Unhook From Feeling That You're Not Doing Enough With Dr. Jud

Do you feel like you keep on doing more, but are never doing enough? Do you feel guilt when you take time off? The struggle of productivity anxiety is common in our achievement and productivity-focused society. In today’s episode of Your Life in Process, join Dr. Diana Hill and frequent contributor Dr. Judson Brewer as they discuss focusing on enjoying the journey of life rather than the outcome. Freedom begins with a shift in attention towards your human yearnings.

Transcript

Do you feel like you keep on doing more but are never doing enough?

Do you feel guilty when you take time off?

You may be experiencing what's called productivity anxiety.

And that's what we're going to talk about today on What's Up with Dr.

Jed on your life and process.

Welcome back.

This is the last episode of season one of your life and process.

We've covered a lot of things together in the last 17 episodes.

We started off talking about psychological flexibility and values.

We've explored dopamine and how to find more balance in your craving mind.

We've also looked at parenting,

How to help your kids become intuitive eaters and prevent parental burnout.

And we've looked at ways to improve your life through things like additional detoxes,

Meditation,

What to do about our egos and how to find more balance in an integrative way with our bodies.

The season has been wonderful and it's also been a lot of work.

So that's why I am taking a break.

I am practicing what I preach and trying to live more seasonally with my work and in my life.

When I practice yoga at the end of the session,

I always do a Shavasana,

Which is corpse pose.

And the purpose of corpse pose is two-fold.

First is really to allow your body to integrate the movement that you've just done as you are still.

There's a lot that happens in that rest in terms of restoration of the physical body.

Corpse pose is also a death pose.

As Patapi Joyce calls it,

It's practicing death a little bit every day.

We practice these death poses because it's an opportunity to make contact with the impermanence of things.

So by living more seasonally and in the rhythm of your own body,

Pushing hard,

Being engaged,

Going full throttle at things that matter to you,

But equally valuing downtime and restoration,

You'll be able to sustain your values-based action as well as learn from it.

So it's important to pause and integrate what you've learned.

I'm going to be taking three weeks off and going on retreat in Costa Rica.

I'm going to be leading a group of people there.

During this time,

I encourage you to really download what we've learned here.

And don't forget that you can find the practices in the show notes so that you can apply them.

They're listed by topic.

So today's podcast with Dr.

Judd is just about that.

It's about looking at our productivity in a different way.

What's driving it?

What's the anxiety underneath it?

What kind of cycles of avoidance are we caught in and how can we do something differently?

Dr.

Judd has been a frequent contributor to this podcast and he's the author of Unwinding Anxiety and the Craving Mind,

Which we talk about on the show today.

He's also a neuroscientist and clinical research professor at Brown University.

I first talked to Dr.

Judd about this concept of striving on my summit,

From Striving to Thriving,

And you can watch that summit for free at fromstrivingtothriving.

Com.

I wanted to take a little bit further today into exploring what drives our productivity anxiety.

And at the end of today's conversation,

As always,

I will give you some concrete strategies that you can use to unwind your productivity anxiety so that you can have more choice around where you place your energy and when and how you do it.

Maybe some of these strategies will be helpful for you in taking a little bit of a rest as well.

Okay,

Good to have you back,

Dr.

Judd.

Thank you for being here.

Dr.

Judd Smith Thanks for having me.

Dr.

Stephanie St We've talked about this before on a summit that we did together,

But I like the concept of productivity anxiety in particular,

Because one of the things that I see a lot in my life and in my practice is that folks are saying they don't have enough time to get everything done even though they're more efficient than they've ever been.

We can get things done more quickly than we've ever been done.

And then the flip side of that is that when people have a moment of free time,

They feel guilty and uneasy on this feeling of like,

I should be doing something right now.

We're caught in this productivity anxiety and that term actually,

I first learned from Rufi Kaur,

Who's a poet,

And she wrote this beautiful poem called Productivity Anxiety.

She says,

I have this productivity anxiety that everyone else is working harder than me and I'm going to be left behind because I'm not working fast enough,

Long enough,

And I'm wasting my time.

So I want to talk all about all the things that she's missing out on because of this productivity anxiety.

Dr.

Judd Smith Yeah.

Do you want to start with where it comes from?

Dr.

Stephanie St Sure.

Dr.

Judd Smith What I hear even in that poem,

But I think we can probably all map out for any of us that can relate to the poem,

Is that we have this carrot dangling in front of us,

Whatever that carrot is,

Whatever the getting ahead in life is,

Whether it's at work,

Whether it's family,

Health,

You name it.

And so we can lump all of that under the carrot or the proverbial reward that keeps getting daggled in front of our faces.

And then maybe we have a good day and we're really productive,

Whatever that looks like.

We get a bunch written if we're writing a paper or a book or we get a project done or we just really feel like things are singing.

And if we trace that backwards,

Of course,

I see the world through the lens of reinforcement learning.

We look at the behavior and how rewarding it is.

And then we can see what might trigger that the next day.

So the next day we get up and we remember,

Wow,

That was we had a really productive day,

Felt great.

You know,

There's there's a reward.

And and then we say,

OK,

Do it again.

But we can't just like snap our fingers and suddenly be productive.

I think we can find all the ways to maximize productivity and kind of get in the flow.

But I think this is where the irony comes in,

That the more we try to be productive,

The more anxious we get about it.

You know,

It's that performance,

You know,

That performance anxiety in terms of like we get anxious because we feel like we need to perform,

Which is different than feeling like we have to be anxious to perform well.

It's the you know,

It's just the anxiety of the anticipation of like trying to do something which makes us not perform well.

And then we get stuck in these in these vicious cycles.

So that's that's the first piece that I would kind of highlight or throw out there maybe for conversation.

Does that fit with what you see in terms of some of the drivers for this?

Yeah.

I mean,

I see productivity anxiety is driven both by that positive reinforcement of getting the praise or the follower or the project done or the more money or whatever it is that getting your Instacart delivery quickly.

Right.

The positive reinforcement.

But I also really think that there's another driving force of negative reinforcement of experiential avoidance.

And that's the difficulty with downtime that people have that sort of uneasiness,

The guilt.

And when that shows up for folks or just even just discomfort with boredom,

We go into drive and doing.

And I think there's there's a behavioral component to it.

There's also such a social cultural component to productivity or even capitalism and our understanding of what is what is productivity,

Because I think that that's really changed sort of over time.

What does it mean to be productive?

Certainly a hunter gatherer or a farmer had a very different perception of productivity than we do now.

Yes.

You know,

Reading was it I think it's Hariri.

Was it his book on called Sapiens?

Is that right?

Or am I mixing up the authors?

Yeah.

Yeah.

Harari.

Yeah.

Harari.

He was talking,

If I remember correctly,

He wrote about how hunter gatherers actually had a pretty darn good life because they weren't working 16 hours a day.

They hunted,

They gathered and they rested.

And we've kind of gotten ourselves in modern day.

We think that that just because things are modern,

That therefore we missed most of must have made progress.

But he makes this argument that we need to rethink that.

You know,

It's just because we're working long hours,

Working hard doesn't mean that we're living better lives.

And in fact,

We're often literally working ourselves to exhaustion.

So I agree with that.

That makes a lot of sense that if we don't step back and ask ourselves,

What am I doing and what's driving me to do this?

We could just get stuck in this,

You know,

The proverbial hedonic treadmill for our entire lives.

And what's our definition of productivity?

I think is a big part of it.

Basically the sort of like fixation on hitting targets and what are the targets that we're trying to hit?

So what would you say you see as one of the big,

You know,

Where do people get stuck in circles these days with that productivity?

Where do we get sucked in?

There's a lot of different things.

I think one,

People not feeling satisfied when they've actually accomplished something that's worth feeling satisfied about,

You know,

The sort of moving finish line that can happen for folks.

As soon as you get there,

You don't actually experience the goodness of getting there.

You just move it out in front of you.

Another thing is the never ending task lists that people have and the real difficulty with being able to sort of that,

The sort of the concept of rocks in a jar.

Like you can only fit so many rocks in the jar.

Our time is limited,

But people are trying to squeeze so much into their day and then feel guilty that they're not fitting enough in and not able to recognize that we have to make choices around what rocks we're going to put in the jar.

What are the most important ones and that you will never be able to fit everything in and that we need some space between the rocks as well.

Like just jamming everything in leads to dissatisfaction.

So I would say those two things.

Number one would be not feeling a sense of completion or competency or mastery as you are doing things in your life.

And then number two is always feeling like you're never doing enough.

There's always more coming down,

You know,

Sort of the Lucille Ball chocolate.

So many chocolates coming at you and you're like stuffing them in your mouth and in your pockets to get through the day.

Yes.

Well,

It reminds me of this quote somebody asked John D.

Rockefeller.

I think at the time he was the,

If not one of the richest people in the world.

They said,

You know,

How much is enough?

And he said,

Just a little bit more.

So it's like that's what that image of the rocks makes me think of.

He couldn't possibly be happier by getting more money.

And in fact,

You could argue that he was less happy by trying to get more money because his money quotient for happiness was saturated at that point.

He didn't need more,

But that's that drive.

Just a little bit more if we're not paying attention.

And then even looking at,

You know,

Do I want these rocks in my jar in the first place?

You know,

So like you're pointing out this,

The space between the rocks might actually be as valuable or even more valuable than just collecting more rocks.

You know,

It's I wonder what you think.

This made me think of this,

You know,

Where we often get stuck going after the destination.

You know,

It's like check all the things off of my list and then I'll be happy as compared to looking at the journey itself where,

You know,

I'm probably stretching the metaphor a little bit far,

But looking to see how rewarding or valuable the more accomplished we feel in the moment that we're in the journey.

That's that space between the rocks as compared to just trying to get more rocks.

Yeah.

You know,

I have a confession to make around that.

Okay.

Where I was at this retreat.

I think I told you that I wasn't going on it,

But I ended up being able to go on this amazing retreat to Costa Rica and there were all these versions of rocks in the jar,

People there.

So super well-known people in the wellness world.

Let's just say that I won't,

I won't disclose any names,

But a lot of them were there and I showed up and I had this feeling of craving to put rocks in my jar in the sense of,

I want to go talk to this person and I want to go learn from this person.

And I got so anxious while I was there of trying to seek out what my version for me,

These are my versions of rocks in my jar,

Right?

That I actually missed out on opportunities to just be in this experience.

And one of the things that happened for me as I sat down with Stefan Reichshafen who founded the retreat center and he wrote this book called Time Shifting,

Which is all about how to slow down and be in your life basically.

And he gave me this advice,

Which was basically stop trying so hard.

Just be here,

Diana,

Like enjoy being here,

Be on retreat with amazing people rather than trying to capture them.

And I think that we all have that,

You know,

We like,

We can get hooked by that.

And I know that's my version of that for somebody else.

It's something like money or it's a body shape that they're trying to achieve or it's followers and some,

You know,

Twitter,

Instagram.

We can all get hooked.

And I think the question is,

Is that really like what it feels like when we're in that cycle of striving or productivity,

Anxiety,

Or whatever it is driving it,

Is it really satisfying?

It feels so hungry and so ungrounded to be there.

Hungry,

Hungry.

Yeah,

It reminds me of the,

You know,

The image of the hungry ghost in Buddhism where this there's this ghost with a long,

Long,

Narrow esophagus and a huge stomach.

And so we can picture that,

You know,

If this ghost is hungry,

It tries to eat and tries to eat and tries to eat and tries to fill its stomach.

But because of its anatomy,

It can never do it.

It's never full,

That hungry ghost.

So it's like,

Boy,

That's,

You know,

If that doesn't lead to productivity,

Anxiety,

I don't know what does,

You know,

Just wanting and wanting and wanting more.

What about for you?

Hmm.

Well,

Certainly,

You know,

I'm just feeling into my experience around just the,

You know,

Being,

You know,

Doing things,

You know,

Like working,

For example,

Writing something and how not only does it feel good,

You know,

You think of the journey,

But also the aim is to have something that's helpful for the world.

Otherwise I'm wasting my time.

And so I can look at that as the destination.

And if I get focused on,

Boy,

This has to be good,

You know,

I'm,

You know,

Let's say writing a book and I,

Boy,

I hope people get it.

I hope this helps the world.

And I hope,

You know,

I don't get some goofball Amazon review or whatever,

You know,

Whatever my metric is for success.

If I focus there,

I can't write very well.

And it doesn't feel very good at all.

Like you're saying it's hungry and that that hunger gets in the way of the satisfaction of,

You know,

Of the process of eating itself.

If we think of writing as eating.

Yeah.

I remember in your unwinding anxiety book,

How you write about the Amazon review that kind of sparked you to write this book,

You know?

And I've wondered about that for you.

I was like,

Is that productivity anxiety that he's trying to,

You know,

Overwrite something that was really painful for you?

Or is that really just like values based of I want to write a book that is helpful for people in a different way than,

You know,

The craving mind.

It was amazing and beautiful.

And unwinding anxiety is like the roadmap of how to do it.

Right.

So,

Yeah,

Maybe it's a little bit of both sometimes.

Yeah.

I was going to say,

If I'm honest with myself,

There are probably a number of components.

Personally,

It's an ego blow where I wrote The Craving Mind and I was thinking,

Yeah,

Here's the map and here's the compass and people can navigate the territory themselves.

And then Amazon addict was like,

Yeah,

I've taken neuroscience courses.

This book said something like,

Oh,

He seems like he wants to help people,

But he's not providing basically the cookbook.

And so,

You know,

My ego's like,

But,

But,

But you are the cookbook.

And then there's a piece in there that says,

Yeah,

She's got a really good point.

And I know it's a she because I kind of tried to stalk her on Amazon.

I write about this at the end of the book.

I try to stalk her a little bit to try to like,

Who is this person telling a neuroscientist that they're not doing the right thing with neuroscience or whatever.

And so the other,

When I could let that ego piece go,

It was a really great fire that she lit under my butt to say,

Yeah,

You've got a really good point here.

I do need to make something a little more pragmatic,

Write something a little more pragmatic.

And I wasn't ready to write that book back when I wrote The Craving Mind,

But I was,

I don't know,

For three,

Four years later,

Whenever I wrote Unwinding Anxiety and it just,

You know,

The conditions had to come together for that and I needed to get out of my own way.

You know,

If I just sat there and shook my fist and said,

You don't understand me,

The Craving Mind is the best book I've ever written.

I'll never write another one.

And instead saying,

You know,

That could,

That could help light a fire under my butt to write another book.

Yeah.

And that feels much more values based to me of like,

That's,

That's the doing that's being in the journey,

But then also seeing where you're going because it's something that's important to you as opposed to just going at it because you're hungry for more and it's not really connected to something that is intrinsically motivating,

Important of value to you personally,

And also,

You know,

Of service to the world.

So it feels different when you're in that kind of drive.

It's a different kind of drive.

Yeah,

Definitely.

I think,

Well,

I'm curious what you think about where ego fits within the values based system.

You know,

To me,

It's not,

It's not part of values.

It's just focusing on self.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You know,

Joseph Siroti,

Who's,

He's like a major ACT guy that I love.

He's a lot of research in the arena of ACT and he did a talk on ego at the ACBS World Con last year and attachment and one of the things that he said is,

Or he has sort of described it as in ACT,

There's a process called self as content versus self as context.

So when you're caught up in self as content,

You are caught up in the I am.

So like,

You know,

I am a neuroscientist and therefore you cannot challenge my book,

Right?

Or I am a wellness person and therefore you have to like me because you're a wellness person too,

Or whatever it is,

You know?

Or I am.

And then self as context recognizes that we're much more contextual,

You know,

Like sometimes I show up as my,

My wellness person self,

But not last night when I was like,

You know,

Before bed and it was on my phone,

You know,

So that we're much more contextual beings than that sort of ego self.

And what Joseph Siroti talks about is sort of that when we're in that selfing,

That ego selfing,

We become,

We use self as either a prize,

Like to hold ourselves up as better than or that positive reinforcement,

Or we use the self as a shield to protect ourselves.

So the negative reinforcement to protect ourselves from that feeling of vulnerability or insecurity or that not enoughness,

Which I think also drives a lot of our productivity anxiety.

If I'm not doing something or I'm not producing,

Then what is my worth?

And that self as shield can come in to kind of protect us from that.

Yeah,

I 100% agree.

Okay.

So we've talked about some of the causes of this productivity anxiety,

And we didn't even tap into capitalism in our individualistic culture and our schooling systems,

Which,

You know,

As Anna Limkow talks about nature,

Nurture and neighborhood,

Right?

So we have like nature or biology,

We have the nurture of the system we live in and the neighborhood of,

We can be productive 24 hours a day now.

But what about some solutions,

Some ideas,

Some different ways of being in the journey than being caught in the cycle of it?

Well,

I would say,

You know,

If you go back to the reinforcement learning piece,

The most important component there is how rewarding something is.

And so you described it so nicely that hunger,

You know,

If the reward is hunger for more and we don't pay attention to that,

We're just going to get stuck in that cycle.

So I think the first thing I would say is just bringing some awareness in and noticing,

You know,

What,

How rewarding it is when we are constantly trying to check off that to do list or when we're constantly anxious,

Trying to be well with all the wellness people.

It's so ugly,

Dr.

Jett.

I'm like exposing my ugly side here in the service of helping others.

Yeah.

Vulnerability is strength,

100% there.

So that's the first thing I would say.

I'm curious what your thoughts are.

Yeah.

Awareness that we're caught in the cycle of it and how satisfying or dissatisfying is it,

Sort of the checking in on that.

And that's sort of what's driving the cycle.

Like what is the cue?

There's going to be certain cues that trigger us into that productivity mode.

And sometimes there are things like social comparison or not good enough feelings or you know,

Just everyone has their flavor.

But yeah,

What is the behavior,

But really focusing on the consequence.

Another thing that comes to mind is goes back to this destination versus journey.

You know,

Destination tends to be,

You know,

When we get there,

We're satisfied,

You know,

At least for the time being until we want to go somewhere else.

And so it's kind of like this drive,

This hunger that says,

Go,

Go,

Go,

Go,

Go.

Okay.

Now you got there.

Now where else are we going to go?

You know,

And it can induce some anxiety when we're like,

Okay,

I'm here.

Now what?

You know,

What's next?

So here,

If we're focused on the journey and the joy that comes from the journey itself,

We may be less likely to be sucked into those destination cycles where it's,

You know,

This,

Now this,

Now this,

Now this.

You probably know people that go on holiday and they,

You know,

They visit a new country or a new part of the world and they've got this full itinerary of go,

Go,

Go,

Go,

Go,

Go,

Go.

You know,

I have to visit every site in this city and then get to the next city.

And then,

You know,

Just reading their itinerary makes me exhausted.

I can't imagine what it's like to actually do that.

So if it's the destination mindset,

You know,

And then it's like,

Wow,

How was that?

Well,

I didn't have time to actually reflect on it.

We take a moment and just look at how the journey itself can be as if not more rewarding.

It might help us.

Going back to your point about values,

It might help us shift our values toward the destiny,

Toward the journey as compared to the destination.

Yeah,

I think it's seeing the destination and the journey,

Right?

Like it's in my family,

My husband's Italian and they will,

They'll start talking about what they're having for dinner at lunch,

You know,

And then you're eating dinner and they're talking about what's going on for dessert,

Right?

And it's like,

Wait a minute,

Hold on.

Can we just be in the lunch before we move on to dinner?

And but that's also part of it is,

Is what I'm trying to do more of.

And this actually is like hard to do,

But is savoring the feelings of completion in the here and now.

Like rather than having my to-do list,

Having a,

What did I complete today list?

And it's different.

So like a to-do list is this never ending.

It will never,

There's always more.

There is laundry being dirtied as I speak when my children are at school,

Right?

So there,

It's never going to end.

But my completion list,

When my completion list lines up with my values,

I can say things like,

Wow,

I was really present when my kids walked in the door from school today.

And that's on my values list of something that I want to be growing in my life is being more present with my family.

Or I took a break at lunch and I did some movement.

I can put that on my completion list.

So those types of things that aren't productive in anyone else's eyes,

But for me feel like a sense of being in the journey of my life and is satisfying.

And at the end of,

At the end of my life,

When I look back on it,

Will probably be the things that felt the most meaningful to me than like writing enough blog posts and newsletters.

Painful.

Yeah.

Okay.

So being in the journey.

Any other tips as we wind up this session on productivity anxiety?

Well,

I would say just zooming in on both the journey and bringing that together with the reward.

You know,

How does it feel?

You know,

Can we look at the qualitative difference between say the journey and the destination and see,

You know,

Is there one that has that electric driven quality to it?

And is there one that helps us find that space between the rocks where there's just an ease in the doing?

So kind of being with ourselves,

Being in the experience like you're talking about,

Being present.

How does that feel itself?

So that's the one other thing I would say to help concretize that.

Like how can we make this pragmatic for anyone that wants to explore this themselves?

And especially the Amazon reviewer,

Because that's what she wants.

What are the three steps,

Judd?

Right.

Which in itself is productivity anxiety,

Right?

We need everything to be boiled down to three steps for us,

But that's good.

Yeah.

Okay.

Well,

Thank you.

I think that this is helpful for folks that are starting to just,

I don't know,

Like we can look at our lives a little bit differently maybe than the way that we've been.

We've just kind of all gotten caught up in this wave of doing more,

But feeling like we're not doing enough.

And that's just a really unhappy place to be in.

So hopefully this will shift some people's ideas around it as well.

So thank you.

Yes.

May it be so.

In this episode,

We talked about how to be in the journey of your life rather than so focused on the destination.

And part of that is awareness.

Noticing when you are caught up in this type of productivity anxiety,

Shifting your energy and your attention and your behavior to something that is more satisfying.

If you've read a liberated mind by Stephen Hayes,

You'll see that it walks you through these six core processes of act that we've been talking about on the show.

Being present,

Practicing acceptance,

Knowing your values,

Diffusing your thoughts,

Stepping back from yourself stories and taking committed action towards your values.

But there's also something else in Stephen Hayes's work and act that I think is really linked to our productivity anxiety and our striving.

And that is what he calls our core yearnings.

Core yearnings that all humans have that can get misdirected.

And when we're looking at something like productivity anxiety,

I think a part of that is that our core yearnings have gone sideways.

So for example,

We all have a core yearning to belong,

Not just to fit in,

But actually to have a sense of I belong here.

I matter.

I am part of this.

And when we are caught in productivity anxiety,

Sometimes we're striving so hard to fit in.

We're doing so much to keep up with the Joneses and belong.

We forget that we already do belong.

We are already good and we are already enough.

So the first practice that I want you to do this week to help you with your productivity anxiety is to recognize and download that your worth is not dependent upon what you do.

You are worthy as you are.

Sometimes I'll do a short mantra of just,

I have done enough.

I have enough.

I am enough.

A second core yearning is that we have a yearning to have a sense of orientation in the world.

Even when we're in productivity anxiety,

We're forward moving.

We're never in the present moment.

We're always thinking about the next moment and this yearning for orientation can send us out into the future,

Trying to get someplace that we're supposed to go.

So the second practice that I want you to do is to practice being in the here and now in your life,

Orienting yourself in the now in the journey,

As Dr.

Judd would say,

Not just the destination.

And the way that you can practice that is by starting up a mindfulness practice.

You can try out my one eye in and one eye out practice on Insight Timer.

I have a nice little 10 minute mindfulness practice there,

Or just paying attention to breath inside of your body,

Landing you in the here and now.

The third yearning that I want to talk about with productivity anxiety has to do with a yearning for competence.

We all have a yearning for mastery to feel like we are growing and we are learning and we are achieving things that is wonderful.

And it's human to have this yearning for competence,

But it can get misdirected too when we're caught up in productivity anxiety and unhealthy forms of striving because we get so focused on our task lists and to do's and trying to achieve.

We don't take rests,

Which actually could impair our performance,

Or we keep on moving our finish line out and we never feel a sense that we've gotten anywhere or we've accomplished anything.

So the third practice I would like for you to do this week has to do with acknowledging and feeling a sense of competence,

Those rocks in your jar,

Paying attention to the times when you have completed tasks that are aligned with your values.

You've taken that task and you've put it into your jar so that you have a bit of a completion list as opposed to a to-do list.

What have you put in your jar today that gives you a sense of mastery and competence and a feeling that you are lining up your life with the type of person you want to be in the world?

Sometimes those things are not always what other people would applaud you for and some of them are quite simple.

So those are your three tasks.

One,

Cultivate a sense of belonging and worth independent of your achievements.

Two,

Be present here and now.

And three,

Acknowledge the mastery that you build as you build it,

The completion and the competence.

Let's do these things together over the next few weeks.

I look forward to seeing you when we come back.

I'm going to drop a little bonus episode,

I think tomorrow,

And I'll let you know a sneak peek of who's going to be on the air and a few more tips about rest.

And thank you so much.

I really appreciate you taking your time with me here.

It's been a lot of work and really worthwhile.

Thank you so much for listening to this episode of Your Life in Process.

When you enter your life in process,

When you become psychologically flexible,

You become free.

If you liked this episode or think it would be helpful to somebody,

Please leave a review over at podchaser.

Com.

And if you have any questions,

You can leave them for me by phone at 805-457-2776 or send me a voicemail by email at podcast at yourlifemprocess.

Com.

I want to thank my team,

Craig,

Angela Stubbs,

Ashley Hyatt,

Abby Deal,

And thank you to Ben Gold at Bell and Branch for his original music.

This podcast is for informational and entertainment purposes only,

And it's not meant to be a substitute for mental health treatment.

Reviews

What a beautiful discussion on our deeper motivations this talk was. I will definitely be sharing this with my husband, who struggles with this issue. Thank you!

Really good thoughts to start my Sunday. I've changed my programme for the day and am going to enjoy some rest! Thank you 😊

This is great. I look forward to listening to other episodes. Thank you!