Nawong Kechog, Tibetan Monk, The Path Of Buddhism

A fascinating interview with first Tibetan Grammy Nominee Nawang,the most renowned Tibetan flutist in the world. He has won multiple Nawang awards. He has opened for HH Dalai Lama over a dozen times, Playing for thousands of people. He has worked with Richard Gere performing with many famous musicians. I talk about his retreat in a cave for 4 years and the way he brings it into his life now

Transcript

Longest-running talk show. I've been 33 years I've been doing this and I've been blessed to know Tom Venditti for about 25 maybe of those years? At least, Yes. Yes, And it's so good to see you here, Tom. Thank you. You bring blessings. You bring the blessed Nuong Ke Chog. Ke Chog. Thank you. And it's so good to see Nuong. It's been a couple of years since you last brought Nuong. Yes, It's when he played with Keola Beamer for a fundraiser and it was a wonderful experience. We're really looking forward to this upcoming concert at Pro Arts which will be happening this Friday at 7. 30 p. M. And it's going to be a very special night. Nuong, We're going to be talking the whole hour about his amazing, Kind of mystical journey. Quite an amazing journey, Nuong, From being born in Tibet to then spending time with His Holiness and actually about nine years in a cave amidst all of that and then becoming an amazing flautist and becoming friends with His Holiness and getting to play at the Carnegie Hall and we talked about the Tibet House and many fundraisers with Richard Gere and actually getting a chance to play at some of the big concerts and knowing people like, As he played with Laurie Anderson, Paul Winner, Philip Ellis and many others. What an amazing life and it was such an amazing life that actually you're going to be having a movie that was done about you showed on Thursday as a fundraiser on Thursday and that will be at Pro Arts as well. Yes, That will be at 7 o'clock. So it's a wonderful movie and again it talks about your extraordinary life, Nuong, And I encourage people to see it because it's fascinating. It is and I have to say I was blessed to be able to see Nuong play last time he was here and it's, You know what is interesting about you, Nuong, You actually don't separate your story and your playing a flute and you intersperse, I have you on Facebook Live, You intersperse your story, Which is an amazing story, With your flute playing and your flute playing makes me feel, When I hear you play flute, I feel like I'm in the mountains. I feel like I, And I'm a mountain person and Tom Bendetti is definitely a mountain person. He's Mr. Mountain Calls with so many amazing documentaries about mountains, Right? Mount Kailash too and other great mountains that you've been to and actually on Friday night you will be doing the world premiere of your latest film. Yes, It's Himalayan Prayer for World Peace and it will be the actual premiere. Yes. So that will start the show out with that, Then Nuong will come out and perform his concert and then we'll show another short film called Super Monk. And I have, Tom was nice enough to give me a couple of tickets to go to the Friday performance with Nuong and the world premiere that Tom is doing. And our good friend, Gary Forsberg, Is out there and he has the tickets in his hot little hands. You can call 808-244-9533. I hope that's the right number. 808-244-9533. This is quite a nice gift for someone to be able to see this. I'll see if the phone's lighting up if that's the right number. Gary, Is that the right number? 244-9533? I think you'll tell me if it's not. 808-244-9533 for the tickets for tomorrow night to be able to see Nuong and Tom there at Pro Arts. It's proartsmaui. Org. So we're going to get into. . . Tomorrow? No. No, It's Friday. Friday. Friday, Yeah. Thursday and Friday. Thursday. But the concert's Friday. Absolutely. So we're going to talk about your story. You have. . . Everyone's movie of their life is rather interesting. I've never been able to figure out where the karma and the dharma and all that makes to create such an interesting life as you have had. I'm sure you've probably reflected on what created your interesting life story. You were born at an auspicious time, But it was also the worst of times, The best of times, Maybe the worst for Tibet. You were born right as Tibet was being taken over by the Chinese. And you realized pretty quickly that it was time to leave Tibet. Did your mother or your whole family leave Tibet? Did you all leave or just a couple of you? My immediate family, My dad, Mom, My sisters, And my grandparents, We were able to leave. And actually, I may add something here. That is a Tibetan Lama came from Ando region where His Holiness Dalai Lama was born. So this Lama end up staying at. . . He went all the way Ando. You're talking about thousand miles. Prostrating on the ground all the way to Lhasa where His Holiness Dalai Lama and Potala Palace exists. So this Lama went all the way to Lhasa prostrating, Throwing himself on the ground all the way from Ando to Lhasa. And then on the way back, Somehow he stopped at my parents' nomadic tent. We don't have a house, Nomadic tents. So he end up staying with my parents. And then I was two, Three. . . No, No, No, Not two, Three, Maybe one or two years old, Somewhere there. So he gave me a name and blessed me. And my sister, He gave name Sonam Dhamma and he gave me Sonam Nabu. So anyway, Why I was talking about that? I'm just curious, Nabu isn't Nwong. So no, No, Actually he predicted my father. That's what I'm saying. He predicted my family that do not attach to anything, Not to your land, Your relatives or your wealth, Anything, But leave. Go toward Lhasa, Capital of Tibet, Then to India. The time is going to be very bad. So my father totally believed to him and asked him, Where are you going to go? He said, I'm going to go to Beiyu, Means like Shangri-La. Be means hidden. Yu means land, Hidden land. That's like Shangri-La. Is that like Shangri-La? Yeah, Yeah. Hidden land. Ordinary people cannot see it. Right. But only. . . Is that like, Also like Shambhala? Yeah, Shambhala kind of. Shangri-La is the best here because the Shangri-La movie really that portrays the Shangri-La very well. Yes. So anyway, Then my father decided to leave. Yeah. Even my mom was kind of blackmailing him because of the relatives telling her to stop him. Yeah. So my mom said, Well, Son, I'm not leaving. I'm going to stay with the relatives. And my dad said, OK, Mom, If that's really what you want, Then I will leave enough wealth for you to take care. And I'm going to go. I am going to leave. Yeah. And my mom, Grandmother realized that this son is not going to listen this time. So she said, No, No, I'm going with you. So then my mom also left with her dad. So then came to Lhasa and then gradually came to Tseri, The second place to border to India. It's a long journey from what I've heard. Long, Long journey. Yeah. And a hard one. Hard one. Over the high mountains. And yeah. But because of the prediction of this Lama. Yeah, You believed Lama Sangsim, Sangsim. So because of him, He my dad left and it changed your life. Changed my life totally. Yeah. And whatever I am enjoying the freedom, The most beautiful country in the world, America. I live here. You live in Colorado, Colorado. And yeah. So play music all around the world. How did you land up going to Dharmasala and meeting his holiness? That was I end up going to Dharmasala because of I had a great hope I get an audience with his holiness Dalai Lama. Yeah. And so his personal secretary, Tibetan secretary, Then called Tara La. He arranged to be that and his holiness gave me audience. So I end up able to see his holiness to give me advice for my spiritual future. Did you do the retreat in the cave after you met his holiness? Yeah. Before, After you met. After. Did you tell him or did he tell you how did that happen? Where you land up deciding to go and retreat in a cave for that long? Well, So I end up seeing his holiness and I asked him to give me advice. So for spiritual practice. So there is a great one Lama Lathir Rinpoche. He said, You study with Lathir Rinpoche. He will teach you. And then of course, I can end up getting teaching from him. And then there's another very renowned hermit meditator in the mountain, Geng Yishit of then. So I end up getting teaching from him. So then I end up living in the mountain, Dharmasala mountain. For how long? That's four years, Altogether four years. When you're sitting there by yourself in the mountain, You're not watching TV. You're not watching no internet. No, No. I was asking you if you played your flute and I was shocked, Kind of surprised because I think a flute is very meditative but you said you weren't, Wouldn't be allowed as a monk to play a flute or an instrument. So are you just sitting and meditating all day and all night for four years? Basically, Unless I was studying my scriptures, Then of course, I'm studying from the teacher or I'm contemplating about the, Because this is how it works in Tibetan Buddhism. You study from a Lama or you study from a scripture and then you learn something. But that's the first wisdom, Learning. Second, There's three stages. Second is you, What you learned, You examine about the meaning of that. You totally clarify that. And you clarify that, Clarify that by pondering it and being just experiencing it. Exactly. Then you make sure that's what it meaning is, Like transitory nature of life. So this is very important, What you just said. And I'd like to kind of go over this in case people missed it, Because this is a key that I have found from meditating every day of my life since I've been 13. You can read and read and read, But it is not just the reading. It's how you interpret, Interpret it and how you digest it, Then how you understand it and then how you live it. And if you just read it doesn't do any good. I mean, It's there, But it's how you, And this is exactly what you were doing. You were reading, But then you were pondering and you were dwelling with it and then. . . Making sure of the meaning. Yeah, Yeah. That's the second stage of the wisdom. Now the final stage of the third, Final stage of the wisdom is then you make that as your second nature, Like the gymnast. Okay. How they can jump around and ponder. Without thinking. It just comes naturally at that point. Then at a certain time, That becomes your second nature and you can just totally do these amazing things, What the gymnasts do in the Olympic. Okay, I'm going to use this as an example here, Because this is the next stage, I think. I've been thinking about this a lot myself. Okay, We'll use for example, I don't know if you heard about the basketball player who went to Russia and she got imprisoned. Now, Is second nature, She's a basketball player, She's there. All of a sudden she's thrown in jail. That's something you can't practice for. That's something you would never imagine would happen. In our lives, Sometimes we think we have something down and something changes and you have to really figure out how to live it in different circumstances. Did you find that's what happened to you and why you left the cave finally? I mean, How was it having all that experience and understanding and second nature in the cave versus coming out of the cave four years later and living it first in India and then around the world? I didn't get the full point. How you live that in other circumstances besides being in the cave? Okay, Okay, I got it. Okay, You're thinking of something I can tell what he's thinking of right now. I'm psychic. I know what he's thinking of what happened. How did you walk your talk? So for instance, Like when you meditating in the mountain, You because you want to create a rainbow CD, Right? Yes, Rainbows are beautiful. The rainbow is very beautiful. But at the same time, Rainbow can represent two things. Yes. One thing is transitory nature of life. Yes. How maybe beautiful it is, But it exists due to cause and condition. Yes. So therefore it will change for sure it will change. And it comes with the dark clouds and the rain. Whatever, You know, It will change. That's for sure. Yes. But the other side of the same coin is the beauty because of the cause and condition. Such a beautiful such as such, Such a phenomena called rainbow, Beautiful rainbow can be created because of it depends on its cause and condition. So the cause and condition has two side. One is its impermanence. It will bound to be transitory. But at the same time, You can create such a beautiful phenomena as a rainbow because it depends on its cause and condition and the sun and this cause and coming out through the rain. Exactly. Yeah. This the cause and condition is there. That means then you can create the rainbow. Yes. And it's never the same. So your question. Yes. For me, As a monk, I've been meditating about the transitory nature of the beauty of a beautiful lady. So I'm giving my wow. No, No one don't get too attracted. But when the reality hits me, It's very difficult. Yes. Then I end up attracted to beautiful ladies. I still do, Actually. But I keep my wow is a married person. Now is a different thing. I can make love with my sweetheart, My wife, But not with everybody. OK. All the beautiful ladies. But when I disrobe, I mean, When I left the mountain, Then I attracted to lady. When you are a monk, You're not allowed to have sex. Yes. So you celibate. But I kept that for 11 years. So I asked my American friends, Can you be celibate for one year? Most of them said no way. You know, So I kept celibate for 11 years. So I say myself these days. OK, Not too bad. I kept 11 years as a celibate monk. But before, When I was a monk, When you disrobe means it's such a embarrassment. I was so ashamed that I couldn't complete my monkhood for my whole life. Right? Well, Not well, In Eastern philosophy, In Western, I've studied as a Zen Buddhist. And I think I took my precepts in 1986, And they wanted me to wear a robe. And I said, Well, What would happen when I take my robe off? Who will I be without my robe? I said, I'm the same person. I'm the same person, Whether I'm wearing a robe or not wearing a robe. And so a robe should not make a difference on who I am. And I don't know if you really do change, Except, You know, There are rules for reasons. Some of them are very old rules. I still meditate every day. I don't wear a robe. And I follow the path as much, Maybe more than some people who are wearing robes, Because it's because I'm doing it from inside, Not because I'm told to be doing it. And you're doing what you're doing to share and help raise funds for His Holiness and to bring awareness through your teachings and talks. And you don't have a robe on, But you're still you. Yep. So whether I am a, Well, First monk, When you become monk, Buddha, The Buddha Shakyamuni, Who created the Buddhism tradition, Buddhist tradition. So he came up with this idea that who want to be monk, Okay, Then you will shave your head, Dress like this monk dress and keep these vows for whole life or for three month or three year or 10 year, You can do that. But there's a true tradition. One tradition you once you take the vow, You remain as a monk for whole life. Yeah. But one tradition, You can like Thailand's, Yeah, This monks, They can have a three month as a monk, Three years as a monk, Or they don't have a whole life. Yeah. So it's a different true tradition there. So, It's an important question because this is going on in the Catholic Church as well. We can see what happened in the Catholic Church when the rules were made and it created some problems for people who wanted to maybe break their vows, But not wanting to tell people they broke their vows. So it's a huge question. I'm glad you brought it up. I think you need to play a song about it. We have a second mic up here. I think we need the song of the vow taker and the vow breaker and the still monk, Nuong Kachog. And I promised I'd give away another pair of tickets and Gary's waiting out there. You can see Nuong playing and actually see the world premiere of Thomas Venditti's movie this Friday at Pro Arts. And these are wonderful tickets. They're good seats. Call 808-244-9533. This is the last pair of tickets I have. 808-244-9533. 808-244-9533. And we'll listen to Nuong play his special song. Monk or not monk? To monk or not monk? Beautiful. See now that was heavenly. I have to follow that up with the follow up question, Which I do want to remind people we're listening to Nuong Kachog. Awakening Kindness is a book that is a beautiful book that he has. With a foreword by none other than His Holiness the Dalai Lama. And when you know people like Nuong does, You also have other wonderful people who made little comments here in your book. Archbishop Desmond Tutu wrote in the foreword. You also had Michael Beckwith, Agape, And so many amazing people who gave little comments here about this amazing Richard Gere, Your buddy Richard Gere, And the one and only Robert Thurman, Who's still doing fabulous teachings to the Tibet House in Menla and doing wonderful work. So Awakening Kindness, Finding Joy Through Compassion for Others, A wonderful book. And his book is not all he has on his site, Nuongkachog. Com, Tibetan Dream Journey, N-A-W-A-N-G-K-H-E-C-H-O-G. I wanted to talk to you about His Holiness because, Okay, You went to His Holiness and you did your dedication and you said, Yes, I'll become the monk. And then what happened when you went back after you left being a monk? After I left my monkhood? After you left your monkhood. I ran away. I ran away from Dharamsala where His Holiness lived. So I ran away and I was so ashamed of myself. I couldn't remain as a monk and a hermit meditator, Same time. So I ran away and I stayed for, At the time of, I had no idea, But I ended up in Goa, Where the paradise of hippie. You know, Goa. And they all ran away as well. They all ran away from the Western life. So anyway, I met so many hippies. And so that was my first really meeting with Westerners. And they were so open and very easy to converse with them. And my English wasn't good, But I was learning. And so I had many wonderful chats with the different people I met. And they gave me a lot of insight for my life. And then I shared them about my Dharma, My spiritual learning, And my life background to them. So it was a nice exchange with the Westerners. And a lot of the so-called hippie, But they are called hippie, But they basically exploring different reality in life, Not only the eight to five regular job and all this, What we do in the modern life. It was called at that time, Turn In, Tune Out. Turn In and Tune Out. Isn't that it? Tune In, Turn Out. Something like that. But they were, They were going in and it was a movement where the only thing that I'd like to say about that is a lot of people in America thought if they went to maybe Goa or they went to India, That they could find enlightenment or they could find a truth that would change their life. And many of them went thinking just finding a guru would do that. And most of them didn't find, Some did, But most of them didn't find a guru that would do that. And most of them came back and had to deal with reality again. And sometimes that reality was different than what they imagined when before they went. Yes, They might've been changed to a degree. But Tom Venditti actually knows about a film about a place in Kauai that was like that. Taylor Camp where the hippies went and then it all kind of fell apart eventually. But it is an interesting thing because still this is the path. So what do you do? Again, It's like taking for them, You went and you take off your robe again, But does that mean you stop your path? You don't, To me, I don't think you stop your path unless you want to stop your path. You still just continue on. And so what led your path back to his holiness? Because you landed up becoming friends with him after all of this. Well, Whether I'm a shaved head and dressed in monk robe or not, But I have all this afflictive emotion, Anger, Greed, Just jealousy, Lust, And all this ignorance and all this defilements that the human mind has. And which Buddhism means basically bottom line is you tackle with these emotions and you free yourself from these afflictive emotion or you free yourself from this neurosis. That's all about. That's really what the bottom line is. But it's not an easy thing. It's not an easy thing. But whether I am dressed as a monk or not, I have to still follow the same path and to try to become better human being, Better being so that I have less anger, Less greed, Less jealousy, Less this different destructive emotion, This totally self cherishing mind only care about me, Me, Me, Me, Me, Me. Other than that, You care about others too. You care about of course yourself. At the same time you care about others. They also like you don't want suffering, Want happiness, Same, Totally same. So therefore you should love others while you love yourself. You care about yourself but at the same time you care about others. Which is His Holiness's main message. Yeah. So therefore I have to, Whether I'm a monk or not, I'm a hermit meditator or not, Wherever I am, I have to continue my deep practice. Namlong and I had a really interesting conversation about the whole concept of Aloha. Because again, He thought it was a hello, Goodbye type thing. But it's very similar to what you're talking about. Compassion, Love, And being aware of, Especially as a psychologist, We're always talking about how negative emotions affect you personally, How you can sabotage your happiness if you're in that negative mindset. Because it's all about perception, Right? It's the way you perceive things and the way you frame them in your mind. And you can look at any situation and go either direction really. Glass being half full or half empty, Right? But it's hard to do in our society. Yes. Does that make sense? Yeah. And it is very hard to do. And on top of that, It is something that comes out sooner or later if you're doing long term sitting in a retreat or a Zen center or Dharma center or Dharma sala. If you're sitting sooner or later, All of these things come up. I think every long sitting person should have a psychiatrist or psychologist on board. Because these, As you call them, Neuroses or whatever they may be, Sooner or later that other side of yourself that's buried will come up, Whether you're in a cave or whether you're in a retreat center or whether you're sitting at the beach for a long time looking at the ocean, Sooner or later this stuff will come up so you can release it, Right? And feeling guilty is just actually in a way a hindrance that you have to let go of along the way. So leading it back to the question, How did you get back past the guilt to His holiness? So basically, As I said, I live on the mountain or not, I'm dressed as a monk or not, But my neurotic emotion, My destructive emotion, They are still the same. So I have to deal with them and I have to satisfy with my wife. So I don't go around looking at who else I can have sex with or what do you call it? Well, That would cover a lot of bases right there. So right now I have a nice small home, But looking out that who else has a better house? So maybe I should have a better house, Bigger house, A better car, All this temptation. You stay away. So I try to stay away with them and the transitory nature of life. This is such a beautiful teaching. Buddha gave. Yes. Buddha actually came Siddhartha or the Shakyamuni Buddha. The guy came in India two thousand five hundred years ago. Actually, When he came, There was already a great theistic religion who believes God and God as a creator of the universe and all that in Hinduism. There is such a great religion called Brahma Hinduism. Brahma, Who created the whole world and all that. And Shiva one day will destroy everything when it's not needed or something like that. So there was already very complex and very, Very established theistic religion. So Buddha didn't need to create that. So what he did and what he experienced in his life is when he went out, He saw sickness. He said suffering, Suffering of sickness, Suffering of old age, Suffering of death. All this. He saw the different suffering of conflict, Emotional conflicts, All this. So he decided he want to find a way out of these human emotional sufferings. So he came up with the Four Noble Truths and then he taught the interdependent nature of everything. But first. Yeah. He had to finally get to the point where he decided he was really going to choose it, Not search anymore. He had to sit under that Bodhi tree and not move because I think we all have to make that final choice. It's like, Okay, I've done all this, Been there, Done that. I'm not going to move until I get it. I'm going to choose right now, Enlightenment. And I think it's always there for us to choose, But we tend to be afraid and do everything we can except that enlightenment and that beingness. Right. And then with the enlightenment, Same thing as Buddha did and the monks did, You have to come back and live it. And you have to, Even with the Buddha enlightened, But then had to come back and live it and teach it still. Even if you're enlightened, You have to. He didn't go to a cave after he got enlightened. He went out even more and dedicated himself to teaching. Right. So that's where it boiled down. And underneath the Bodhi tree, He figured out, He realized Buddha means one other word, Awakened. Awakened. You awaken from sleep of ignorance. Right. What is ignorance? Ignorance is we all have a ignorance of everything exists egocentrically. Maya. Maya or egocentric. There is something so solid and independent. But if you really go deep down, Look at deep, Deep with every reality, Everything is interdependent, Interconnected, Inter-awakened, I mean, What do you call it? Dependent arising, Everything. So therefore, The egocentric has no truth in that. So everything is false. It was an illusion that we thought everything is so independent, Egocentric reality. But the egocentric has no foundation at all. So you go beyond egocentric minded. That's when you become enlightened. You go beyond egocentric minded means you think you see everything is interdependent, Interconnected. I want you to play that. So, So therefore, Therefore, You find at ease, You become so compassionate to all beings. You become so loving to all beings. Will you play a little bit for us? Okay. We only have 10 minutes left and I want you to play some. Oh, 10 minutes? Only 10 minutes left. I was hoping there's another half an hour. No. I will play this beautiful little flute called ocarina. They say that ocarina is the origin of the flute. Folks, You can't see this, But it's very, Very small. It's about two inches by two inches. Made out of clay. Yeah. Yay. See, Now that's mountain music to me. That's like when you go up there and you're in the higher peaks. We have, Of course, Our own Eyal Valley and Haleakala, As Tom knows well. I do want to mention now that again, Tom has been kind enough to do two special nights. The movie on Nuong's life, Which is beautifully done, And Keola Beamer's mother's story that Tom did, Both are showing on Thursday for only $5 at Pro Arts. Yes. Hawaiiana is at five o'clock and then The Sound of Tibetan Peace is at seven o'clock. Nuong will be there to answer questions about what is the meaning of life. Yeah, There will be a Q&A after that for both films. Keola Beamer will be there and Moana, Myself, And Nuong after his show at 7 p. M. And then the special concert with Nuong will follow your premiere of your amazing movie that you did, The world premiere, When you went last year to Ladakh in Mustang and found this amazing ceremony that happened. Yes, It's called the Tiji Festival and it's literally the World Peace Festival in Upper New Mustang is near Tibet, Right near the border. So it's again in that part of the world that we're really celebrating that upcoming event. And then looking forward to it. Nuong will play. When you play Nuong, Do you know in advance what you're going to play? Do you set like, I mean, You know, I mean, I know a lot of musicians have set lists. Do you have a set list of knowing what you're going to play when you play something like this or does it just come to you? I may have a, Like a kind of map in a way, Like, OK, Maybe I will play this, This instrument. I may do a chanting, You know, That kind of thing. But some songs, Maybe I will play something I have learned myself to play certain songs. So I may play some songs like that. But sometimes, Some songs, I have really no idea what will come. I like those the best. Yeah. So improv. Yeah, It's good. That's what, You know, A lot of what Paul Horn did. So, So going back to His Holiness the Dalai Lama, I believe he's 87 years old now. Yeah. And I couldn't help but reflect when you were talking about at some point, I think it was about 10 years ago, He was asked, You know, What he wanted to do with his life. And he said, I want to become, I want to go in retreat. I just want to have time as a monk in retreat away from everything. And that never happened. He, You know, I think it ties in with what you were saying, You know, What Buddha experienced. I mean, If you have this and you feel a need to share it, Of course, And that kind of was his destiny in life. He often said, And I'm sure because you were there many, Many, Many of his talks, That I'm just a humble monk, Right? Yeah. You got to play with him. And New York, I believe it was an outdoor talk he was doing. And I said, In Central Park, There were how many people there? I would say 100, 000 people, You know. So I had the great honor to do the opening for that. And actually, Solinnes was supposed to teach eight verses of mind training. It's an official teaching about how to train your heart and mind to become more loving, Kind, Compassionate person. But somehow he dropped that. Really. I'm not surprised. He improvised. He just spoke from his heart. Yeah. Very down to earth, The benefit of loving kindness, Compassion, And which he does most of his public talk. Now, But just to be what I observe, I've only heard him talk about four or five times, Different talks. There's two levels, Just like with yours. There is that, Always the wonderful talks that everyone can relate to and loves and why he got the Nobel Peace Prize about peace and happiness and so many books on that. But a lot of people don't realize that he does do very deep initiations and trainings on very deep levels as well. Not as much, But there was many, Many years where he would do the public talk for everyone, But then he would have the higher level. You know this, Tom, Right? You had a chance to meet him and talk to him. I don't think you mentioned something very interesting to me before we started talking here about why he liked your flute playing. And I'd never heard this before. I mean, We know a lot about his incarnations and it's an amazing story how he was found as a young child and to be the next incarnation. But you said he loved your flute playing because he believed he was incarnated from Krishna at one point and he was very attuned and loving the sound of the flute. Well, It was a Bangalore, India's big city. There was a Dalai Lama institution. It's called the Dalai Lama's institution, Institute. So there he was giving a talk and some young people asked him some questions. And then this is first time ever I heard his story. This talk about maybe one of his previous incarnation was Krishna. So I was thinking like, Wow, This is amazing. You know? Yeah. So then later I was thinking myself that I'm known as a Tibetan flautist. As a Krishna is known as a flute god. You know, Something like that. God who plays flute. Yeah. So anyway, Then I was thinking that that I had to open it for his holiness, The Dalai Lama's public talk so many times, At least a dozen times I can remember that all around the world I have to play flute. So I thought there was some connection there. And you laugh like him there. Well, We only have a minute left and I have to say what an amazing time to be able to spend with you, Namong. Really beautiful, Beautiful conversation. And I have to thank you, Tom. Dr. Tom Venditti has done so many wonderful movies and I can't wait to see this next one because I haven't seen it yet. I talked to you before you went on the trip. I talked to you after you came back from the trip, But I have yet to see the movie. And there's lots and lots of editing and work that you put yourself into this. And I'm so glad you invited Namong back. It's been years. It's my pleasure. And it's really a treat. There are people out there that know about Namong because they may have seen him open for his holiness. And there are people out there that may have never heard about Namong at all. But I did have the blessing to hear you play. And it is like an amazing experience that you remember when you get to see Namong play. You feel that energy and that purity and that honesty that comes through from his practice that he's devoted his life to. So I just have to say thank you, Namong. Thank you, Cindy. And thank you, Tom and Nancy, Both of you, For inviting me, Hosting at your beautiful house and taking me to Hawaii, Honolulu, And having a beautiful, Wonderful time. Thank you so much. Aloha. You're quite welcome.

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Beautiful interview Cindy! And that flute playing!! Magnificently moving. I’ll look him up for more! Thanks so much. 🪬🙏🦋