A Conversation About Befriending Anger

Anger is an emotion that runs deep and has something to say- and it was powerful to connect with Nuria and to dive into her story of how she confronted her anger took back control of her life and learned to love parts of herself that she hadn't before.

What an awesome lady! We had so much fun connecting to this was really a delight all the way through, even though we did hit some intense themes a few times, like inherited trauma, spanking, the pain of suppressed emotions, and unhealthy spiritual cords to children. We talked a bit about her transformative experiences in Peru, and she shared a powerful lesson she learned about honoring ancestors and their struggles.
This is a conversation about acceptance, breaking energetic binds, and healing the land.

I am so honored and excited to share it with you.

Music by Penni Jo Blatterman and Darren Curtis Music, with permission.

Transcript

It's pretty much all the time I was angry.

I finally decided that I was going to confront this anger and I was going to say,

Hey,

What the heck's going on?

So I said,

Hey,

What is this?

Why am I,

You know,

Why am I always angry?

And my anger showed up to me as Furia,

The fire breathing dragon.

Hello and welcome to the Epic Kate podcast.

It is such a fun place here to dive into people's stories,

To hear about their transformation and to learn from them,

Take some snugget of wisdom and light into our lives and moving forward.

I'm happy to introduce to you Nuria.

She is such a fun and vibrant and enthusiastic person.

This episode is for people out there who struggle with their anger,

Struggle with their attachments that are causing them and their family's pain.

I really loved to hear about her experiences with shamanism,

With going to Central America and having experiences so far outside of the culture that she grew up in.

This is such a beautiful conversation about acceptance and breaking energetic holds and really,

Really accepting ourselves and loving ourselves for who we are.

So let's jump in.

Heartfelt conversations can change the world.

Here's the Epic Kate podcast.

Well,

Welcome,

Nuria.

Thank you so much for being here on my podcast and being willing to just open up and talk about your story.

Oh,

Thank you so much,

Katie.

I'm so happy to be here and talk and chat.

And do you like Katie or Kate?

I really go by both.

It's like more IRL in real life.

And Kate is like how I go on the Internet.

So kind of like,

Where do you know me from?

What do you feel like calling me?

I was getting Katie vibes,

So that's why.

I just like the sound of Epic Kate and just kind of ran with it and used it for everything.

Yes,

I love this.

Life is so full of beauty in the mundane.

And it's so much more fun to look for the epic and to look for the for the magical.

Yeah,

Most of life is what we would call mundane.

So if you can't find the magic in the mundane,

Then your life's going to be pretty boring.

Yeah,

Absolutely.

So what's your would you give us a little introduction of yourself,

A brief telling of who you are and what you do?

Yeah,

My name's Nuria.

Nuria means light.

I am a seeker of knowledge.

I am an essence here.

I'm a space holder.

I'm a vessel for healing.

I'm also a wife.

I have a loving husband that I've been married to for 16 years.

I am a mother.

I have three beautiful girls ages 20,

15 and nine that I've been mothering for a very long time.

And yeah,

I just love working with women who are going through that transition of my kids are getting older.

Now what?

Who am I now?

Maybe feeling a little bit of resentment or frustration or anger towards the person,

People that are around them internally,

The person that they've become and are ready to make a shift.

I love showing people how to use their emotions as wisdom and to find the gifts that each one of these emotions has in it an opportunity for us to grow into the person that we've always been.

Wow.

OK,

I got to say,

You must have spent so much time and so much rehearsing and so much soul seeking to to say all that,

Just that it flows out so easily.

Yeah,

I've not practiced and it sounds different every time I say,

Yeah,

We will have never heard me say that again.

But I realize that I'm such in the space of,

You know,

Moving from rage to sage that that it feels organic and good for me to to to speak about it.

And I think there was a time when I would have said,

Hi,

My name's Nuria.

You know,

I'm a data scientist.

I'm a mom.

I'm a wife.

And you wouldn't know anything about me.

So I really reshaped what it is to know me.

And I really want people to know who I am.

Yeah.

So the thing I take copious notes as I.

Yeah,

Especially yes.

And especially as things just like grab me.

So the thing that grabbed me that you said was essence seer.

What is that?

Yeah,

I love thank you so much for bringing that back up.

My gift is I see the absolute best in every person.

And I've never met a stranger,

Never met a stranger.

And so I absolutely love bringing that out in people and really allowing people to feel seen and heard and loved.

It's a blessing and a curse,

Because when you can see the absolute best in people,

It's hard to see the absolute worst,

You know.

And I had to work through that acceptance of just because you can see everyone's potential doesn't mean they have to be there now.

And you can love them for who they are right now.

And I did that for myself,

Too,

Just because I know who I truly can be doesn't mean I have to beat up on myself for not being there now.

So it the journey for me is that acceptance of I see the best in you and I accept who you are right now and I love you for who you are right now and everything and every version of yourself that got you to this person that you are right now.

Nice.

I felt that.

I don't always feel things like.

But when you said I see the absolute best in people,

I got tingles on my head.

I was just like confirmation of that.

So I'm really like jealous in a way of who can see things like can see auras,

Can see magical things.

Is that is that part of your gifting?

Do you do you like see the essence of people like in a sense?

Yeah,

I don't see it physically.

I mean,

I could call out a color and it probably is is right.

Like you're wearing blue.

And so it feels like to me that you are very much into your intuition and you've said the words a few times and really hearing something and then auditorily putting it out there.

And so I would just assume,

Oh,

Her throat is very open and this is how she communicates with the world.

And this is how she gives and receives information.

But for me,

It's when I'm really able to.

Sit into who someone is,

I feel it like when you were talking about,

Oh,

How you felt it in your head when I said that when I talked about Essency,

I'll start crying or my face will get red when I know I'm hitting into someone's trueness,

When I'm really tapping into,

You know,

Part of their essence,

I might cry.

I might it just I get very emotional.

Yeah.

Wow.

Do you see things about people that they don't see about themselves?

Yeah.

And for what?

My husband and one of my best friends,

They said that if you listen to Nuria,

She will have you sounded like a rock star.

She you know,

Like she will make it seem like you are the absolute best person on the planet Earth.

And it's and I thought it was like,

Oh,

Well,

That's obvious,

But it's not obvious to people this these amazing gifts that they're bringing.

And so I realize that that's part of my job is to remind you of how amazing you are.

And by doing that,

I just talk about what I see for you.

And like that's the energy that the world needs so much more of hyping each other up.

Yeah.

Yeah,

Absolutely.

Yeah.

Yeah.

So you we talked briefly before we hit record and you mentioned that you were a weird kid.

How does how does your weird kidness,

How did that become who you are now?

So I went through a period of.

Of people pleasing,

And it started at a fairly young age.

I was a child of the of the 80s.

I felt like I needed to please my parents so that I wouldn't get in trouble.

And and my beautiful parents,

I love my mother and my father.

My mother is one of the most creative people you'll ever meet.

My father calls her a butterfly.

I thought that was so endearing.

My father is like a sage and very wise and calm.

Growing up,

How it showed up for me during their child rearing age,

You know,

Stage was that I needed to please them so that they wouldn't get upset with me.

And if I please them,

I wouldn't get in trouble.

And I wanted to be perfect.

I didn't want to get in trouble for anything.

I thought I was this perfect kid.

So I started to change.

I started to change who I was so that I could be liked.

And so the the weird kid that used to do silly stuff,

You know,

Like run outside with my shoes on,

Of course,

That's that goes without saying,

Making,

You know,

Making wax,

You know,

Pies and and putting my tongue on the fridge and seeing if it would stay a freezer,

See if it was sticking.

It did.

And I never told my mom.

And like all this,

You know,

I don't know,

Just dance parties with myself.

I loved dancing.

I would just,

You know,

Completely not be myself when I was out of body.

When I would dance,

People told me I wasn't good at dancing.

So I stopped dancing,

You know.

I know.

So how it showed up to me for me is when I finally got to the point where.

I could no longer be who everybody else told me to be.

Because being that person was going to lose,

I was going to lose everything.

Very specifically,

There was one evening where I brought my daughter home from soccer practice and I text my husband and I said,

Hey,

Can you put the spaghetti on?

We're going to be really hungry when we get home.

Side note,

I'm the Snickers commercial when I get hungry.

OK,

So I turn into a fire breathing dragon.

All right.

So said,

Hey,

Can you do this?

I get home.

No spaghetti.

I completely lose it.

I mean,

Fumes are coming out of my head,

My arms.

Why isn't the food done?

And my husband says,

I didn't know you wanted me to do it.

I said,

You know,

It takes.

And he says,

I never received a shows his phone.

He hadn't received the text.

It hadn't gone through.

I said,

You should have known to do this.

You know,

I'm screaming.

Later that evening,

He tells me,

Look.

I didn't sign up for this.

I'm not going to put up with your screaming and yelling anymore.

You're going to have to choose because this is this is it for me and my kids,

Too,

Because this is detrimental to them.

You're screaming.

I don't like it.

Rightfully so.

Now I'm thinking.

This is what I'm thinking in my head,

Katie.

I do this,

This,

This and this.

You can put up with my screaming.

You know,

I'm perfect.

I'm perfect.

You can put up with a little bit of screaming.

But then he said,

That's your choice.

You know,

I said,

I stick with you,

You do these things and this things,

He says,

This is your choice.

And I thought,

Choice,

Really?

I had programmed in my mind that I didn't have a choice in anything.

You know that I couldn't leave.

I couldn't not scream.

I couldn't be myself.

I had no choice.

I had to be perfect.

And when he gave me this opportunity of choice,

I realized that I could make a choice.

So in that moment,

I chose when he gave me the ultimatum of.

Get rid of your anger or get rid of your family.

I chose me.

Hmm.

I chose me.

And so then I had to confront the anger and I had to sit with it and I had to be present.

So finally,

After realizing that I'm pretty much angry all the time,

I thought it was just every couple of months I go off,

You know,

It's pretty much all the time I was angry.

I finally decided that I was going to confront this anger and I was going to say,

Hey,

What the heck's going on?

So I said,

Hey,

What is this?

Why?

You know,

Why am I always angry?

And my anger showed up to me as Furia,

The fire breathing dragon.

Hmm.

And I said,

Furia,

Why are you always coming around ruining my life?

And she said,

Because you take care of everybody else and you don't take care of me.

She said,

You say yes to what everybody else wants and you say no to me.

You feed everyone else and yet you starve me.

Starve me.

This is what she says to me.

And I said,

How long has this been going on?

And she said,

Way back in your childhood again,

It started when I was young.

So then I decided I was going to start honoring her.

And when I honored her,

I honored my inner child.

And when I honored my inner child,

I started dancing again.

I was just started.

I wanted to ask,

Do you think part of that anger was coming from feeling that you had to suppress all the things?

Because in my vocabulary,

Weird is not a bad thing.

Weird is unique and special and colorful and beautiful.

So do you think that the anger came from suppressing all those beautiful things about yourself?

Absolutely.

Yeah.

My inner child was really mad that I couldn't wasn't doing all the things that I loved,

You know,

In a loving,

Fun way.

You know,

Like I go to the park with my kids,

But I didn't swing on those swings like I was about to fly off,

Go off and fly.

You know,

Like these things,

I just decided I wasn't worthy of doing them anymore,

That it wasn't important enough for me to do them.

Man,

It it kind of makes me think about stories that I've heard of,

Like LGBTQ people,

Like this one guy that I had on my pod that he started to go insane from suppressing his sexuality.

He was he was he was not in a good space because of pushing this pivotal part of himself down.

Because of all the cultural fear,

The religious fear,

The family fear.

Yes,

Absolutely.

When you say about worthy,

I felt the goosebumps again.

Worthy to do the things that you love to do.

Absolutely.

And I can't claim that I have gone through what anyone who is in the LGBTQIA plus community has gone through.

I can say that in my perspective,

Especially being a woman and being a black woman,

There have been so many things that made me feel like I had to stay in this box to be accepted.

And if I don't do it,

Everything that's in this box,

Then I'm not going to be culturally accepted into mainstream.

And so I just stopped doing the things that were organic and felt authentic to me.

Oh,

That's so interesting.

It makes me think about things I've heard about code switching.

Oh,

Oh,

Honey.

Yes,

Yes,

Yes.

And yes and yes and yes.

Now I don't even look,

I'm just full on me.

You're going to get me yesterday,

Tomorrow and today.

And it's going to be the same me.

Well,

I'm going to change because I evolve.

But yes,

Definitely.

Absolutely.

My best friend growing up was this gorgeous girl whose mom is a tiny little white Mormon lady.

And her dad is this big black Christian guy.

I know different kind of Christian,

Whatever.

And yeah,

We would always joke that she was,

You know,

Half cool because of her dad's side.

Yeah.

And half and half cool because of her mom's side.

That's the thing.

We've got to love all parts of ourselves,

You know?

Yeah.

And for me,

That's what it's been about,

Is loving all parts of me and really honoring all those parts of me.

So,

You know,

You'll catch me on a Thursday night.

Put my musical right before we got on here.

I played one of my favorite songs,

The Last Dragon.

And I'm dancing my,

You know,

You are the last dragon.

You possess the power of the glow.

So I'm just singing along.

I'm ready for The Last Dragon.

OK.

Yeah.

And watch the movie.

Get your entire life from Berry Gordy's The Last Dragon.

All right.

My entire life.

Entire life.

It is very,

Very good.

So one of my favorites.

Awesome.

So was there also a fear?

Were your parents like?

That's corporate.

I almost said capital punishment,

But that's not it.

Were they corporate punishment people,

Too?

Was there a physical like you got a spankings?

Yeah.

Yeah.

All that.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I'm a child of the 80s.

I know that I know there were people who were not.

But my parents,

That was that was the way they went.

And that's the way their parents went.

And that's what they knew.

And that's what they felt they had to do to protect me.

Mm hmm.

So I don't have any ill will.

I've accepted that I've moved on.

I have so much love for.

And also,

I always say everything's happening for you,

Not to you.

So that little girl had to go through that so that I could be of service to other people now.

And that's OK.

You know,

Very thankful for everything that that I went through.

But yeah,

Absolutely.

My mother was like she was the ruler.

You had to you fall in line.

Don't you know,

Emotions?

No.

Stop that crying.

You know,

That kind of thing.

So I suppressed my I used to.

Katie,

I used to think that it was a badge of honor to not cry.

And I and I said,

Oh,

I didn't cry for a whole year.

I remember I said this to my sister-in-law.

She said,

What?

And I said,

Yeah,

She's like,

I cried last week.

I don't I don't get this.

Really?

Like it's almost like a shit.

You cried last week.

Oh.

A year.

Yeah.

Your emotions must have just been so stuck and so stagnant.

And no.

And you said now you cry a lot.

Just connecting with what's real and other people.

So,

Yeah.

And a huge damn breaking the when you do,

You know,

Do you can you think of that moment of confronting you're not confronting,

Loving it and and all those emotions just kind of.

Hurricane,

Yeah,

Or whatever the right word would be there.

Huh?

Many moments.

I can't think of just one.

And and I want to say anger is a secondary emotion.

It overlays frustration,

Which probably overlays some sort of resentment,

Frustration,

And then there's,

You know,

Sadness.

So at the root of it,

I was just really sad.

And so it just feels powerful.

So it's easier to latch on to.

Oh,

Yeah.

I feel so powerful being able to yell and scream at people and make them feel little.

Yeah.

Or think that I can make them feel little.

So that that was what it was.

And I had I don't think healing is stagnant.

I don't think I'm healed.

I feel like it's a process,

Right?

And and I had a process just like a month ago where I I had a relationship in my life that was very challenging.

And I watched this video on Instagram and and it just tapped into what I needed to to release.

And I just started started bawling.

It was this video of this older brother and a younger brother.

And the and in this in this country's culture.

When you the first person you give your cake to on your birthday's person,

You love,

Yes,

The most.

And he gave that little cake to his brother and his brother just.

And I'm telling you,

I'm waterworks like sobbing.

And it just hit it just hit for me that it's possible for someone to love you that much.

And it's OK.

And you could accept it.

And even if they're not perfect and who you want them to be,

They can still love you that much.

And you can still love them.

Oh,

Gosh,

That video.

It's so amazing.

My heart.

I'm such a sucker for these things.

It's like,

You know,

People coming home.

Keep kids getting their first dog.

Like,

Yeah,

Oh,

Yeah.

Yes.

So that that was one of them.

But I've had a lot.

Some people,

When you just come into their presence,

I was I was in Peru and I met with a shaman woman.

And it was just being in her presence that allowed me to release.

And I just she says,

Why is it right?

Cry when they come around me?

I'm a happy person.

I'd love to hear more about that shaman journey,

Because like so fast being like I read it took me a while,

But I read.

Autobiography of a yogi.

Oh,

Yes.

Paramhansa Yogananda.

Yes.

It is so freaking cool.

Like I grew up evangelical Christian.

So it's so cool.

And you're post deconstructing out of fear and judgment and and all that stuff to hear like,

Whoa,

There's some really cool holy people out there that have done amazing things.

Yeah.

Tell me more.

Yes,

Yes,

Yes.

I know.

That's it.

I haven't read that book,

But I've learned a lot about about him.

I'm reading one of the I'm reading Patanjali's yoga sutras right now,

Or at least somebody's breakdown so that I can understand them,

Because I don't I couldn't I couldn't read it myself and know it.

Talk about intimidating.

Oh,

My goodness.

You have to read it a million times.

And I keep I'll just open the book up and I keep opening it up to the same page.

And I'm like,

All right,

What is there?

What is it?

And it actually is the one that it talks about anger.

So it's so beautiful that it it breaks it down in a really beautiful way.

But yeah,

I went to Peru last September.

I think I'm trying to remember.

Time is an illusion.

Yes,

Exactly.

Exactly,

Darling.

So I went to Peru,

I believe it was last September,

And I went by myself.

And this was the first time I went anywhere internationally by myself.

Ten days.

I started out in Machu Picchu.

Actually,

I went to a town called Urumbamba.

Urumbamba is a farming town.

They have they're in transition because the ice caps have melted.

And so they're not getting the water that they used to get from the mountains.

But they're stagnant.

The farmers don't want to migrate.

And there's just I feel like a migration is going to happen or is happening because of,

You know,

What's happening on the planet.

But it's sad because they are not moving and there is nothing for them to farm anymore.

So they're either going to have to change their professions or like,

I don't know.

Anyway,

But Urumbamba is a small farming town.

And I started out there most such heartfelt and beautiful people.

It was very interesting.

I'm going off on a tangent,

But it was very interesting because I like visiting cemeteries and their cemetery was said that,

You know,

It was kind of like visit the cemetery is really beautiful.

So I'll visit it.

And I was I was walking through the town.

I don't look like anybody in this town.

So they're kind of like,

Is this person in our town?

And they weren't very friendly,

Although they weren't rude.

But when I got to the cemetery,

You walk in a door and you go in.

Everybody was hello.

How are you?

You know,

They were not that,

You know,

They were speaking Spanish and they were greeting me and hello and very kind.

So it was like there was this holy space here.

And the cemetery was so beautiful because each relative that had a space there,

They had.

You know how people have dollhouses and you have like little miniature things in your dollhouse and they so let's say you were a seamstress,

They'd have a little sewing machine and they'd have some dresses,

Some little miniature dresses.

And so the box showed who you were.

If you were a drinker,

They'd have a little can of beer in there.

It was really beautiful how they honored their ancestors and just like paid homage to them.

And we're very much like,

Thank you.

And we're going to honor you.

But that's something I took away because I don't feel like we in the United States honor our ancestors the way they do in other places.

And honoring your ancestors is a way of releasing sadness and hurt and guilt and shame and letting go and being able to heal.

So I think that is pivotal to our healing as a nation is to really honor our ancestors and say,

Hey,

I know you did the best you could from where you were.

Thank you.

Let it let's let it go type thing.

Anyway,

Talk about magical from Urumbamba to Machu Picchu.

You take this train through this mountain and the train is it has a 360 degree view.

So you look up and you can see the mountains through the top of the train.

It's glass all around.

The train's glass all around.

And there's like a river that's running alongside and there's waterfalls.

And you're you're taking your journey to Machu Picchu.

And then as you get close to Machu Picchu,

The train stops and then you end up at this Machu Picchu.

So I get to Machu Picchu and I go to Machu Picchu.

It's absolutely amazing.

The the guide says,

Yeah,

We're going to go up that tall mountain over there.

And I'm like thinking he's joking.

This is a joke.

He's no,

We're not going to hike up that.

No way.

Yes,

We did hike up that mountain.

And it was insane.

I've never hiked up a mountain that it's called Huayna Picchu.

It's little mountain,

But it's really,

Really,

Really tall.

At the top of this mountain is where the shamans go.

Now they call it the astrological center,

But it was really where the shamans went.

And to be in that same place that the shamans of the Mayans were thousands of years ago was like.

Talk about magical.

Wow.

Did you just like did your hair stand on end being there being there?

Yeah,

I mean,

I touched the wall and I just sat in silence and I just allowed the spirit of that place to really be present.

And it's.

The air is different up there.

So like,

Did you get any messages or are they personal?

Uh,

Messages did I get?

I actually recorded the messages that I got,

But I can't even remember right now.

It was kind of like I remember that there were flies.

At the top of the mountain and the flies had a plant that they really loved.

And,

You know,

Here in the United States,

There are flies and they're around your food and they're bothering you and they're in the trash.

The flies actually have a plant.

Hmm.

And so it was that realization that even something that we think is dirty and yucky and,

Oh,

Maybe it just hasn't found its place.

Maybe it just hasn't found what allows it to thrive.

And so instead of being upset with someone because,

Oh,

What are they're saying this?

I don't like it.

They're doing it.

Maybe we just have to help them find what helps them to thrive.

Helps help them get them back to their purpose.

So that was a message that I received when I was up there.

That's a good one.

It really goes along so well with your it goes along so well with your passion to see the best in people that it's the plan like you're not broken.

You're just you're just in transition.

Yep,

Exactly.

Even the fly has a purpose.

So how did you discover your passion to help people that are in that transition of their children not really needing them in that same city?

Yeah,

I love how you said that,

Because as mothers,

You know,

We have these cords that we have with our children and they really should energetically go away around age,

Like 18 months,

You know,

And they should be able to go back to their 18 months,

Maybe even a little bit,

You know,

Three years.

They should be completely gone.

But we hang on to them,

Especially when there was trauma that happened when the child was young or when you were pregnant or something like that and feel like we have to keep this connection,

This physical,

You know,

You have an umbilical cord attached to your child.

And and so essentially the child gets older and you're still feeding them.

You're still feeding them this energy from this umbilical cord because you still feel like they need you.

Right.

And what happens is that you're not just feeding them the good stuff.

You're feeding them the crappy stuff,

Too.

You know,

You're feeding them your negativity,

Your sadness,

Your hurt,

Your sorrow,

All the things.

So part of my realization that I wanted to help women who are going through this transition and really getting back to or remembering or even reinventing themselves,

It's really a remembrance,

Was in in Costa Rica when I realized I needed to cut the cords with my own children,

That I had these unhealthy cords that I was connected to my children with.

And.

And so each one of them,

I physically and spiritually said,

You know,

I remember with my eldest,

I nursed her one last time on my breast and I said,

I've did I've done what I can.

I'm letting you go now.

And I and I cut the cord and I let her off because she couldn't fly.

She couldn't fly if she was attached to me.

So I cut her loose so that she could soar.

And if that meant she's going to fall the first time,

OK,

She can get back up.

She can fly.

So a part of me realizing that I wanted to do this with others is because I had seen it happen within myself and I saw the effects it had on my children.

And I saw that they said when I because I changed,

They knew they could change.

And I saw that my youngest one,

We went into Cabo one time and this lady,

She was really upset,

Screaming and stuff.

And we left and we had a little conversation with her because I told her a funny story,

The lady.

And she laughed a little bit.

She's really upset.

And we left the store and I said and I said,

I used to be like her.

And my and my my youngest daughter said,

Really,

Mommy?

And I said,

Yeah.

And my my middle daughter said,

You know,

Mommy used to be a full Karen.

And and we started laughing and and she said and I said,

I was that I would go in and I would scream and yell and be rude to,

You know,

People who were in public places and and,

You know,

Just just just not a nice person.

And but my youngest one doesn't remember that.

She doesn't remember.

So I can see how my healing has affected my children.

So this and I want that for others.

Yeah.

So this cord,

Is that the kind of thing that some kind of people with with the sight for spiritual things can see?

Did you feel it in your body when it was cut?

Yeah.

Oh,

Yeah.

I definitely felt it.

That was a big release for me.

I cried.

I could feel it like leaving my body and and letting letting it go.

Definitely.

I guess I will say that I'm a vessel for healing.

I feel that everyone has the ability to heal themselves.

I can help you get to that healing that you want.

But I'm not going to heal you.

You're going to heal yourself with with.

How do you how do people tell you how can people tell if they have this attachment to their kids that isn't healthy?

My mom used to have a sign up on the refrigerator that said,

If mommy happy,

Ain't nobody happy.

And so if your mood affects everybody in your home.

Right.

That that's a that's a telltale sign,

You know,

If you feel like you're going to hurt,

I'm going to hurt them if I do this,

If I say that or if I think that or,

You know,

Anything.

Using the words make,

I'm going to make them sad,

I'm going to make them upset,

Feels like you have a level of ownership over someone and we don't have ownership over our children.

Our children are their own beings.

You know,

They're their own humans.

So anything like that may feel like there may be some energetic holding going on.

Yeah,

Children not having the ability to make decisions without you,

You know,

Maybe giving them permission,

Like even down to letting them choose their own clothes when they're at that age.

Yeah.

And to be fair,

I I prided myself on choice,

Like I always gave my children choice in everything that they did.

So for me,

That wouldn't even be a marker because I that was something I always said you could do this or that you do this or that.

But for someone else,

It could be it could be a marker of,

You know,

There's an energetic connection there that that you're wanting to cut.

But.

Yeah,

I feel like,

You know,

If.

You feel that you can't let go or you don't want your child to leave,

I've never been away from my child for more than one day or stuff like that,

That that may feel like.

The relationship's more about you having them than them living and growing and thriving.

Do you think you had or do I imagine probably lots of people maybe still have an unhelpful attachments to their parents?

Yeah,

Yeah,

Yeah,

Yeah.

I was talking with someone and she had gone through a shamanic ceremony and what showed up for her was a lot of fear.

And the shaman said the fear was coming from something that happened when her when she was in utero with her mother.

Her mother had a lot of fear.

So it wasn't her own,

Wasn't her fear.

And she didn't know how to get rid of it.

So,

Yeah,

You can have things that are passed down.

I,

You know,

Everybody's entitled to believe what they want to believe.

But I feel that you can have energy passed down from from a parent,

Whether it be,

You know,

Fear of money,

Fear of loss,

Fear of making a mistake,

Whatever it is.

You know,

Fear of being hurt,

All these things,

Whether it be from the words that they use or the physical energy that's passed down.

The the age from zero to six months and even when you're in the womb,

That's when the root chakra is developed.

Oh,

The root chakra is like the like the body,

Like your,

You know,

Lowest area in your body above your knees.

So your torso,

Lowest area of your torso.

And and so,

You know,

When my dog,

She is a pit bull mix and she's a brindle.

She's really pretty.

She has fear issues.

And her mother died when she was two days old.

Now,

When a puppy is young,

The mother hovers over them with her shadow and the shadow creates safety.

So she never got that.

She never got her mother's shadow over her to create safety.

And notice,

Like when a mother breastfeeds,

You know,

You're hovering over or even holding a bottle,

You're hovering over.

It's like that level of safety and security is being given to the baby.

So people think,

Oh,

There's nothing that can happen between this.

Bless your heart.

There's nothing that can happen between those that that age.

There's a lot that can happen because that's when a when a infant is feeling like they are safe.

They are being their needs are being taken care of.

I'm fed.

I'm being loved.

My diaper is being changed.

I feel safe.

Yeah.

So lots of things,

The thing that came to mind as you were talking is the inherited trauma,

Like going back generations.

Yeah,

I have a friend who's also a YouTuber who his mom was definitely afraid of like white picket fences and what those that represented.

And he like felt that aversion to them that he'd never experienced that.

So,

Like,

What other things are we holding,

Holding ourselves back from from what we've experienced?

And I read a really,

Really powerful book.

That's what's it called?

Unsettling Truths,

The ongoing dehumanizing doctrine of discovery.

It's like how Americans took these promises to biblical Jews and applied them to themselves and applied that to,

You know,

Stealing people and all these other things that God has given us this bounty.

And there's a trauma not just in the African-American DNA,

But also in the people who perpetuated the abuse.

Yeah,

The trauma of hurting and owning.

Oh,

Oh,

Katie.

Now,

This is remember I said it's like tears for me.

It's very this is so hitting with me right now,

Because when I was in Peru,

We did what was called a Tomaskal and a Tomaskal is a sweat lodge.

And they call it like the the Mother Earth's womb.

And so I went in this Tomaskal and at one point in the Tomaskal,

You're supposed to basically release your ancestors of anything that had gone on.

And I felt in this moment that I wasn't just releasing my African-American ancestors.

I was releasing my European ancestors as well.

Most African-Americans have some level of European blood,

And that's why my skin is not as dark as someone that you would see at the equator.

And so it was so powerful to me.

I felt myself go back 200,

300 years ago,

And I said,

I forgive you.

It's OK,

I know you were just doing what you thought was best.

I forgive you to my ancestors.

Who are of European descent.

I forgive you,

It's OK.

You can let it go now.

That's what's so important on this American soil right now is for us to give acceptance and love to all of the ancestors and people who died for what they thought was a worthy cause.

And we wouldn't be where we are today,

Which is a really beautifully eccentric,

Colorful country,

Had we not gone through what we've gone through.

It's so important for us,

However,

To honor what has happened to us so that we can heal this land and move forward and really accept everybody for who they are.

Oh,

Gosh,

So powerful.

It's one of the most powerful things I've gone through.

It's so beautiful to know that that is a possibility and the language can be very harsh.

It can be like,

Don't be a victim,

Don't,

And toxic positivity and,

But it's like,

You have to,

People have to be ready to get to that place to tell their story.

Yeah.

Tell someone that their pain is fresh,

Like,

Just forgive,

Like that just feels like a knife in the back.

Yep,

Yep.

Oh,

Oh,

Yeah.

It took me a long time to get there,

A really,

Really long time.

I think for us now,

I think instead of us shaming people for ancestors that I have no control over and also recognizing the patterns that get passed down from generation to generation and how sad that must be.

And I think about presidents of the United States,

Which are mostly white men.

And I think I actually feel sad that or like a king.

It's kind of like when you have a king,

Right?

And you're like,

You were born and you have to be it.

What if you want to be a circus animal?

Like,

What if you don't want to be president of the United,

What if you don't want to run companies,

You know,

And to think that just because you were born white,

Now you're expected to be a CEO.

And if you're not,

You're nothing,

You know,

That is toxic because it says that you can only be a certain person based on your heritage and where you came from.

And if you're not that certain person,

You're not acceptable.

Did you did you watch Queen Charlotte on Bridgerton?

Oh,

Yeah.

Yeah,

I did.

I did.

Farmer,

Yes.

Farmer George.

Yeah.

It broke me.

It broke me.

Yep.

Yeah.

And that's kind of what we're living with here is all these expectations and.

Yeah,

It's toxic,

But we've got the tools to to change.

Yeah,

We do.

I love it.

But yeah,

This has been so wonderful.

Thank you so much for sharing so,

So deeply.

And I just I love it's going to be really powerful for people to hear this.

I feel like,

You know,

Barely scratched the surface like we can we can talk for another 12 hours based in increments.

But is there any last thing that you would like to say before we.

I want people to remember that you have choice.

Simple things like changing the word need to want or have to to to want to or choose to giving yourself permission.

Let's start giving ourselves permission to be who we are and to do and be in the places that are authentic to us and knowing that that's OK.

Yeah,

Somebody is not going to like it.

OK.

I would rather be loathed for being who I am than loved for being who I'm not.

That's Wayne Dyer.

Hmm.

Yeah,

And then we can honor our inner children and tame the beast.

There it is.

I love it is.

Oh,

Thank you.

So the way that I end my conversations is I give hugs.

So happy to have connected with you.

OK,

We'll talk again another time.

Yes.

Thank you so much.

So many blessings.

And I'm so happy I got to talk with you.

You have such an amazing spirit.

I love how young and vibrant you feel.

It's just very,

Very heartwarming and loving.

And you're easy to talk to.

Thank you so much.

Oh,

Thank you.