcast, also great.

This is so helpful - I'm working on changing to accept love in the different places it is but it's ongoing. I listen to this podcast often and usually leave using a different tool than what I'd been focused on after the last session. Thank you ladies!

I am so grateful to have individuals like the three of you who share from a place of authenticity in times of vulnerability with myself. This was beautiful, as all of your podcasts are. Thank you and I love you!

I love how you tell stories that you personally experienced. You lift me up listening to you 😊🌺💖🌸🦋🤣

I love how you tell stories that you personally experienced. You lift me up listening to you 😊🌺💖🌸🦋🤣

This was the most useful information and communication about loneliness I have ever experienced. Thank you! There were so many useful takeaways.

First time listening to these authentic women. It is not easy to share really deep vulnerable feelings with us, listeners who have not met you yet. I hope your show goes far!