I Am That Chapter 19 - Reality Lies In Objectivity Part 4

Listen to Ektaji talk about Nisargadatta Maharaj's book I Am That. Nisargadatta Maharaj was a teacher who did not propound any ideology or religion, but gently unwrapped the mystery of the self. I Am That preserves his dialogs with the followers who came from around the world seeking guidance in destroying false identities.

Transcript

Is I Am and There Is the Same?

Is I Am and There Is the Same?

In other words,

Is Amness and Isness the same?

So Maharaj says,

I Am denotes the inner,

There Is the outer.

Both are based on the sense of being.

The being to be.

First there is that recognition in pure consciousness,

In the higher witness,

The first reflection appears.

There is the sense of I Am.

So first there is Amness,

I Am.

That is the inner,

Because it is the first reflection in the mirror.

Now that reflection itself reflects in the next mirror.

So then now you see the next reflection.

The I Am attaches to this and that.

Now that becomes the outer.

So the first reflection is Amness.

The next reflection is Isness.

I Am and There Is.

Very clear?

First reflection in the mirror,

If you have the mirror,

Look in the mirror.

The first reflection,

The direct reflection of your face.

That direct reflection,

The first one is I Am.

And then when you see the reflection of that reflection,

Then you see There Is and then you see many,

It's not There Is,

There Are multiple.

Do you see that?

I Am denotes the inner.

There is the outer.

Both are based on the sense of being.

So questioner says,

Is it the same as the experience of existence?

Maharaj says,

To exist means to be something.

A thing,

Feeling,

A thought,

An idea.

All existence is particular.

Please highlight that.

In short,

What is he saying?

To be this or that.

That is the meaning of existence.

To be a thing,

To be an idea,

To be a thought,

To be this or that.

All existence is particular.

Only being is universal.

In the sense that every being is compatible with every other being.

Existences clash,

Being never.

Existence means becoming,

Change,

Birth and death and birth again.

While in being there is silent peace.

Now you have to look in the mirror again.

Now turn towards your mirror.

Ask yourself,

Am I the one that is reflecting in the mirror?

Or am I the one that is being reflected?

This is me or that is me?

This is me,

Which means the sense of being.

If you focus on the reflection of the mirror,

You are focusing outward.

If you focus towards the one that is being reflected,

You experience the sense of being.

Is that clear?

That is the same sense of being that you have in waking state,

Dream state and even in the deep sleep state.

Do you get it?

That sense of being is always constant.

It is always there.

That sense of being does not say I.

You are sensing yourself.

The sense of being.

The sense of being is first.

Then that says I am,

Which is the first reflection.

The first reflection in the multiple reflections.

The first one that you see in the mirror.

That is I am.

The others are there is or there are.

This sense of being.

Now hold on to this sense of being while I read the sentence again.

To exist means to be something.

Now look at that first reflection.

It is something.

It has a name and it has a form.

The first reflection in the mirror has a name.

It has a form.

It is something.

It is a thing,

A feeling,

A thought,

An idea.

So that is the meaning of to exist,

To become.

You get it?

The first reflection in the mirror is existence.

All existence is particular.

Only being is universal.

So now come back to this that is being reflected.

Come back to the sense of being.

This way.

Not outwards,

Inwards.

Come back to the sense of being.

Only being is universal.

In the sense that every being is compatible with every other being.

That sense of being is the same.

Every being is compatible with every other being.

Because that sense of being doesn't have the label Shailaja.

It doesn't have a name.

The reflection in the mirror,

The Nama Rupa in the mirror has a name.

Are you seeing that?

So that which is in the mirror is existence.

This is the being.

The sense.

Are you getting it?

Not the body-mind that is looking in the mirror.

Look beyond the body-mind.

Look beyond the thought.

Look beyond the idea even.

That sense of being.

That is the being.

This is the existence.

Very clear?

Difference between being and existence?

That sense of being is universal.

The sense of being does not have a name.

It's not called Satyan or it's not called Shailaja.

It doesn't have an identity.

It doesn't have a personal identity.

It does not say I also.

The sense of I am says I and holds on to the idea that I am Shailaja or the Nama Rupa.

The name and form.

Very clear?

The moment I hold on to name and form,

That is called existence.

When I'm devoid of holding anything,

That is called the being.

All existence is particular.

That's the meaning of it.

Only being is universal.

In that sense that every being is compatible with every other being.

Existences clash.

Now you can see this very clearly.

Existences clash.

All name and form clashes.

Being never.

The being never clashes.

Existence means becoming.

Change.

Birth and death and birth again.

While in being there is silent peace.

Very very clear?

This is a moment to moment birth and death that he is talking about.

He is not talking about the birth of this body that happened so many years ago.

There is no proof of that.

Moment to moment it disappears.

Moment to moment there is no recognition.

Moment to moment there is no recognition of the body.

Now that I'm talking about the body,

Now you're feeling the body.

That means it had died.

Now it is reborn again.

Again in some time when you get lost in the Advaitin worlds,

Again you lose the consciousness of the body.

It dies again.

So perception of the body is gone again.

Same object.

Forget an external object.

This object that I used to consider as I,

This vanishes moment to moment,

Moment to moment,

Moment to moment.

So birth and death and birth again.

This keeps going on.

This happens only to existence.

Not to being.

Very clear difference between existence and beingness.

Questioner says,

I create the world.

Why have I made it bad?

Maharaj says,

Everyone lives in his own world.

Not all the worlds are equally good or bad.

So questioner says,

What determines the difference?

Maharaj says,

The mind that projects the world,

Colors it,

Its own way.

When you meet a man,

He's a stranger.

When you marry him,

He becomes your own self.

When you quarrel,

He becomes your enemy.

It is your mind's attitude that determines what he is to you.

Are you seeing this?

Your own mind projects the waking world.

It is not some external mind.

It is not some external force.

It is not some external God.

Your mind projects the waking world.

And you see it.

You see what you project.

You perceive after projection.

Same person is my darling,

My beloved.

And in a few days,

The same person becomes the enemy.

And it changes.

Again,

The person becomes a darling,

A beloved.

Again,

The person becomes enemy.

This keeps going on.

So the story projection is all mine.

Questioner says,

I can see that my world is subjective.

Now you understand subjective?

A slave of my likes and dislikes.

Subjective.

I can see that my world is subjective.

Does it make it also illusory?

I can see that my world is subjective.

Does it make it also illusory?

Very important question.

Okay,

I see that I create my own waking world situation.

I created my situation with my family member,

With my colleagues,

My work,

My money.

I created.

I made the big mistake.

Okay,

Okay.

I agree.

Yes,

Yes.

All this is subjective.

But how does that prove it is illusory?

I really lost that much money.

Oh,

I really lost my job.

Oh,

I really had a bad time in this relationship.

It's not working out.

How is it illusory?

Yeah,

Valid question.

So,

Does it being subjective make it illusory?

Maharaj says,

It is illusory as long as it is subjective.

And to that extent only.

Reality lies in objectivity.

Yes,

My reality is that I am the higher witness.

And it is not subjective.

It is not I am a separate higher witness and you are a separate higher witness and I like this higher witness and I don't like that higher witness.

No.

How can you divide space?

How can you divide infinity?

We are all the same infinity.

There is no we actually.

It's just for the purpose of communication that we,

The word we is used.

There is no we.

These are all images,

You know.

Look back into the mirror.

It's that image,

Image,

Image,

Image,

Image.

The names and forms,

Names and forms that you see multiple.

That's all.

That is all me.

All me.

All me.

There is no other.

Yes,

And I have given names to these other forms of me.

I call them by different names.

I project all of them.

I label them differently.

Then I believe in that story.

I hold on to that story.

I say this story gives me grief or this story gives me pleasure.

And then I say now how is it illusory?

I created the story from scratch.

I'm standing in front of the mirror,

Front of two mirrors.

I created the whole infinite name and form in front of me.

And then I say,

How is it illusory?

You see the essence because it is subjective.

The moment I start with this is who I am.

This is what I am.

The belief that the ego comes up with and that it holds on to that belief and then says this other person should not behave like this with me.

I am so and so.

And then blah,

Blah,

Blah.

This is my own.

This is the other.

Then attraction,

Propulsion,

Love,

Hate,

Repulsion,

Acceptance.

All these opposites come into play.

All came into play from that little sense of I am.

One more step beyond this sense.

One more step beyond the higher witness.

And then all this falls.

You see all of this becomes subjective after the sense of I am.

The sense of I am attaches to this and that and makes everything subjective.

The moment you let all of this fall,

It falls like a domino effect.

It has a domino effect.

It's not that one day I will realize.

One day the domino of the thought will fall.

Then the domino of the body will fall.

Then the domino of the world will fall.

Then I will see Jagat Mithya.

No.

No.

No,

No.

There is no one day.

It all happens.

No.

This moment in one go.

There is nothing like progressive enlightenment.

It will happen in progressive steps through the ages.

This is all belief created on the Dwaitam Path.

No.

This moment I see it.

This moment.

I see this moment.

The only thing that I have to let go is past belief.

All those stories that I am holding on to.

That is the only job left.

Letting it go.

Letting it go.

Because the ego again and again goes and holds on to it and says my belief of 45,

55,

65 years there is a God.

How can I let it go?

So I was foolish for 55 years,

65 years,

75 years of my life.

No,

No.

I am not foolish.

I am the intelligent one.

I am the wise one of the family.

Ego is not ready to let go of the belief.

Because whatever attachments,

Subjective.

Do you see that?

So the sense of I am starts the whole domino effect.

The sense of I am once it collapses all else collapses.

All subjective ideas collapse including the belief of God.

My belief in this guru or belief in this religion and belief that I am a spiritual person.

I,

I,

I,

All the I's collapse.

Every single I collapses.

When I collapses,

You have to collapse.

You are nothing but a reflection of the I.

If I collapses,

You have to collapse.

Then what is left?

Reality.

Reality is in objectivity.

It is Vastu Nishtha.

It is no Atma Nishtha there.

No fears,

No desires,

No I,

Mine.

No stories of I and mine.

Clear?

The last part.

Questioner says what does objectivity mean?

You said the world is subjective and now you talk of objectivity.

Is not everything subjective?

Maharaj says everything is subjective but the real is objective.

Very clear?

Only after the sense of I am everything becomes subjective but the real,

The higher witness,

Primordial awareness,

Shunyata is objective.

The real is objective.

Questioner says in what sense?

Maharaj says it does not depend on memories and expectations.

So question for you.

Does shunyata depend on memories?

Does shunyata depend on expectations?

Does shunyata depend on desires and fears,

Likes and dislikes?

All is seen as it is.

It is what it is.

Means what?

Moment to moment I recognize I am shunyata and in shunyata every image is getting sucked in.

Moment to moment I see every thought is getting sucked in.

Even the thought that said I am this and I am that.

That which is my existence,

The becoming,

That gets sucked in and disappears.

Do you see this?

All is as it is.

I start seeing truth moment to moment.

Is it what you call the fourth state,

Turiya?

Very good question.

Maharaj says call it as you like.

It is solid,

Steady,

Changeless,

Beginningless and endless.

Ever new and ever fresh.

Question says how is it reached?

Please highlight.

Desirelessness and fearlessness will take you there.

Why desirelessness and fearlessness?

Because desires and fears belong to?

The sense of I.

The sense of I attaches to I am fearful of this.

I want this.

This is fear and desire.

The moment you drop the this and that,

I cannot stand alone.

I also dissolves.

Then you get there.

Shunyata.

Simple.

Short cut.

Clear?

The consciousness itself recognizes itself and the sense of I am appears.

Simple.

But it does recognize that much is there.

So that is taken as a desire by some scriptures.

Some saints have called it the first desire.

The first desire is to be.

That is why you will notice you have the craving to exist.

To be.

Where does this stem from?

Even in a person who is terminally ill.

Yes?

And has never done spirituality and believes that he is this body-mind and believes now very.

.

.

It's very clear the doctors have told him you have only a few more months.

He feels I am going to die.

He's been suffering.

He's not been living for the past so many years of his life.

He's been bedridden.

Still there is that desire to want to exist.

Yes?

Where does it stem from?

From here.

Consciousness has that desire to be and that's how the sense of I am comes in.

So it's the first desire,

The first cause.

That is I am.

That is the meaning of I am.

And that is why a terminally ill person a terminally ill person also despite being bedridden living like a vegetable has the desire to exist.

It's ingrained.

So that's where the first desire comes from.

You drop even that desire to exist.

Just let go.

That is the true meaning of Vairagya.

Desire to money and relationships,

Family this is petty.

Nothing it is.

Even the desire to exist when that drops that is true Vairagya.

Then only do you recognize I am pure consciousness.

You recognize your true state.

This is the last step of Jagat Mithya.

The last step.

When this falls off completely then you have completed the journey.

There is no more desire to even be.

Yet there is no revulsion to it.

There is no attraction.

There is no revulsion.

That is Vairagya.

The highest kind of Vairagya.

Paramavairagya.

Clear?

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