Q&A: Kindness & Wisdom Practice

Retreat Day 2: A wide range of practical questions related to kindness and wisdom meditation practice in a retreat setting. Kindness and wisdom meditation focuses on Metta practice and the 6Rs: Recognize, Release, Relax, Re-smile, Return, Repeat.

Transcript

Any questions about anything?

Yesterday as I was reading over some meditations,

Instructions from Vanti from a written treat a few years ago,

He was speaking about staying absolutely still in sitting.

And I know that shifts depending on the teacher,

Where do you come down on that nowadays?

Okay,

I guess I'm going to be out of here.

So the advantage,

So what happens when you're sitting and there's an urge to move?

There's too much energy in your system,

It's like creating that restlessness.

And if you just automatically move right away,

Then you never get to see what's actually going on in the mind.

So the preferred way to handle that is to simply 6R it,

To not move and to 6R it.

And I go with that for the most part.

I think it's really,

The meditation is really about learning to see the qualities of the awareness and what's going on.

And if you move,

It distracts you from all that.

I think there are some exceptions if you were sitting for a really long time.

Like I remember sitting once for a long time and I think there was a wrinkle in my underwear.

And over time it just gradually was cutting into me.

And I could shift a little bit and just rearrange that and then I actually settle right back down again.

And I think that can be skillful.

Now then if three minutes later there's another one,

And another one,

And another one,

Then you know something else is going on.

I would say that if you get a little tickle,

Like sometimes I'll have a sensation that feels like somebody has one hair,

One stiff hair,

And they're pressing it against my cheek and then spinning it slowly,

And it tickles like crazy.

And I go,

Almost guarantee within 30 seconds there will be two of those,

And then three or four,

And then they just proliferate.

So particularly with those very subtle ones,

It's really,

Really helpful to not move and see this quiet,

Sometimes it's the equivalent of fingernails scratching on the blackboard,

These very subtle sensations that seem intolerable.

There can be a great deal to be gained in just launching those.

But if you get to the point where you feel you really do have to move,

What is better than just going,

Is doing a large movement,

Like standing up.

So it's a whole change of posture.

What Bantee recommends is that when you really have to move,

You actually get up and go and do walking meditation.

And I think that it's actually helpful to experiment with that just a little bit,

Because the proof is always in the pudding.

It's to see what is actually helpful.

And if you can actually stand up and then you find you do that,

And you can actually meditate for another 30,

40,

45 minutes,

That's skillful.

If you stand up and then a few minutes later you want to sit down,

And a few minutes later you want to move a little bit,

Then you're actually better off just going out and doing walking meditation.

But I'm a strong believer in empirical trials.

The point is just be aware of what the result was of doing that.

So you can get an idea,

I'm better off if I do this,

And then okay,

I'll still be better off if I do this.

You're actually not paying attention to what the results are.

So you can try out those things in your own practice and see what the effects are.

Sneezing and coughing?

Sneezing and coughing for the most part are not something you do.

It just happens.

A cough comes up,

So that's fine.

What you can do is suppress it,

Really work hard to push it down,

But we're trying not to do anything.

So you just get out of the way of it.

And if it coughs,

If you laugh or cry,

As long as it's not something that through your willpower you're doing,

That's just fine.

These bodies,

They're actually quite alive,

And stuff happens on its own.

And so we just try to get out of the way of it and just let be what it is.

So if I may,

You're saying that you don't mind if we just do standing meditation?

Standing meditation is fine.

In fact,

If you're a little groggy and you don't think that your body is really tired,

But you have a grogginess of mind,

Standing up is quite helpful.

Because when you're standing,

The reality is that your brain,

Your mind,

Actually becomes a little more activated,

Because there's all these very subtle muscle movements to keep you from falling over.

And that alone will keep you awake,

And if that doesn't keep you awake,

The fear of falling over will.

So standing up,

Actually it uses more energy.

So over time it will be tiring,

But sometimes using more energy helps bring more energy in the system.

Yes,

Carol?

This is my first introduction to the six arias as a meditation practice,

And I found myself using what I would call active imagination.

In other words,

Not just the word or just the recognition,

But just a little something else,

And then the release also involves a form of visual active imagination.

It seemed to work for me in terms of the concentration,

But I don't know if it's adding a little bit too much.

Well,

You can experiment with it.

There's a very deep question here.

Okay,

Thank you.

So she was asking about active imagination.

She was talking about the six arias,

And sometimes she will actively imagine releasing some pictures or something like that,

And she finds it helpful.

So again,

The proof of the pudding is always what's helpful.

So make a distinction between active imagining and just images that come up on their own,

Just so that we're clear about that.

Sometimes you'll be sitting there and an image will just come up.

You're actually not doing it.

It's just something that rises in the mind.

And so that's fine.

That's fine.

Sometimes early on it can help a little bit.

For example,

We use the phrases.

It's a little bit of slight active engagement.

It's basically what you're doing is you're training the mind to pay attention to something.

And sometimes you can do that with images,

Sometimes with words,

Etc.

And if that helps you be more aware,

And in the beginning oftentimes it really is,

That's fine.

What will happen after a while,

Though,

Is that your active engagement will start to feel a little rough and distracting of itself,

In which case you just sort of back off of that a little bit.

And certainly as it goes deeper,

You'll be wanting to do that less and less.

I don't quite get active engagement.

Is that creating imagery for your mind?

That's what we're talking about.

Creating imagery.

Yes.

So you create an image.

It's like the phrases.

You create a phrase that resonates with a certain feeling,

And you repeat the phrase as a way of helping draw that feeling.

And images in the mind actually have a lot more to do with words in the mind than not.

So it's just a slightly different modality of just setting up something that resonates with,

In this case we're talking about the six R's,

Where the release or the relax.

And a little bit of that,

You know,

As you're starting,

It's like with the phrases.

And with the phrases,

Some of you will find there will become a point where they just,

That the feeling itself is so strong that the phrases are a distraction from it.

So when you talk about imagery,

We're talking about cognitive objects,

Like the words.

Yes.

But we're not talking about imagery,

Per se.

I heard her talking about images,

And what she was talking about was not with the phrases,

Not with the meta,

But actually with the six R's.

I heard it was actually imagery,

Visually.

Yeah.

I can be more specific in the release part.

I just imagine,

And actually I got the idea from last evening,

You know,

When you mentioned huge meadow,

Or you know,

Give a lot of space.

So it's easy for me to imagine this huge expansive mountain meadow instead of saying release.

Like when I recognize,

Kind of lasso the thought,

But totally,

Totally loosely,

You know,

Not just like,

And then all of this space.

And I am a visual person,

So it's,

I do have that,

It's easy for me to visualize that.

And it seemed to function in terms of release.

With the phrases,

And the same with this,

75% of your attention,

74 or 76,

The bulk of your attention is actually on the feeling itself,

And I would say with the images as well.

And they,

As I was saying last night,

The phrases,

You really don't want any more than about 5% of your attention on those.

And so if there's an image that just has a little bit,

Just a very small amount of that,

And it helps evoke the larger feeling,

Because the feeling is what's going on in the mind,

And is what the quality of awareness is that we're looking at.

And so that can be helpful.

If you get involved in a detailed image of,

Oh I was climbing up this mountain,

And there's this big meadow,

And there's this stream,

And all this and this and this,

That refers to one of my favorite poly words,

Because it sounds like what it is,

Paponcha.

It's mental proliferation.

But what I heard Carol was saying was just actually a light,

And Carol's an artist,

So that's actually part of her inner vocabulary,

And I think that's fine.

And again,

The proof is always in the pudding.

It's what happens with it.

If you find you get real involved with it,

Then you need to back off.

But using that lightly is fine.

How long do you spend thinking about six hours?

It sounds like if you do all the six steps,

It feels like the six steps you add up is sometimes more than what you're trying to get rid of.

So many steps,

And that's why last night I was asking you,

Do we actually have to say I'm recognizing,

Thinking that recognizing that word which is the phrase,

All the imagination.

I feel I spend too much time on that.

In fact,

Once I recognize,

Which I don't do that much,

But say if I do recognize something,

My thoughts pop up,

I recognize that.

But the time I recognize is gone already.

So why should I emphasize on the release and the relax?

But I can do smile,

Re-smile,

And then return to my primary object.

At least I try.

But the start seems like too long for me to handle.

She was saying that the original question that she elaborated on was how long do you spend on each of the six hours,

That it seemed like there was sometimes there would just be a small thing that would capture her attention.

And if she sees it,

And then if she tried to put the word on it,

Everything else turns into this whole project,

Which seems bigger than the original distraction.

And there's actually two parts to that.

One is that what we're doing with the six hours is actually cultivating a deep habit.

I think there's actually brain wiring that goes on in this.

That we have habitual responses to distractions.

And so we're trying to cultivate a way of responding that is really quite wholesome.

And at first,

It's like I played the piano for many years.

First we start doing scales.

And then,

As you learn them,

As they work into the fingers,

It just goes much more quickly.

So that leans a little bit in the direction of it's okay to spend a little bit of time at the beginning to make sure you've got it.

The flip side of it,

The other side,

Is that you'll find eventually that the six hours are actually just one movement.

That's actually quite organic.

That you're learning to just recognize something and rather than freak out or push it away or get angry or something like this,

There's a place that just goes,

Recognize,

Release,

Relax,

Resmile.

Just one movement for which each of those six hours is just a slightly different way of looking at it.

And so it's fine if you recognize to just actually,

Just a very light touch since you're just learning it,

To just see if you've recognized and released.

And if it's released,

And then check and see if you've relaxed and if not,

Relaxed.

But you can actually do that quickly.

But it's important to make sure,

At least in the beginning,

That you do each of those.

You don't actually have to say the word in your mind.

What's important is recognizing.

It's not the verbalizing of it.

And it will begin to flow together.

And for those who have been doing this for a long time,

I always encourage people,

Particularly call it rolling the R's when they just move really quickly,

To every once in a while bring them in for a 5,

000 mile checkup.

And what that means is that something comes up and you actually go through it again,

Really slow it down,

And just really make sure you do each one.

Because what can happen over time,

You recognize and release and you find maybe you're skipping over one of them.

You recognize,

Relax,

Resmile,

And you miss the release.

So if you get where it's moving very smoothly,

Then on a retreat,

Once or twice a day is plenty.

To just slow it down and just make sure that all the steps are in there.

If you see that one is missing,

Then you kind of emphasize that a little bit until it's really integrated.

So I think the short answer to your question is,

As I think you're doing fine,

And as long as those six aspects of it are actually happening,

Even if they're going relatively quickly,

That's okay.

You don't actually have to verbalize each one of them,

But you do want to come back every once in a while and make sure that the mind is not playing tricks.

It's a great question.

As I've done with Six Hours More and More,

What's happened is it's shifted in the sense that what seems to be happening is that I get to recognize what the category is of the response that I've made that's produced the disturbance.

One is what I call housekeeping,

Which is what should I do tomorrow?

Make sure I sub-gib-la-biddi-biddi,

All of this sort of normal busy work.

And so look for the anxiety behind that,

That it's not going to be okay,

And let go of that.

And then there's a difference between that stuff and stuff which is much more confrontive,

Which has a much clearer,

Deeper anxiety construct behind it or feeling.

And then allow my attention on the anxiety,

And then it sort of evaporates as my attention just stays still within contact with that anxiety.

Is that a reasonable way of doing it?

That sounds just right to me.

What you don't want to do is to get involved in all the specific content,

But all of us will have certain favorite hindrances,

You know,

Ones that come back and visit us a lot.

Like for me,

I began to realize that most,

I don't know,

But at least half of my disturbing thoughts were explaining something to somebody.

And I didn't know whether,

You know,

I was active as a progressive minister for many,

Many years of writing sermons,

And I didn't know whether I just developed that habit because I was always looking for things explained to people,

Or whether that's just what I did and that's why I went into the ministry.

So rather than just,

So sometimes I would just say explaining.

I've started to do that.

I recognize a large category of it,

And I found that helpful.

Yes,

I have too,

Because it's almost as if you really feel that that is the category,

Then it's like,

Oh,

Okay,

I don't have to pay further attention to it at some level on an emotional level.

Yeah,

That's good.

I find when I find as I spend more time meditating that this hindrance comes up and which is,

I start to feel uncomfortable,

Then I start to feel pain.

And I'm just observing this,

I'm just kind of looking at it,

Not really getting super attached to it.

And then I realize I'm clenching like my whole body is like a bird holding onto a wire.

And I go,

Wow.

And I tried at that point,

I'm trying to turn to meta for myself.

But it's almost like I can feel it catching my breath too.

So I don't know what that's about.

It's really subtle stuff.

Yeah,

Yeah.

Well,

What happens is,

As it goes deeper,

Sometimes there are new themes and sometimes the same old ones that just play out on a subtler and subtler and subtler and subtler level.

And what the meditation is about is learning to observe the movements of the mind's attention,

Which sounds like you're doing really well.

The meditation is not about necessarily getting rid of any of that.

The difference is that if you try to get rid of something,

You know,

That's just a version to try to grab hold of a more attractive state.

That's just a kind of greed.

And so we don't want that.

But what wisdom will do is it will see an unwholesome state and this tension that's coming in.

And sometimes it's really physical.

I mean,

I'll have that too.

I'll be off in what seems like a very sweet,

Delightful thought and I just sort of look inside and realize the whole body is tightened up around it.

And so from the standpoint of wisdom,

There is some recognition that you'd be better off without that.

And so from the standpoint of wisdom,

It's what are the causes and conditions that would allow that to disappear.

And so what we have here is a formula of the six R's that set up conditions in which this tense state is likely to fade.

From the standpoint of wisdom,

Whether it fades or not is not important.

It's because there's a whole lot of learning that can happen from that.

So you try this and then you see what the effect is.

So it's not actually trying to get rid of something,

But it is creating the conditions in which something naturally will pass on its own.

And it feels very,

Very different.

When you're releasing tension,

For example,

As you're releasing tension,

Your mindfulness will increase,

Which is what you're talking about.

You're seeing all these subtler and subtler things.

And the mindfulness just seems to come up on its own because you create conditions in which mindfulness will come.

But you're not grasping for mindfulness.

You were saying something similar to that.

And so the place where you can be caught a little bit is that the mind gets a certain amount of samadhi,

A certain amount of collectedness,

And a certain amount of wisdom,

And it seems really,

Really peaceful.

And then as it goes a little bit more,

A little fuller,

You realize actually underneath that are all these little bugs that are running around and poking in this and all that sort of stuff,

And you think,

Ah,

Darn,

I thought I was in a better place than this.

And if you have that response to it,

That's a very good one to 6R.

It's like,

Oh,

There's aversion.

I don't like this.

And since they're subtler,

The mind has a tendency to say,

Oh,

These are different.

I did all that stuff,

This little piece of aversion,

This is different,

This is special,

I have to do something else,

I have to do battle with this,

I've got to figure out how to get it back in its box or something.

But when you see the mind doing that,

You just 6R it.

It's the same response.

You all recognize those things?

You're so along and it's so,

So great.

Here's this little,

It's like this mosquito buzzing around in the background of your mind.

It's like,

Where'd that come from?

All these little subtle things.

And it's really great.

As the practice goes deeper,

A sense of humor is really,

Really helpful.

It's like,

Oh,

There's another one.

I'm a Taurus,

So I just have a lot of stubborn energy.

It's not my fault it was where the sun was born.

And so,

You know,

Over the years I've fought just about everything that comes up until I realize it just doesn't work.

There's no percentage in it.

But I somehow have to kind of hit my head against the wall.

And I'm amazed because I see yogis come through and they do it once or twice and they get it and they release it.

Well,

I always do things the hard way.

But you will see all kinds of subtle tensions go up and you'll begin to see how your mind,

Heart actually responds to all those.

And it's always the same ultimately.

It's just finding,

It's called wise effort.

Was that the sixth of the eightfold path of how to just be with something which takes a little bit of effort but without straining.

The effort is to remember the six R's.

And it will take care of itself.

It will take care of you.

What's left of you anyway.

Other than that,

Everything was perfect.

Except.

I had a really great sit last night.

I think a lot of the excitement from arriving here and meeting people buoyed me into a really positive sit.

And this morning it was quite flat and distracted.

And I was tired.

And yeah,

I was like,

Oh,

I thought I'd figured it out,

You know.

It happens pretty regularly.

So that's a good insight.

It happens regularly.

And I found myself pushing on positive,

Trying to sort of like pull it up from someplace and generate that state.

And then I stopped and sort of enjoyed the quiet.

And that felt better.

But I have this question in my mind about how often we should expect variation in the sort of explicit positiveness.

So his question was,

You know,

Last night he had a really great sitting,

You know,

This morning.

It was kind of flat.

And that he's recognized that there are these ups and downs and how often can he expect those.

And I would say that you can expect to have those at a different rate than you expect.

The Lord of Buddhists indeterminacy.

Right.

I mean,

You know,

As soon as you think you're on top of it all and you've got it all figured out,

Okay,

I know what the pattern is.

You know,

Something else will happen.

And that's actually the great part about it.

When you can just.

.

.

So again,

As I was talking about,

You know,

The Buddha did,

He undertook all these practices that control these states and get just the positive and get rid of the negative,

Etc.

,

Etc.

And they all fall apart.

Sometimes you can hang on to some of them for a really long time,

But they all fall apart.

And so where the liberation ultimately comes from is,

And you can't fake this.

I wish we could fake it.

It would be so easy.

We are actually less interested in whether the sitting goes well or goes terrible and just more curious about what's going to happen next.

I had this image sometime when I was sitting down and there was this big pipe over my head,

Which was my karma,

And there was a hole in it.

And so I was sitting there saying,

Okay,

Let's see what's going to fall out of the pipe today.

I have no idea.

And I said,

Oh,

That's what's coming up.

And there's that point where you just begin to have fewer and fewer agendas.

I hesitate to say that because you're going to have an agenda of having fewer agendas and that doesn't work.

And like I say for me,

The only way I could get to that agendaless place is to just run into the cliff over and over and over and over again until I really got it.

I'm headed for the cliff and do I want to do that?

Well,

Never mind.

And so that's a somewhat flip,

But really sort of serious answer to that.

And the other answer to that is that all our systems are a little bit different.

And so it's part of the difficulty of getting a model,

Even the model that you've created,

Or certainly try to model your practice on somebody else's.

It's going to be different.

It's going to be different.

As much as you can,

Just enjoy the show.

And if you find yourself getting disappointed,

That's where smiling is really great.

Ah,

Caught again.

So you can even smile about not smiling?

Yes.

Look at how serious I am.

Because I get worried sometimes where I can focus on the people who I'm loving and wishing well,

And that will often really work in the way described.

But sometimes it just feels really quiet,

Really peaceful,

As if it doesn't want to go there,

As if there's too much energy in that more explicit,

More charged emotional relationship of the loving one.

And then I get stuck between two interpretations,

One being,

Well,

Is this going into sukha?

So therefore it will level out and be quieter.

Or am I losing the talent for loving people?

So when we get an interview,

We can look in more detail at what's going on there.

But what you're talking about is a quite common thing for a lot of people.

Because it goes from pithy,

Joy,

And to sukha,

Happiness,

And then equanimity,

Which is just a peacefulness.

And when the mind starts getting very peaceful,

A lot of people think they've lost the practice.

Because there was all this wonderful stuff,

And now it's just peaceful.

So what's the problem?

Nothing.

But the joy is gone.

And so what you do at that point is take that peacefulness and just send that out.

Just send that out.

Let that be the inner-e that you're sending out.

Thank you.

What do you mean,

Send it out?

Send it out to.

.

.

What does it mean to send it out?

So I assume we're talking now about sending it to a spiritual friend.

But it's a great question,

Maybe for reasons.

I'll just piggyback off it.

I don't remember if I said this last night,

But there are two very different ways that people do this.

One is it is actually a sense of sending it out to people out there.

Another is that you put the person into your heart,

Or you put yourself in your heart,

And then you just surround them with it.

And the reality is that ultimately those are both the same.

Because inside the mind there is no over there.

There is no inside or outside.

The mind is not in three dimensional space.

And so those are just,

Whether it's sending over there or send it to yourself,

It's just a metaphor.

And so you use whatever is most expeditious,

What works most easily for you.

You say,

Send it out.

Do you actually say,

Okay,

I'm going to send it out to my friend Judy.

When I say I'm sending it out to Judy,

I feel actually I don't need to phrase that.

No.

I just kind of send the feeling to that spiritual friend.

Yes.

So I don't need to actually say I'm sending that to you.

Right.

Right.

What was the question?

Does she actually have to say,

I'm sending it to you?

And the answer is mostly no.

If you have it difficult to get in the feeling there,

Then the phrases can help resonate with that.

But if you have the feeling,

It's sort of like I think if you look in at a young child sleeping,

You don't have to say,

Oh,

I'm going to send you love.

It just happens.

And if you say I'm going to send you love,

It actually takes away from the whole feeling.

75% of the attention,

Most of the majority of the attention is on the feeling itself.

And as long as that's there,

That's fine.

If you're using phrases or something like that,

That's just a little bit of energy to help.

In the book I call it priming the pump just to get the thing started.

But once it's flowing,

You just let it flow.

Can you hear me in the back?

Shall I try it again?

Other than that,

Everything is perfect.

See what comes up.

I think last night you made a statement about the object of contemplation and seeing how the process works.

And could you reiterate on how you see that relationship,

The purpose of the object of contemplation and the process of investigation and seeing?

Okay.

I thought you go in a slightly different space.

But let me just say that ultimately what it's about is just knowing how the process works.

And depending on your particular temperament,

Some people will see it,

Some people will feel it,

Some people will hear it.

The mind will just translate that knowing into some kind of sensory modality as you verbalize it.

But what you're actually asking about is what's the actual process underneath that.

Is that right?

Yeah.

You know,

The relationship.

Because as the meditation develops,

The object of contemplation evolves.

Right.

I want to frame this for sort of this more or less this first step of practice.

So in relationship to radiating a loving and kind energy,

I think you spoke about the importance of both doing it,

Radiating it,

But also noticing what's happening as that's happening.

Okay.

There's a relationship there.

It's a subtle question.

You have awareness.

You have the object you're looking at.

And the awareness is looking through all the attitudes in the mind.

So if you're anxious,

That actually colors what you see.

If you are overjoyed and ecstatic,

That colors how you see it.

So at first,

If the awareness is very,

Very,

Very dim,

You can kind of see the object.

And all these attitudes in the mind that are distorting and coloring the awareness,

Kind of a little bit lower the threshold of awareness.

You don't actually see those.

But as you pay attention heartfully,

You'll begin to notice,

Oh,

I'm a little uptight,

Or I'm a little anxious,

Or I'm a little bit of aversion.

And you begin to see the aversion or whatever those qualities are in the mind.

And I hate to say it,

But there's this difficult stage where your awareness is strong enough that you're actually seeing what's going on,

But the awareness is not strong enough to know what the heck to do about it.

Okay.

So you're seeing all this stuff going on,

And it just keeps going on.

So what you want to do at that point is just keep cultivating the awareness.

Because as awareness gets stronger,

Eventually the awareness,

Not you,

But the awareness on its own as it will,

Will know what to do about it.

So our job in meditating is actually just to cultivate the awareness,

And that will take care of it.

So what actually happens is we have all these attitudes in the mind,

And as those begin to become clearer and clearer,

They can become the object,

At which point you let your awareness go to the aversion that's going on.

And all this thinking you were thinking about,

About the neighbor's dog that was barking last night,

Or whatever it is that you're aversive about,

You just let that run on its merry way,

And you just come back and you see,

Oh,

There's some aversion in here.

And you let the awareness go to that.

You recognize it.

Release it.

Just let the aversion be there.

Relax.

Any tension that's in the aversion,

Smile.

And then go back to your object of meditation.

And gradually what will happen over time is as the tension drains out of that,

Is the aversion and the original annoyance that your neighbor will just run out of gas.

The thing that powers the distortions in the mind is tension.

Is tension.

As you relax the tension,

You know,

If the aversion has a full tank of gas,

It'll keep going for a while,

But you're not putting more gas in it.

And so eventually it just runs out.

And then when it stops,

You just,

And some of you probably had this experience,

It was a big disturbing thing,

And you sit in there,

You six-hour it,

And then it's gone.

And sometimes it can be gone so thoroughly that,

You know,

For a moment there,

You remember there was something,

But you don't even know what it was.

It's just gone.

It's actually run out of gas.

And if you work out,

You can bring it back and put some more gas in the tank so you can see it.

Does that answer your question?

Yeah,

It wasn't sort of a question so much as to re-explain what you explained part of this last night,

But you elaborated in a way that was wonderful.

Thank you.

I have a question.

When you say release,

That really confused you.

You know,

As long as you have that question,

Keep asking it.

It's fine.

It really is.

When you say release,

You release just like when you were saying release the awareness.

No,

It's.

.

.

Or release the object.

The object.

Yeah.

So the first two,

Recognize and release,

Are all about the object.

The relax is about you.

So the release and the relax can sound very similar,

But actually one is about releasing the object.

And then you let your awareness come back and see,

Is there tension in the mind?

Tension in the body,

Tension in the emotions.

And allow that tension or tightness or thickness,

However you experience that,

To soften.

So the release is about the object,

Just to make sure you're not grabbing hold of it or pushing it away.

It's hard because,

Again,

If you've done one point of practice or you've seen Hollywood movies about what meditation is,

It seems to be about quieting the mind,

Stopping all that stuff from going on in there.

But what we're talking about is no,

Just actually let it go.

It is a fool's errand to try to control the mind.

We just want to relate to it in a wise way and then it will quiet on its own.

So the release is just part of that.

Yeah,

And if it didn't happen,

There would be no transformative process.

That's right.

And ultimately,

Maybe I'm just picking on words,

But I don't think there is any transformation.

What it is,

It's a revelation.

Yeah,

You realize what really is going on underneath.

And it feels transformative because we've really identified ourselves as being this,

You know,

I'm a gnarly gnome and you find you actually aren't.

You haven't been transformed,

You just saw what you really were.

In the walking meditation,

I find like,

How the Mukang community is saying,

I didn't quite hear that.

In the walking meditation,

There is more energy going on and saving.

It's more of a 6R and there's loss.

Are there any physicians who have 6R versus 7?

Well,

If I can read between the lines,

There's a little bit of disappointment.

6R the disappointment.

Because the reality is,

When you're out walking,

There is more stimulation.

There's more stimulation coming in.

It can mean that the mind is not quite as settled.

For some people,

It actually works differently.

They get more settled walking,

But it's very,

Very likely that the walking and the sitting will feel different in some ways.

And so,

If you're disappointed or wish you were different or something,

You can just see,

Okay,

There's greed,

There's aversion,

I want this,

I don't want that,

I don't want that.

Have a sense of humor and 6R that.

I noticed that walking was actually a stunning experience this morning because it's so damn beautiful.

The smells are incredibly beautiful as well.

It's really peaceful.

And so that brings a lot of joy in just encountering what's there.

So although there's more sensory input,

The emotion of joy and celebration and appreciation is right there because the environment just gives you that or causes that.

Well,

The other thing that happens with a beautiful environment,

I mean,

The Buddha said,

If you want to calm your mind,

One of the best things to do is go for a walk in the woods.

And when I'm out in nature,

What's really clear is nature doesn't care what happens to me,

You know.

Tree falls in my head and nature doesn't care.

And there's something about that that just feels so deeply true that's actually liberating in a sense.

Because that's sort of the truth.

You know,

Things,

Stuff happens not because of me,

But because of all these natural laws and you can feel them.

And particularly when it's beautiful like it is this morning,

It resonates with,

Actually it's a deep natural spaciousness that's deep inside you and you just feel it and be with it.

And it becomes a trap only if you get super involved in the birds and the trees and all that stuff.

But to just recognize the quality that's in there and the quality that's in there is there not because of nature.

It's because it's been in you all along and you just haven't seen it.

Because the mind tends to go towards where the noise is.

And that spaciousness is so peaceful.

It has no vector.

It doesn't draw our attention.

And so,

You know,

When you can feel it,

To just actually be with it and recognize it as it is.

Because the spaciousness and the peace has a texture and a feel to it.

It's not a void.

It just isn't.

And it can feel very sweet and very loving and completely impersonal.

And if you feel that,

Then it becomes easier to sort of recognize it when there's a little more noise going on.

So it's really helpful to use what you got.

Use what you got.

It's almost noon.

You have time for one more if it's there.

Otherwise,

I have to wait for next lifetime to get in line.

So I come from a Vipassana,

Cuenca style background.

And I'm just through this conversation of connecting sort of taste of equanimity that I got through that practice with the six R's.

And I guess that's what I wanted.

I wanted you to nod and say,

Yeah,

That's fine.

Yes.

Yeah.

There's lots of ways to describe this practice as it unfolds.

One of them is actually a deepening equanimity that eventually goes even beyond that.

Because as the equanimity gets stronger,

If you haven't shut your awareness down to one object,

Then as the equanimity gets stronger,

You just see more and more clearly what's going on.

This arises,

That arises,

This happens,

That happens.

And the Buddha found that that's actually what frees us.

It's actually seeing that process that is completely impersonal.

It's like being out in nature.

There's nobody doing it.

There's just these natural laws unfolding.

And we're in this whole soup of life with these natural forces working through us.

And with this tendency,

And I think it's evolutionarily been bred into us.

You picture two people walking through a primeval forest.

One is just that one with the birds and the fields and the saber-toothed kitty and the cave bear and the birds.

And the other is freaked out by them.

Right?

Gotta take care of that one.

Well,

Guess who's DNA?

You know,

We inherited.

The one who was at peace was probably eaten.

So the mind goes for that,

But the equanimity is actually there.

But our wiring pulls us away from it.

And so this is actually really discovering what's underneath that actually transcends,

As in,

Goes beyond limitations of our wiring.

So we're unwinding all the epigenetic conditioning?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

And because the flip side of all that is the epigenetic conditioning is just a thin layer.

And it can be very boisterous,

But the peace underneath there is always there.

We can't escape that.

That's just part of the substance of what we are.

So we're just noticing it.

You don't have to create it.

You just have to see it.

With that,

It's time to feed our bodies.

Thank you so much for your questions and for your practice.